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mb300e4m		#51 Posted : 22 April 2017 02:21:42(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: franciscohg The other thing i forgot.to tell you is since they are two smokes.units, and to be on the safe side, i wired them through a mini relay to the decoder. Regards Did you use an ESU 51963 Miniature Switching Relay, 16 Volt, or did you go solid state? Peter B.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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franciscohg		#52 Posted : 22 April 2017 02:59:14(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC) Posts: 3,272 Location: Patagonia		Hi, the ESU ones
		German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
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mb300e4m		#53 Posted : 22 April 2017 14:59:35(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: franciscohg Hi, the ESU ones Thanks Francisco, I had a little trouble finding them with Google because I did not know the part number. I eventually found them on the ESU website. They are not expensive so will order a half dozen, I am sure I will use them on other conversions too. Peter B.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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mb300e4m		#54 Posted : 22 April 2017 17:52:33(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: franciscohg Hi, the ESU ones Hello again. I will order the relays next week. In the meantime, I will leave the double smoke units disconnected. The two wires connected to the motor both have what looks like resistors in them I assume they should stay wired in. They are similar in shape to a half watt resistor but a bit shorter, are pale green in color with a single coloured band. They could be a choke? Peter B.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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franciscohg		#55 Posted : 22 April 2017 18:52:19(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC) Posts: 3,272 Location: Patagonia		Yes, they are chokes and must remain in place. You can solder one end directly to the motor tabs and then the wires. Here you can see a picture https://ajckids.com/blog...n-dcm-motor-connections/
		German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
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franciscohg		#56 Posted : 22 April 2017 19:05:34(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC) Posts: 3,272 Location: Patagonia		Mmmmmm, you made me take out this loco, one of my first conversions.....now i want sound on it.....
		German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
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mb300e4m		#57 Posted : 22 April 2017 20:33:53(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: franciscohg Yes, they are chokes and must remain in place. You can solder one end directly to the motor tabs and then the wires. Here you can see a picture https://ajckids.com/blog...n-dcm-motor-connections/ I came to that conclusion too that they were chokes. I measured the devices with a VOM and found zero resistance that told me they were not resistors, also the shape was wrong and they only had one colour band. Soldering them to the motor is a good idea too, it gets them out of way of the clutter in the tender. Peter B.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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mb300e4m		#58 Posted : 22 April 2017 20:35:24(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: franciscohg Mmmmmm, you made me take out this loco, one of my first conversions.....now i want sound on it..... An excellent idea, we can work on them at the same time and compare notes as we go.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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franciscohg		#59 Posted : 22 April 2017 20:53:22(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC) Posts: 3,272 Location: Patagonia		Jaja, even if i order my deco now, you will finish first....besides, my conversion will be boring, just swap a lokpilot for a loksound I will better wait to "see" how yours sound.
		German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
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franciscohg		#60 Posted : 22 April 2017 23:46:41(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC) Posts: 3,272 Location: Patagonia		Didnt even remember that she was also fitted with ball bearings.....
