The manual is a bit flaky. Nothing happens on screen when I put a DCC fitted engine on the programming track. Should it? Or should I continue with the programming procedure? Also, how do I delete the two locos which are already there?

Yes, but you can’t program it there. I need to change the address

Please look at the software version of your CS 3. It is also possible that with the newest software version 1.3.1, you still cannot program the address yet. You have to wait for the next update. This was the answer from Maerklin, after one member asked about altering the mfx addresses. So it is documented in the CS 3 manual but not yet working.

Please be not surprised. Similar thing happened to me with the Software version 1.1.. I could not update my MS 2 to the newest software. Since software version 1.2 it is working perfectly.

What are you talking about ?
Elaboration (references) required!

This question was about DCC not mFX

The CS3 can configure a DCC decoder

I did not wrote, it is definitely not doing programming. I only pointed out that there is a possibility for a gap in the software. Please compare @Goofy's thread #7.

I read about Maerklin's answer in another community and only wanted to forward this information. But I cannot find this thread yet. Sorry, so I cannot tell you, if it is valid for a specific or all formats.

I also wrote about my own, personal experience with the CS 3 software in addition mentioning my software problems related to the version.

My remark is only a hint for further consideration and checking. This was also the reason, why I was asking about the software version at the beginning of my post.

If your CS 3 is working fine, it is wonderful and be happy. But why don't you tell us, as you achieved your CS 3 performance? What are you doing fore that?

You use the programming track as you always did. No changes to that, because only for mfx you do not need this track. For all other formats it is necessary, if you do not want to reprogram all your locos with the same digital address. Or to remove them all from your layout before you start programming. This has not to be done with mfx. Certainly an advantage of the mfx format.

Just this weekend I realized how useful mfx can be and is already. (I visited a train event and it was dreadful to get for all the various locos an own, individual, but necessary digital address. Because only the MM and DCC format was for an use possible. But most of the locos had the same MM or DCC address. The standard address as it was set up by the producer. For these a reprogramming on the programming track had to be done and needed endless time. With mfx, you just could have put the 20 locos - one after another recommended - on the track. Waiting for their automatic registration and let them run).

Working more and more with my CS 3 and the only Maerklin format mfx, it occurs more and more Maerklin introduced the format mfx not to achieve an international standard. For this they installed the multi protocol ability for its controller and articles.

Mfx shall make their customer's model railroad live easier. And indeed, it does! Because you do not need this programming track for mfx. Meanwhile you see the mfx format not only in their locos. They use it for further magnetic articles, which need a digital address, e.g. their signals, function decoders.

Example: the new decoder m83 black (60832) is now able to use the mfx format too. The old decoder m83 grey (60831) does not!

Not correct, why do you think POM stands for "Programming on Main"?

I will try and break out a couple of aspects that have been merged and made murky.

1) the programming track has (certainly had) a number of functions
- a) to write CVs to any/all decoders -
- - This is most logically done for an initial address setup.
- b) to read all DCC decoder CVs
- - MM decoders (or decoders in MM mode) can only be written to
- - DCC (non Railcom decoders) may be read but this requires that they are the only device on the programming track, as the controller sends a broadcast command with no address, and any decoder will respond
- c) restrict power
- - Today this is considered rather moot because of the need to support sound, but originally limiting the current meant that a badly installed decoder (crossed/shorted wires) might possibly be survived
- d) as an operational design of a controller , programming of bulk data items like firmware and sound is done using the programming track
- - while it would be possible with modern decoders to do this on the main track, the limitation is a pragmatic one as these functions are best done in a clean environment with a single device, rather than having to support the electrical noise and chatter on the main line

2) PoM = Programming on the Main Track is a DCC concept for
- a) making use of a known address to target a decoder
- b) is limited to write only
- c) because of the need to know the address before programming others, it is an operational design limitation that the one CV that cannot be programming this way is CV1 - the primary address

3) MM Register (CV) programming
- a) never designed for reading
- b) May be used in an environment that has static decodes (m83/m84) embedded in the layout and a controller without a specific programming track
- c) This is a device implementation whereby it will only respond to a programming command if the immediate prior command (normal switching) that it heard on the wire was for itself.

