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steventrain		#451 Posted : 04 May 2024 12:50:10(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC) Posts: 31,685 Location: United Kingdom		Originally Posted by: H0 Originally Posted by: steventrain I have 18045 from Local dealer via Marklin Germany for Gaugemaster. I double check on box - not see any Made in China sticker. Märklin add the "Made in ..." stickers for US exports, not for all non-EU exports. Dealers "down under" also know it from the customs documents, but final customers do not see those stickers either. Thanks for letting me know. I am lucky with with 18045.
		Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy.
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TrainIride		#452 Posted : 05 May 2024 19:38:39(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 23/10/2010(UTC) Posts: 2,059 Location: FRANCE		Hi, got this on my 29453 START UP Container Train Starter Set: Best Regards Joël
		Marklin HO - M track & C track - Analog mode - https://www.marklin-users.net/TrainIride - my channel : https://www.youtube.com/user/2mes2mains
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H0		#453 Posted : 06 May 2024 08:58:15(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 15,432 Location: DE-NW		Originally Posted by: TrainIride got this on my 29453 START UP Container Train Starter Set: I have "Made in China" printed on the box of my 36243 class 24 loco. There is no "Made in..." on the box of the later 36244 class 24 loco. So yes, there are "Made in..." prints on the boxes of some items, mainly entry level items with the colourful boxes. But you do not find "Made in..." prints on the high-price grey boxes for the "professional" collectors, as Märklin call us freaks who spend huge amounts of money on small rolling stock.
		Regards Tom --- "In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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David Dewar		#454 Posted : 06 May 2024 12:19:09(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 01/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 7,447 Location: Scotland		I really dont care where Markklin is made as long as it works as described. Life is too short to spend time looking at labels on boxes amd anyway we appear to make almost nothing in the UK so about everything I buy is made in China` or some other country. As our locos get more complicated with sounds and lights etc chances are there will be more going wrong but so far I have been OK with what I buy.
		Take care I like Marklin and will defend the worlds greatest model rail manufacturer.
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H0		#455 Posted : 06 May 2024 14:26:04(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 15,432 Location: DE-NW		Originally Posted by: David Dewar I really dont care where Markklin is made as long as it works as described. What makes an item a "Märklin item"? A Tillig car sold in a Märklin box is still a Tillig item with respect to philosophy and quality. A Piko car sold in a Märklin box is still a Piko item with respect to philosophy and quality. How about "Märklin" locomotives designed by Far-east companies and produced by Far-east companies?
		Regards Tom --- "In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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marklinist5999		#456 Posted : 06 May 2024 14:39:15(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/02/2021(UTC) Posts: 3,865 Location: Michigan, Troy		Well, then it would really be Chinese, I guess. My brother in law has a Jeep design team in Shanghai, but I don't know for which market they do it for. He also has a few Cihnese designers and engineers here.
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HO Collector		#457 Posted : 07 May 2024 22:41:13(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 21/02/2016(UTC) Posts: 219 Location: Just north of London		Marklin make their models in China. I got it in writing from Marklin.
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QQQ1970		#458 Posted : 08 May 2024 00:02:21(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 06/02/2018(UTC) Posts: 413 Location: Ontario, Toronto		Does it mean Märklin owns a Chinese factory like Piko, or outsources to a third party for assembly?
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H0		#459 Posted : 08 May 2024 08:29:07(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 15,432 Location: DE-NW		Originally Posted by: QQQ1970 Does it mean Märklin owns a Chinese factory like Piko, or outsources to a third party for assembly? Märklin do not have factories outside Europe, they rely on subcontractors - or on subcontractors of subcontractors. It seems they outsource much more than just assembly. Chinese companies also can do zinc die-casting, as we learned from Köf II and Seetal-Krokodil..
		Regards Tom --- "In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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mrmarklin		#460 Posted : 08 May 2024 23:44:20(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 27/10/2004(UTC) Posts: 936 Location: Burney, CA		Originally Posted by: H0 Originally Posted by: QQQ1970 Does it mean Märklin owns a Chinese factory like Piko, or outsources to a third party for assembly? Märklin do not have factories outside Europe, they rely on subcontractors - or on subcontractors of subcontractors. It seems they outsource much more than just assembly. Chinese companies also can do zinc die-casting, as we learned from Köf II and Seetal-Krokodil.. I think that the Seetal-Krok and the Kof II are examples of Chinese companies NOT doing zinc die casting!!! I believe that most models are made in Europe, but some of the more complex steamers, such as the wave of "surprise" models are outsourced to Asia.