		German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
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mb300e4m		#61 Posted : 23 April 2017 00:36:30(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: franciscohg Jaja, even if i order my deco now, you will finish first....besides, my conversion will be boring, just swap a lokpilot for a loksound I will better wait to "see" how yours sound. I am not sure I will finish before you do even though you have to wait for your replacement decoder. This is all very new to me, it is not as though I am doing a "like for like" replacement. I am taking lots of pictures and making lots of notes. But I am getting my head and my hands around it and will start cutting wires very soon. Removing the power transistor should be easy, it only feeds the lights and smoke units. Once it is out of the way, the rest should be easier, the whole thing is a bit cluttered right now. I have all of the existing wires in a table with their purpose and colours noted. Once the 6090 is gone, the colours of the existing wires become irrelevant, it is then down to purpose. It is it a case of tracing them out, cutting them out and connecting the wires from the new adapter board. These connecting wires are also in the same cross referenced table showing colour and purpose. So matching purpose for purpose should see everything connected correctly, I hope. It will be one step, or should I say wire at a time. Peter B.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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mb300e4m		#62 Posted : 23 April 2017 17:27:35(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		A new question, slightly off topic but related. The 3702 came with two incandescent light bulbs installed, one for the front lights and one for the rear. I am thinking seriously about replacing them with 3mm (T-1) LEDs. I have a pack of five which already have resistors and diodes attached and are good for 7-19 Volts and which also function with AC, DC or DCC use.. It looks like I could remove the rear light-pipe from the tender and install two LEDs in its place. I could possibly replace the front light light pipe the same way but that may involve more surgery than I want to undertake at the present time. But I will investigate the front and rear lights to determine what is involved. Has anyone replaced the front and rear lights in a BR53? Comments and suggestions will be most welcome. BTW, today is the day the 6090 and power transistor are going to be removed. Edited by user 28 April 2017 14:20:52(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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mb300e4m		#63 Posted : 23 April 2017 18:05:28(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: mb300e4m A new question, slightly of topic but related. It looks like I could remove the rear light-pipe from the tender and install two LEDs in its place. I could possibly replace the front light light pipe the same way but that may involve more surgery than I want to undertake at the present time. But I will investigate the front and rear lights to determine what is involved. I removed the rear light socket and bulb and the light pipe. The holes in the back of the tender in to which the light pipe fits are too small for the LEDs to fit into. But it looks like I can mount the LEDs somehow (yet to be determined) inside the tender body with the LED lenses touching the holes in the body. The holes in the tender body have lens' fitted to them, that is good, one less thing to mess with. The light replacement task is going onto the back burner for now, so back to the decoder we go. Edited by user 24 April 2017 01:46:18(UTC)  | Reason: Typo.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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mb300e4m		#64 Posted : 23 April 2017 18:45:30(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Out with the old and in with the new. I assume that the one edge of the adapter, the one with the mounting holes, can be removed. It is scored on both sides. Then it can be refitted to the 6090 plastic mount.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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franciscohg		#65 Posted : 23 April 2017 20:39:29(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC) Posts: 3,272 Location: Patagonia		Hi, yes the plate should fit in the holder, perhaps you dont even neet to cut it. But it may make you lose a couple of mm in height to fit the speaker, if you should not use the holder, just insulate the wieght and secure the plate with double sided tape. On the other hand, i don see the point in replacing the bulbs with individual leds, you can retain the difuser and change the bulb with any led (using the same socket) then solder the wires to the plate, dont forget the resistor. As for the color you may find out that war white is perhaps not that warm. I tend to use yellow ones but try to keep the bulbs everytime i can. Remember that they are not intended to illuminate the road but the make the loco visible. Regards
		German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