4) mFX or Railcom
- a) bidirectional by design
- b) require Controller (booster) support of the ability to read (listen) to someone else on the track

There is a lot more that can be said on this topic, but hopefully it has indicated that when you are asking about programming there are a number of important bits of information that you must also take into account
- is the decoder capable
- is the controller capable
- are you setting the decoder address, or another configuration aspect
- are you needing to read or is write only acceptable
- are you do advanced programming for sound uploads
- are you do advanced programming for decoder firmware update
- is the manual sufficient or do you have to read between the lines

- 1) Open the manual at page 12 (English) and locate the section "Editing Locomotive Settings" and the chapter "Reading the address on the Locomotive Decoder"
- 2) locate a pen to write in an errata ...
- 3) immediately below the heading, before the step that instructs you press the read button write ...

- If possible (address already know) turn the lights on to observe programming progress
! perform the following even if the loco/decoder is already on the programing track
- Press stop (stop light on) on the CS3,
- Ensure the locomotive/decoder is connected to the programming track
- Press start (stop light off) on the CS3

- 1) At the bottom of the same page column AFTER the "Reading the address on the Locomotive Decoder" chapter
- 2) locate a pen to write in errata
- 3) insert ...

"Writting a new the address on the Locomotive Decoder"

when on the Info panel of the locomotive edit screen.
- If possible (address already know) turn the lights on to observe programming progress
! perform the following even if the loco/decoder is already on the programing track
- Press stop (stop light on) on the CS3,
- Ensure the locomotive/decoder is connected to the programming track
- Press start (stop light off) on the CS3

Tip - DO NOT use the "+" and "-" buttons to step up/down to the new address
- Tap in the address field to bring up the numeric keypad
- Type the new address using the keypad
- Press the return/enter key

WAIT and observe
- after the keypad closes, the CS3 immediately starts its programming operation (no messages)
- if lights are on , they will blink - you may also hear the sound/motor pulse.
WAIT a little bit longer


Tip - It may not be obvious as to when a the programming is finished. If you are willing to dig into the bowels of the blue Configuration tab, you may perform other changes and may observe the "xx CV's to write" countdown - progress message at the top left of the screen

Comment:
If not already obvious, Marklin have designed the current CS3 to only do programming "immediately after" a Stop/Start.
And as per track record,
- they will not check this situation and proceed to be reading only to fail
- if you succeed , it is rare that you are informed of this.

Edited by user 16 October 2017 05:47:39(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Aaargh! Still will neither read nor write a DCC Loco.

Hello,

First I don't have a CS3/CS3+, only a CS2.

Using my CS2, I've created many DCC locos without any trouble.

However, the doc of the CS3 may be a bit confusing, and I'm trying to suggest a procedure based on the CS3 doc, and my feedback of use of the CS2...
I apologize in advance if I'm wrong, but it will be very surprising not to be able to create a DCC loco...

1) Use only the programming track
2) As stated in the doc, non-mfx locos must be created manually ! See page 11 left side
3) create a new entry manually with dcc protocol; name it the way you want; don't use the loco database; you may add an icon later...and also rename the loco with a more meaningful name
4) what is unclear in the doc is relative to the address of the loco: if you don't know it, when using the cs2, a facility (small icon allowing to read from track to cs) allow to read the decoder address. If you don't find such a facility in the cs3 when adding manually a loco, then I would suggest to enter some unused fake value for the address you will modify later ... try 111 for instance...
5) then save it !!!
6) afterwards, you have to edit this loco by clicking on the wrench, and change all the data you need including the address. Page 12 left side at the bottom, shows an icon allowing to read the address...In the worst case, modifying CV1 (for addresses below 128) will allow to change the address (see page 13 right side at the bottom).

The manual registering is a two step process:
-step 1 : register an incomplete loco. This allows to create an entry in the CS storage
-step 2 : adjust parameters and CV when needed, then write it to the decoder

In the CS2, creating an loco entry in the CS and write values to the decoder are distinct process. Once you have understood this, things are much more easy.
I don't know if M has wished to simplify the process with the CS3, by trying to generate some automatic write of the decoder, but I'm thinking it is still a bit unclear.

Until so far, this is the best procedure I can suggest.

HTH
fabrice

Thank you Mike. I live in hope but this thread seems to have run it’s course. I’m just using the Ultima now. It’s not so pretty but at least it’s stable. Mug that I am I’ve sent for the new CS3 book. If that fails I’ll just take a big financial hit and put the CS3 on EBay. With the book and a warning.