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dickinsonj		#461 Posted : 09 May 2024 01:46:39(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,796 Location: Crozet, Virginia		Originally Posted by: mrmarklin I believe that most models are made in Europe, but some of the more complex steamers, such as the wave of "surprise" models are outsourced to Asia. Exactly! I primarily collect Märklin's more highly detailed and richly functioned locos, which are always expensive. With some exceptions that means that the majority of my models purchased in the last 6-7 years have all been made in China. I have found that all of the Insider models and many other locos are made in Germany, most coaches are made in Hungary, and the special models primarily come from Asian sources. When I first learned that my new top line Märklin loco was not made in Germany, I asked this forum why? After all, I buy Märklin models for German engineering and production quality. The wise response was that I would not have been able to afford that loco and it would have been less elaborate if it had been made in Germany. That made perfect sense to me and I eventually stopped caring where they are made as long as they are madel well. Because of that I am amazed that there is still a controversy about Chinese production of Märklin models. If I excluded them I would have bought less than half of my new locos for some time now. I find their quality to generally be equivalent to the European made models, but I am still very glad that my Northlander is German model.
		Regards, Jim I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains! So many trains and so little time.
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QQQ1970		#462 Posted : 09 May 2024 18:14:13(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 06/02/2018(UTC) Posts: 413 Location: Ontario, Toronto		How do you know Northlander is made in Germany?
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dickinsonj		#463 Posted : 09 May 2024 18:33:45(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,796 Location: Crozet, Virginia		Originally Posted by: QQQ1970 How do you know Northlander is made in Germany? Well, I guess I don't know for sure, but as far as I know all of the Insider locos have always been made in Germany. If someone knows one way or the other on Insider models I would love to hear that.
		Regards, Jim I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains! So many trains and so little time.
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petestra		#464 Posted : 09 May 2024 22:53:53(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 27/07/2009(UTC) Posts: 5,862 Location: Leesburg,VA.USA		I just found this. Perhaps it will help with this discussion. I am assuming this is currently in effect. I just bought the Insider Lok 39583 and it states, Made in Germany. Most H0-gauge trains are built from scratch out of basic elements — zinc alloy, steel, plastic pellets and paint — in the Göppingen plant, allowing Märklin to mark these models “Made in Germany.” Parts for other models are made in Göppingen and then assembled in the Hungarian plant.
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dickinsonj		#465 Posted : 10 May 2024 01:57:54(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,796 Location: Crozet, Virginia		Originally Posted by: petestra Most H0-gauge trains are built from scratch out of basic elements — zinc alloy, steel, plastic pellets and paint — in the Göppingen plant, allowing Märklin to mark these models “Made in Germany.” Parts for other models are made in Göppingen and then assembled in the Hungarian plant. What was the source for this?
		Regards, Jim I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains! So many trains and so little time.
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H0		#466 Posted : 10 May 2024 08:41:26(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 15,432 Location: DE-NW		Originally Posted by: petestra Most H0-gauge trains are built from scratch out of basic elements — zinc alloy, steel, plastic pellets and paint — in the Göppingen plant, allowing Märklin to mark these models “Made in Germany.” Parts for other models are made in Göppingen and then assembled in the Hungarian plant. Sounds like the standard text from their website. They forgot to mention that some products come completely from third parties and the only metal parts made in Göppingen may be the center-rail slider and the coupler loop.
		Regards Tom --- "In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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petestra		#467 Posted : 10 May 2024 11:45:51(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 27/07/2009(UTC) Posts: 5,862 Location: Leesburg,VA.USA		Originally Posted by: dickinsonj Originally Posted by: petestra Most H0-gauge trains are built from scratch out of basic elements — zinc alloy, steel, plastic pellets and paint — in the Göppingen plant, allowing Märklin to mark these models “Made in Germany.” Parts for other models are made in Göppingen and then assembled in the Hungarian plant. What was the source for this? It was just a general Marklin internet search. (Bing).
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Michael4		#468 Posted : 10 May 2024 11:47:28(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 02/02/2017(UTC) Posts: 694 Location: England, South Coast		Not long ago I was driving a Mercedes, it was made in Mexico. It worked OK. Just saying...