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mb300e4m		#66 Posted : 24 April 2017 00:00:03(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: franciscohg Hi, yes the plate should fit in the holder, perhaps you don't even need to cut it. But it may make you lose a couple of mm in height to fit the speaker, if you should not use the holder, just insulate the weight and secure the plate with double sided tape. On the other hand, i don't see the point in replacing the bulbs with individual leds, you can retain the diffuser and change the bulb with any led (using the same socket) then solder the wires to the plate, don't forget the resistor. As for the color you may find out that warm white is perhaps not that warm. I tend to use yellow ones but try to keep the bulbs every time i can. Remember that they are not intended to illuminate the road but the make the loco visible. Regards You are right about the plastic holder it takes up space where the speaker will go. Laying it down flat will result in a lot more room. Regarding the bulbs, will the original incandescent bulbs work OK with the new decoder? If they will I will keep them as is. To make the adapter card fit better, I needed to file a small notch in the edge of the card next to the two U+ copper lands. It does not need to be very deep, just deep enough to accommodate a plastic gusset in the side of the tender body. This way the adapter card will fit flat in place and not slope down from right to left.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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franciscohg		#67 Posted : 24 April 2017 20:25:02(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC) Posts: 3,272 Location: Patagonia		Hi Peter, bulbs will work with no problem with the decoder. Troubles arise when converting older locomotives with screw or bayonet type bulbs wich are grounded with the loco chassis, thus making the annoying flickering effect, on those cases you may want to place sockets for bi-pin bulbs grounded to the deco or leds. You already have your bi pins with sockets. Just wire them with the apropriate color for front and rear and then to the U+ terminal ( anyone ) Regards
		German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
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mb300e4m		#68 Posted : 24 April 2017 22:25:32(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: franciscohg Hi Peter, bulbs will work with no problem with the decoder. Troubles arise when converting older locomotives with screw or bayonet type bulbs wich are grounded with the loco chassis, thus making the annoying flickering effect, on those cases you may want to place sockets for bi-pin bulbs grounded to the deco or leds. You already have your bi pins with sockets. Just wire them with the apropriate color for front and rear and then to the U+ terminal ( anyone ) Regards Hi again Francisco, A little bit of history may be in order. I suspect that when the original owner purchased the loco it was probably analogue AC. He had it converted at some point by a dealer to digital by the addition of a 6090 decoder. Regarding the grounding. Nothing is connected to the chassis. There is a small solder pad attached to the top of the motor laminations. From the solder pad, three brown wires fan out to 1) the front light, 2) the 6090 decoder, 3) the rear light and to 4) the outer rail pickups on the tender rear bogie. The wire to the decoder is now black, the brown original has been replaced with the black one attached to the new decoder. The lights were working fine with the 6090 decoder, so I need to change anything with the new decoder? Peter B.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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mb300e4m		#69 Posted : 24 April 2017 23:23:32(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		This has almost been a blow by blow thread, if you know what I mean. All that is left now is to hook in the relay for the smoke units to the orange wire, except I don't have any relays yet. Can't get any retailers to respond to my e-mails, it's like they don't need the business, maybe I'll go solid state. I need to re-install the rear light too but that is a no brainer, that is the yellow wire. Then comes the decoder...keep your fingers crossed when I get to that. Notice the short piece of blue sleeving, I cut a notch in a gusset, fed the wires through the sleeving then pressed the sleeving into the notch, that should keep them tidy. Any slack wires you see will be tucked in out of the way. Peter B.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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franciscohg		#70 Posted : 25 April 2017 01:55:33(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC) Posts: 3,272 Location: Patagonia		Nice, you are almost done. as for the relays, you may try to find equivalents at an electronic store, once i needed smaller ones than the ESU and i found those: OMRON G5V-1, they must be widely available. As for the lights, yellow with yellow and the other pin to the blue wire or any U+ pad, you may use one for each light and one for the relay when you got it, the soldering is much simplier. the black wire to the tender wheels is ok, but...as you can see in the previous picture of my engine when i showed the ball bearings, you can see an small bronze pad fixed in the lower left screw of the motor shield, that way you ensure that ground is made by all the loco wheels and not only the ones in the tender, that is very useful when your wheels and/or rails are not completely clean, of course you must be sure that there is no other cable touching the loco chassis at any point. An empiric way to check for short may be to put the loco on the rails without the decoder when the wiring is done, nothing should happen, if you get a short then check all your wires again. The brown cables to the lights can be removed safely, as i said before just one pin to any U+ pad. If you dont like to solder to much on the board you can do the following: mainting the wiring with brown cables to the lights and extra little board, then solder the cable from the little board to the blue wire or U+ pad. Might sound confusing but it is not. in short: red cable to the pickup shoe. black cable to wheels ( just to the tender ones is fine ) and nothing more to those cables All functions (lights and relay ) must be wired according to the color code ( white and yellow for lights and green for the relay in F1, leave the violet alone ) the circuit is completed trough the blue cable (u+) for all functions. Orange and grey to the motor trough the chokes Regards
		German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