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H0		#469 Posted : 10 May 2024 12:01:18(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 15,432 Location: DE-NW		Originally Posted by: dickinsonj Because of that I am amazed that there is still a controversy about Chinese production of Märklin models. Some folks think that everything from Märklin is made in Germany because every box shows the address of the Göppingen headquarters. When they find out about "Made in China", they sometimes are very disappointed. I think this is not a problem of quality, but a problem of faith and transparency. How many times did I hear a Märklin CEO complaining about bad quality from China and about transfers of product lines from China to Europe. Their advertising speeches with split tongue sometimes fire back.
		Regards Tom --- "In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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marklinist5999		#470 Posted : 10 May 2024 12:55:57(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/02/2021(UTC) Posts: 3,865 Location: Michigan, Troy		Yes, Audi and BMW have Mexican plants as well as Daimler ag. Certain models are assembled there and exported to the US and Europe.The ML class suv is only assembled in Alabama. Even ones for Europe.Final assembly is usually what is referred to as where something is made. Components and parts can be local and global sourced.
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Goofy		#471 Posted : 10 May 2024 13:22:32(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC) Posts: 9,273		Originally Posted by: H0 Originally Posted by: dickinsonj Because of that I am amazed that there is still a controversy about Chinese production of Märklin models. Some folks think that everything from Märklin is made in Germany because every box shows the address of the Göppingen headquarters. When they find out about "Made in China", they sometimes are very disappointed. I think this is not a problem of quality, but a problem of faith and transparency. How many times did I hear a Märklin CEO complaining about bad quality from China and about transfers of product lines from China to Europe. Their advertising speeches with split tongue sometimes fire back. That is what it happens to me when i do have problem about Märklin products and somebody here in the forum speet at me with useless comments. Are Märklinist here too fool against by self? How can you even be sure that train models you buy are not made in Germany and have bad quality controls?
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dickinsonj		#472 Posted : 10 May 2024 14:06:51(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,796 Location: Crozet, Virginia		Originally Posted by: H0 I think this is not a problem of quality, but a problem of faith and transparency. How many times did I hear a Märklin CEO complaining about bad quality from China and about transfers of product lines from China to Europe. Their advertising speeches with split tongue sometimes fire back. That is it exactly Tom. I don't find Märklin's Chinese made models to be inferior, but I find it odd that Märklin tries to hide the country of assembly. I currently have a 39853 ET 85 on order and it will almost surely be made in China. That is fine by me, but I will only know because the US requires country of origin attribution. Most people will never know where there models are made, and why does Märklin find it necessary to hide that information?
		Regards, Jim I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains! So many trains and so little time.
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5HorizonsRR		#473 Posted : 10 May 2024 18:53:42(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC) Posts: 2,973 Location: CA, USA		One comment, which has nothing to do with China vs not China, but rather decision making in a highly niche, capital intensive industry. (well, by hobby standards of course) If you look closely, the items made in China are (mostly) quite niche, unique in their components or details, and items I would label prime for a 1 or 2 time production. The V200s of the world are seemingly coming from Europe. If I were Marklin I'd do the same thing: outsource the whole project with a built-in margin based upon a fixed (conservative) volume they know they can sell. It is good business, and minimizes the risk. It also eliminates the up front costs, carrying costs, and even warehousing costs. For a model that was never going to be a "bread and butter" seller in the lineup, why not? Its a great way to expand the business. that being said, it is also a tempting way to cut a few design corners on things they know they won't be selling - or more importantly servicing- repetitively for the next 20 years. This is all my suspicion, but grounded in logic. Marklin wins ($$), certain modelers win (getting a desired model that wouldn't exist otherwise) and the world moves along. Until you need a spare part in year 2055 of course... Edited by user 13 May 2024 06:27:43(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified
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mvd71		#474 Posted : 10 May 2024 21:27:11(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 09/08/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,916 Location: Auckland,		Originally Posted by: Goofy Originally Posted by: H0 Originally Posted by: dickinsonj Because of that I am amazed that there is still a controversy about Chinese production of Märklin models. Some folks think that everything from Märklin is made in Germany because every box shows the address of the Göppingen headquarters. When they find out about "Made in China", they sometimes are very disappointed. I think this is not a problem of quality, but a problem of faith and transparency. How many times did I hear a Märklin CEO complaining about bad quality from China and about transfers of product lines from China to Europe. Their advertising speeches with split tongue sometimes fire back. That is what it happens to me when i do have problem about Märklin products and somebody here in the forum speet at me with useless comments. Are Märklinist here too fool against by self? How can you even be sure that train models you buy are not made in Germany and have bad quality controls? I think you have a good point Goofy. We can’t know for sure where any specific model or its components are made, and Märklin are not telling us.
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mrmarklin		#475 Posted : 10 May 2024 21:53:04(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 27/10/2004(UTC) Posts: 936 Location: Burney, CA		I went with some friends to Toy Fair in Nürnberg ca. 2016 and we spoke with Florian Sieber himself. At that time the surprise models were being made in China. Most others were being made in the EU. Of course electronics…………..
		From the People's Republik of Kalifornia
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kiwiAlan		#476 Posted : 11 May 2024 00:02:07(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC) Posts: 8,455 Location: ENGLAND, Didcot		Originally Posted by: mrmarklin I went with some friends to Toy Fair in Nürnberg ca. 2016 and we spoke with Florian Sieber himself. At that time the surprise models were being made in China. Most others were being made in the EU. Of course electronics………….. Or motors ............
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Goofy		#477 Posted : 11 May 2024 09:37:09(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC) Posts: 9,273		Are Märklin trains 100% made of Märklin factory? How can you be so sure about that? You don´t!
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H0		#478 Posted : 12 May 2024 19:21:40(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 15,432 Location: DE-NW		Originally Posted by: Goofy Are Märklin trains 100% made of Märklin factory? How can you be so sure about that? We can be 100% sure that not all "Märklin" trains are made in Märklin factories. And we can be sure that not all "co-operations" are marked as co-operations in the catalogue.
		Regards Tom --- "In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Mr. Ron		#479 Posted : 07 September 2024 02:42:34(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 05/07/2020(UTC) Posts: 326 Location: Mississippi, Vancleave		Marklin, "made in China" has been a hot topic lately. I can suggest a possible answer that may satisfy. You may remember that the term "made in Germany" was replaced by "made in west Germany" during the cold war. This would require an all new casting to be made for every Marklin item. Obviously it would be very expensive to make new dies to reflect the "made in China" label. By using the same dies and attaching a "made in China" tag to the box satisfies where the item is made without the expense of making new dies. Although one can't tell if the items were made in China or Germany, you can assume that if a sticker says "made in China", it was manufactured in China. Even the box and instruction sheet itself would be an expensive item to remake if "made in China" had to be added. The most cost effective solution is to just add a "made in China" tag to the outside of the box. Just having the contents of the box printed in Chinese would be expensive.
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H0		#480 Posted : 07 September 2024 08:05:30(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 15,432 Location: DE-NW		Originally Posted by: Mr. Ron Obviously it would be very expensive to make new dies to reflect the "made in China" label. By using the same dies and attaching a "made in China" tag to the box satisfies where the item is made without the expense of making new dies. Although one can't tell if the items were made in China or Germany, you can assume that if a sticker says "made in China", it was manufactured in China. It is convenient that the country of origin is required in the USA only (in 2008, only 2% of Märklin sales went to the US through the official channels). So 98% of the Märklin boxes can ship without any "Made in..." declaration and with "Göppingen, Germany" in big letters on every box, even if the item is made in Hungary or even China. Ignorance is strength. "Made in China" on all boxes would make many Märklin customers unhappy. Update: Sample picture (new box on the left): Make "Made in China" as small as possible and the CE logo and Göppingen, Germany as large as possible. Honi soit qui mal y pense.
		Regards Tom --- "In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Copenhagen		#481 Posted : 07 September 2024 08:16:55(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 23/04/2019(UTC) Posts: 492 Location: Copenhagen, Denmark		I have no expert knowledge, and I'm not trying to be a wise guy. My impression is that "made in xxx country" only means that a product is wholly or partially made in that country. In that case everything does not have to be made from scratch (so to speak) in the country named on the box. I'll be happy to be corrected if I'm wrong.