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mb300e4m		#71 Posted : 25 April 2017 21:04:26(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		In your picture you say: Originally Posted by: franciscohg "...you can see a small bronze pad fixed in the lower left screw of the motor shield, that way you ensure that ground is made by all the loco wheels and not only the ones in the tender, that is very useful when your wheels and/or rails are not completely clean, of course you must be sure that there is no other cable touching the loco chassis at any point"... I have Pin 21 and 22, Black and Red wires connected to outer and center rails respectively. The U+ Pin is connected to a solder pad mounted on the motor laminations and insulated from the chassis. This pad has two brown wires connected to it. One WAS connected to the rear light and tender wheel pickups, but now only connects to the rear light. The second brown wire connects to the front light and to the front chassis and provided additional outer rail power return. It seems to me that I need to break the connection to the chassis and run a new wire from the front chassis to the tender wheel pickups. Having the U+ connection “grounded” to the chassis sounds like a fatal arrangement for the decoder. On a related matter, I plan on changing the two light bulbs for LEDs, but am awaiting replacements. Can I use the existing incandescent light bulbs without causing damage to the decoder or adapter? Thanks. Peter B.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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franciscohg		#72 Posted : 25 April 2017 21:48:26(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC) Posts: 3,272 Location: Patagonia		Hi, it is ground, so it is soldered to the black wire, in the link i have send to the AJC forum you can see it clearly. The tab is then attached with the motorshield screw making the whole chassis and wheels grounded regards
		German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
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mb300e4m		#73 Posted : 26 April 2017 15:23:51(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Today, I am going to document everything that has been done to this point. It will be a pin by pin and wire by wire listing of what is connected to what and how. I will post it here. I believe the only things still needing to be done are 1) replace the incandescent bulbs with LEDs and 2) install the relay to power the dual smoke units. These will be attended to at a later date. Peter B.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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mb300e4m		#74 Posted : 26 April 2017 18:52:54(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: franciscohg Hi, it is ground, so it is soldered to the black wire, in the link i have send to the AJC forum you can see it clearly. The tab is then attached with the motorshield screw making the whole chassis and wheels grounded regards Hi again Francisco, I can see the tab in the AJC picture, mine is a little different. The front chassis has a solder tab on it which connects the chassis to Pin 21 (Black) wire which is also connected the Tender Outer Rail pickups. That takes advantage of the six non-powered drive wheels, the ones without tyres, and the front pony truck wheels as ground returns. You can see the tab in the picture. Peter B.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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franciscohg		#75 Posted : 26 April 2017 19:20:33(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC) Posts: 3,272 Location: Patagonia		Yes, it is the same function.👍
		German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
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mb300e4m		#76 Posted : 26 April 2017 19:33:29(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: mb300e4m Today, I am going to document everything that has been done to this point. It will be a pin by pin and wire by wire listing of what is connected to what and how. I will post it here. I believe the only things still needing to be done are 1) replace the incandescent bulbs with LEDs and 2) install the relay to power the dual smoke units. These will be attended to at a later date. Peter B. Hello again, here is what I have done so far. There are a few things left to do for the Smoke Units, but I am waiting for a shipment of ESU relays. a. Disconnected Smoke Units and Front Light common from Front Chassis b. Connected Center Rail pickup to Pin 22 (Red wire) c. Connected Tender Outer Rail Pickups to Pin 21 (Black wire) d. Connected Front Chassis to Tender Outer Rail Pickups, Pin 21 (Black wire) e. Connected Front Light common to pin 16 U+ (Blue wire) f. Disconnected Rear Light common from Tender Pickups. g. Connected Rear Light to Pin 7 (Yellow wire) h. Connected Rear Light common to Pin 16 U+ (Blue wire) i. Connected Front Light to Pin 8 (White wire) j. Connected Pin 18 (Grey wire) to Motor Right via choke k. Connected Pin 19 (Orange wire) to Motor Left via choke l. Connect Smoke Units to Relay (to do) m. Connect Relay Solenoid to Pin 15 (Green wire) (to do) n. Connect Relay Solenoid to common (to do) The installed light bulbs are rated at 22V and draw 25 mA at rated voltage. If these will work for me, I may not bother with LEDs. Thanks for your help and advice. Peter B.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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franciscohg		#77 Posted : 26 April 2017 20:34:55(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC) Posts: 3,272 Location: Patagonia		e) smoke units should not be connected to U+, light is ok take a look of the relay diagram at esu homepage, then: Pin 2 must be connected to pickup shoe Pin 3 must be connected to U+ ( blue ) Pin 4 must be connected to green Pin 5 must be connected to the central pin of smoke units The ground of the smoke units is trough the loco chassis In the meanwhile, just disconnect the smoke units from U+ and do the rest as pointed. And enjoy your newly upgraded loco!!