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H0		#482 Posted : 07 September 2024 08:23:47(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 15,432 Location: DE-NW		Originally Posted by: Copenhagen My impression is that "made in xxx country" only means that a product is wholly or partially made in that country. In the US, it marks the country where the last "substantial transformation" took place. So if items (like chairs) are assembled in Mexico from parts made in China, the declaration should be "Made in China" as the substantial transformation happened there. Assembling electric devices probably is a different story IMHO as it turns "bird seed" into a working device.
		Regards Tom --- "In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Goofy		#483 Posted : 07 September 2024 10:03:57(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC) Posts: 9,273		Fake or real? What it matters if the products are made in Europe or China has to present marking as results. There are misuse and made in China export did also failed by test the products and there are false marking of "China Export" marking of CE.
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H0		#484 Posted : 07 September 2024 10:18:05(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 15,432 Location: DE-NW		Originally Posted by: Goofy There are misuse and made in China export did also failed by test the products and there are false marking of "China Export" marking of CE. The CE logo is added by the manufacturer to indicate compliance with EU regulations. For most products, no certification is required. Sometimes the manufacturer lies and products do not comply with EU regulations, but you cannot tell this from the logo.
		Regards Tom --- "In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Goofy		#485 Posted : 07 September 2024 10:24:30(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC) Posts: 9,273		Originally Posted by: H0 Originally Posted by: Goofy There are misuse and made in China export did also failed by test the products and there are false marking of "China Export" marking of CE. The CE logo is added by the manufacturer to indicate compliance with EU regulations. For most products, no certification is required. Sometimes the manufacturer lies and products do not comply with EU regulations, but you cannot tell this from the logo. Wrong! There is two difference marking of the CE. China are slightly not same of the European marking CE. The next step are UKCA. Rules underlying CE marking.
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H0		#486 Posted : 07 September 2024 10:28:08(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 15,432 Location: DE-NW		Originally Posted by: Goofy China are slightly not same of the European marking CE. Märklin items from China surely have the correct "China Export" CE sign for the EU. Quote: In 2008, a logo very similar to CE marking was alleged to exist and to stand for China Export because some Chinese manufacturers apply it to their products. However, the European Commission says that this is a misconception. The matter was raised at the European Parliament in 2008. The Commission responded that it was unaware of the existence of any "Chinese Export" mark and that, in its view, the misunderstanding had arisen because a producer had failed to respect the precise dimensions and proportions of the mark as prescribed in the legislation. Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CE_marking 2008! Goofy, it is time to arrive in 2024.
		Regards Tom --- "In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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bph		#487 Posted : 07 September 2024 12:01:21(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/08/2018(UTC) Posts: 1,144		One potential downside of manufacturing in China..... I have also noticed that some companies have started to move production out of China. eg Canon has moved at least its camera production out. so modern cameras and lenses are now mostly made in Japan or Taiwan. (might be some exceptions)
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mike c		#488 Posted : 07 September 2024 12:04:00(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC) Posts: 8,216 Location: Montreal, QC		Originally Posted by: H0 Originally Posted by: Copenhagen My impression is that "made in xxx country" only means that a product is wholly or partially made in that country. In the US, it marks the country where the last "substantial transformation" took place. So if items (like chairs) are assembled in Mexico from parts made in China, the declaration should be "Made in China" as the substantial transformation happened there. Assembling electric devices probably is a different story IMHO as it turns "bird seed" into a working device. USMCA (US, Mexico Canada) Free Trade Deal requires that goods be labelled for the country of origin, which is defined as the place where the lion's share of the manufacturing took place. EU rules are more lax and allow companies to label their goods with the country where the final assembly/packaging took place, so a model made of Chinese and other imported components could be labelled as Made in EU if the final assembly, the boxing of the model occurred in a EU country. For US purposes, Made in EU does not count and the packaging must include the specific country, i.e Hungary or Germany. Some importers may declare all goods in a shipment as having the same origin in order to save paperwork on import. I am not saying that this is the case with model trains. Regards Mike C
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marklinist5999		#489 Posted : 07 September 2024 14:32:28(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/02/2021(UTC) Posts: 3,865 Location: Michigan, Troy		I liked when the "made in" label meant the point of final assembly, or said "manufactured with parts or components sourced globally" and assembled in said place. I guess that applies to most everything today though. Raw material can come from one place, microchips from another, software yet another, etc.
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dickinsonj		#490 Posted : 08 September 2024 01:08:58(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,796 Location: Crozet, Virginia		Sorry, I have been distracted from this discussion of Märklin made in China for a while. I find the quality pretty much equivalent, but it would still be nice to know. Have we discussed where the Edelweiß set was made? Any guesses?
		Regards, Jim I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains! So many trains and so little time.
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Goofy		#491 Posted : 08 September 2024 10:08:13(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC) Posts: 9,273		Originally Posted by: H0 Originally Posted by: Goofy China are slightly not same of the European marking CE. Märklin items from China surely have the correct "China Export" CE sign for the EU. Quote: In 2008, a logo very similar to CE marking was alleged to exist and to stand for China Export because some Chinese manufacturers apply it to their products. However, the European Commission says that this is a misconception. The matter was raised at the European Parliament in 2008. The Commission responded that it was unaware of the existence of any "Chinese Export" mark and that, in its view, the misunderstanding had arisen because a producer had failed to respect the precise dimensions and proportions of the mark as prescribed in the legislation. Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CE_marking 2008! Goofy, it is time to arrive in 2024. There are alphabet codes but China does not present a "type Approval" in question about testing quality. In fact does products not get Approval made in China. Laws and rules changes by politicians. The "free market" does not even exist because the market are designed after laws and rules. It is a risk you confirm if you buy a product made somewhere in the Asia. To read the only sign marking CE does not says "Approval" product.
		H0 DCC = Digital Command Control
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marklinist5999		#492 Posted : 08 September 2024 14:22:02(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/02/2021(UTC) Posts: 3,865 Location: Michigan, Troy		Free market doesn't exhist? Ok, we all have opinions, and they are like our butts. We all have one. In Russia, they are limited to the amount they can get from hobby imports, etc. That is Putin political, and not free market. There are no modern Russian train makers. Why do you think ther eare regulations at all? Because no company or person cheated or lied? Some are political, but not always negative.
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Copenhagen		#493 Posted : 08 September 2024 19:17:41(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 23/04/2019(UTC) Posts: 492 Location: Copenhagen, Denmark		... and we shouldn't forget that this discussion is about an established brand (Marklin) getting stuff made in China. We are not talking about buying model trains from Temu, Wish, Alibaba or whatever.
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H0		#494 Posted : 08 September 2024 19:45:18(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 15,432 Location: DE-NW		Originally Posted by: mike c USMCA (US, Mexico Canada) Free Trade Deal requires that goods be labelled for the country of origin, which is defined as the place where the lion's share of the manufacturing took place. AIUI "last substantial transformation" is the official term, not "lion's share". A simple assembly does not count as a substantial transformation.
		Regards Tom --- "In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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H0		#495 Posted : 08 September 2024 19:51:23(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 15,432 Location: DE-NW		Originally Posted by: dickinsonj Have we discussed where the Edelweiß set was made? If it is from Far East, please report in this thread: https://www.marklin-user...ad-Marklin-made-in-China
		Regards Tom --- "In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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dickinsonj		#496 Posted : 08 September 2024 19:57:10(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,796 Location: Crozet, Virginia		It is no surprise, but I just wanted to report that the Edelweiß coach set 42470 is marked as "Made in China".
		Regards, Jim I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains! So many trains and so little time.
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QQQ1970		#497 Posted : 09 September 2024 01:28:25(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 06/02/2018(UTC) Posts: 413 Location: Ontario, Toronto		Thanks for the note. So far all my Made in China rolling stock run trouble free so this bodes well.
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dickinsonj		#498 Posted : 09 September 2024 03:08:11(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,796 Location: Crozet, Virginia		Originally Posted by: QQQ1970 Thanks for the note. So far all my Made in China rolling stock run trouble free so this bodes well. Mine all do as well, and I have had no problems with any of my models from China.
		Regards, Jim I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains! So many trains and so little time.
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Bigdaddynz		#499 Posted : 09 September 2024 09:07:45(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC) Posts: 18,763 Location: New Zealand		Merged both of the "Marklin Made in China" threads that we had open.
		WWW BLOG
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David Dewar		#500 Posted : 09 September 2024 23:45:21(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 01/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 7,447 Location: Scotland		My concern is not where it is made but how well it is made. If it works and is reliable then I dont look at the box to see who made it.
		Take care I like Marklin and will defend the worlds greatest model rail manufacturer.
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