		German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
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mb300e4m		#78 Posted : 26 April 2017 21:58:31(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: franciscohg e) smoke units should not be connected to U+, light is ok take a look of the relay diagram at esu homepage, then: Pin 2 must be connected to pickup shoe Pin 3 must be connected to U+ ( blue ) Pin 4 must be connected to green Pin 5 must be connected to the central pin of smoke units The ground of the smoke units is trough the loco chassis In the meanwhile, just disconnect the smoke units from U+ and do the rest as pointed. And enjoy your newly upgraded loco!! Hi again Francisco, The list in my last post had an error in item e. The smoke unit power wire goes back to the tender and not U+ and is coiled up in the front corner of the tender awaiting the arrival on my doorstep of a relay. I checked the wiring several times and missed the error, I was too close to the work I guess. It is good that you caught the error, thank you for your attention to detail. I had looked at the relay information on the ESU page and have captured the images for reference. I will wire the relay as you suggested above. There is room to install it in the front of the tender. I set the loco on the test track today and powered her up without the decoder. I did not see any smoke or flames and all was quiet. So hopefully I should be good to go with the decoder plugged in. The incandescent bulbs should be alright as they are rated at 22 Volts and draw 25 mA at 25 volts. 25 Volts is as high as my test power supply will go. You may be able to see the orange smoke unit wire coiled up in the front corner of the tender. I guess it is getting to be show time, as in "plugging in the decoder then applying power again," what say you, shall I give it a go this afternoon? I need some encouragement to "push the boat out" as it were.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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franciscohg		#79 Posted : 26 April 2017 22:33:05(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC) Posts: 3,272 Location: Patagonia		Do it! Everything will be fine,
		German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
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mb300e4m		#80 Posted : 26 April 2017 23:51:24(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: franciscohg Do it! Everything will be fine, Will do, but I need to hook up the speaker to the decoder. Perhaps tomorrow, it is past the time for tea here. Best regards, Peter B.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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mb300e4m		#81 Posted : 27 April 2017 17:19:55(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: franciscohg Do it! Everything will be fine, Hi again Francisco, I connected the speaker then installed the Decoder. I hooked up one of my MS2 units, picked a free memory space, placed the loco on the track and MFX started blinking on the screen; then as expected the MS2 recognized and registered the loco. I stepped it through all the functions except Smoke and all worked fine, and the lights changed when the loco direction changed. I then powered it down and left it for a while. When I came back to it, I powered up the MS2 and noticed that the memory space was now empty and the front light was lit all the time unless the Stop was pressed. Also the screen said No Loco and the function icons were gone. I powered it down and back up again a couple of times but nothing changed. Oh shoot said I, the decoder must kaput. I hooked up my my second MS2 unit, powered it up then put the loco back on the track. This time the front light was off and MFX was flashing again, then as if by magic, hey presto, BR53 and the function icons showed again on the screen. A loco image was not displayed but neither was it on the first MS2. I left it powered up and ran it back and forth on the test track a few times, checking all the sound functions too and all seemed OK. Then powered it down for about 15 minutes then back up again. The loco was no longer shown in memory. Also MFX does not flash on and off and the MS2 won't find the loco. I tried my first MS2 again but it is the same however the front light is not lit any more like it was yesterday. So now neither MS2 units will find the loco automatically. I deleted a loco that I no longer have from my first MS2 and tried that memory location, but MFX did not flash it did not register it. Do you have any suggestions, maybe my MS2s are too old or need firmware or software upgrade? Peter B.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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franciscohg		#82 Posted : 27 April 2017 18:49:14(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC) Posts: 3,272 Location: Patagonia		Hello Peter, it worked! Great! Have you tried resetting your MS2? I have only one that came with my son starter set, and i use it only as a slave in my CS2. IIRC sometimes they "forget" the locos, so they did not appear in the list but since they were registered, they dont register again. My experience with them as a main controller is very limited so i cannot give you other advice than reset it for now. Later i can explore more options using it as a main controller, had to find the ugly box first.....
		German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
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mb300e4m		#83 Posted : 27 April 2017 20:11:22(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: franciscohg Hello Peter, it worked! Great! Have you tried resetting your MS2? I have only one that came with my son starter set, and i use it only as a slave in my CS2. IIRC sometimes they "forget" the locos, so they did not appear in the list but since they were registered, they dont register again. My experience with them as a main controller is very limited so i cannot give you other advice than reset it for now. Later i can explore more options using it as a main controller, had to find the ugly box first..... After I deleted a loco that I no longer have from my first MS2 and tried that memory location, MFX did not flash and it did not register it. So I unplugged the power supply then restored the power about an hour later, and there it was, BR53, in the memory location where I deleted a loco. It is a complete mystery to me, but it is probably something silly causing it. I should look around for a more up to date controller. I will have to check around and see what is available. Between the two of us we will get to the bottom of this. I have not done a factory reset yet, I need going to make a note of which locos are registered in the first one before I do it. Best regards, Peter B.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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franciscohg		#84 Posted : 27 April 2017 20:13:39(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC) Posts: 3,272 Location: Patagonia		Well, the important thing is that your upgrade worked fine!
		German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
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mb300e4m		#85 Posted : 27 April 2017 23:36:20(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: mb300e4m Originally Posted by: franciscohg Hello Peter, it worked! Great! Have you tried resetting your MS2? I have only one that came with my son starter set, and i use it only as a slave in my CS2. IIRC sometimes they "forget" the locos, so they did not appear in the list but since they were registered, they dont register again. My experience with them as a main controller is very limited so i cannot give you other advice than reset it for now. Later i can explore more options using it as a main controller, had to find the ugly box first..... After I deleted a loco that I no longer have from my first MS2 and tried that memory location, MFX did not flash and it did not register it. So I unplugged the power supply then restored the power about an hour later, and there it was, BR53, in the memory location where I deleted a loco. It is a complete mystery to me, but it is probably something silly causing it. I should look around for a more up to date controller. I will have to check around and see what is available. Between the two of us we will get to the bottom of this. I may have found the answer. There seems to be a difference in the way that memory locations 1 to 10 store the data compared to number 11. On the screen, 1 to 10 have a + sign if they are empty, or a loco symbol if a loco has been memorised. Whereas number 11 does not have a + sign. It could be that numbers 1 to 10 will remember but not number 11. Is this correct, at least it is a plausible explanation until we know better even if it is all B.S? There is nothing in the instruction manual about this. Because all of the 10 memory locations were used up on both my MS2s, I first tried to use the number 11 one, but it did not stay when I killed the power.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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franciscohg		#86 Posted : 27 April 2017 23:51:59(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC) Posts: 3,272 Location: Patagonia		well, yes, you are absolutely right, you can register only 10 locos at one time, so the number 11 will be read, but not stored in any position (1 - 10) and as it is already registered it will not register again.... will make some experiments, IIRC there is a procedure to recall such registered locos
		German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
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mb300e4m		#87 Posted : 27 April 2017 23:54:44(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: franciscohg Well, the important thing is that your upgrade worked fine! Absolutely Francisco, I am so pleased that it did. It was a lot of wiring changes but I took my time and did not cut anything until I had checked and rechecked. It might have been easier if it had not been fitted with a 6090 decoder. The next one I do I will have a go at programming the decoder myself, I did purchase an ESU Programmer and have the software installed already. Now if I can figure out the anomaly with the MS2s or buy a later controller, I will be in good shape. I posted a possible explanation just now in a different post. Regards. Edited by user 28 April 2017 14:15:10(UTC)  | Reason: Typo.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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mb300e4m		#88 Posted : 28 April 2017 00:02:47(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Hi Francisco. I am going to put the loco body back on today or tomorrow, I have already buttoned up the tender, speaker and all. I was wondering how it would sound, it faces upwards right under the coal pile, and there is nowhere to allow the air waves to escape, but it sounds just fine as it is. I had seen one that had some small holes drilled in the coal, but have not heard how it sounds. I could not have done it without your help and guidance, thank you so much, I am indebted to you. Peter B.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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dickinsonj		#89 Posted : 28 April 2017 01:07:04(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,684 Location: Crozet, Virginia		Originally Posted by: mb300e4m Now if I can figure out the anomaly with the MS2s or buy a later controller, I will be in good shape. I recommend a more capable controller. I know they cost a lot of money but the newer decoders and your expanding collection are going to need at least a CS or ECoS to perform up to their potential. The latest, just replaced versions of either controller are quite capable and not too expensive on eBay. BTW I really liked your project, which came out very well. I have several similar projects on my to do list but time is tight at the moment so they will have to wait. But seeing one as successful as yours lets me imagine how nice my older locos will be once they are done also.
		Regards, Jim I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains! So many trains and so little time.
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mb300e4m		#90 Posted : 28 April 2017 01:37:19(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: dickinsonj Originally Posted by: mb300e4m Now if I can figure out the anomaly with the MS2s or buy a later controller, I will be in good shape. I recommend a more capable controller. I know they cost a lot of money but the newer decoders and your expanding collection are going to need at least a CS or ECoS to perform up to their potential. The latest, just replaced versions of either controller are quite capable and not too expensive on eBay. BTW I really liked your project, which came out very well. I have several similar projects on my to do list but time is tight at the moment so they will have to wait. But seeing one as successful as yours lets me imagine how nice my older locos will be once they are done also. Thanks Jim, I am going to look for another controller, I probably don't need the latest, but the MSs are dated now. I have to keep in mind that I collect and operate many different makes and types (see my profile) so I have to justify, somewhat, the cost of equipment specifically suited to only one brand. Although I understand that Marklin controllers will handle many brands of digital locos. I am glad you liked my project, there were a few occasions when I thought I would never get it done. But I succeeded with a great deal of help from a fellow forum member. Hopefully my project will encourage others to do likewise. If one can handle small tools, wire cutters and the right soldering iron, anything one sets one's mind to is possible. Get a good angle lamp, a magnifier and a small digital camera to take pictures as one goes along. I must have taken several hundred on this project alone. I have only one more task, and that is to install the micro relay for the dual smoke units. That will get done when my supply arrives in my mail box. Then she will be all ready for the "right away" at the next summer show here in Florida. Peter B. Edited by user 28 April 2017 20:51:20(UTC)  | Reason: Typo.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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franciscohg		#91 Posted : 28 April 2017 01:39:04(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC) Posts: 3,272 Location: Patagonia		It was my pleasure to help you! I had read of the holes in the tender, had it in mind, but never really need it.
		German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
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mb300e4m		#92 Posted : 28 April 2017 04:24:55(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: franciscohg It was my pleasure to help you! I had read of the holes in the tender, had it in mind, but never really need it. Hi Francisco, I had thought of it too, but have not done it yet. I will see how she performs on the show layout this summer. Thanks again, I don't think I could have gotten there without you; I owe you big time. Any time you find yourself in Florida, USA, message me. Peter B.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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jvuye		#93 Posted : 28 April 2017 08:04:50(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 01/03/2008(UTC) Posts: 2,881 Location: South Western France		Originally Posted by: mb300e4m Originally Posted by: franciscohg It was my pleasure to help you! I had read of the holes in the tender, had it in mind, but never really need it. Hi Francisco, I had thought of it too, but have not done it yet. I will see how she performs on the show layout this summer. Thanks again, I don't think I could have gotten there without you; I owe you big time. Any time you find yourself in Florida, USA, message me. Peter B. It was great to follow this thread and the step by step progress. I think it's wonderful to see two "perfect strangers" cooperating like this thousands and thousand of miles away! Peter, I do operate several different brands of trains too (Märklin, HAG, Roco, Liliput, Roxy, Metropolitan, Fulgurex, LS Models, REE, Rivarossi, Athearn, Kato, etc) but as for the digital conversions of all these models (accumulated over decades...) my approach is simple: 1° all Marklin locos since the year 2000 are left in their original digital format (i.e. motorola or mfx) 2° all "analog" older Märklin locos and other brands' have been converted to DCC, (now DCC + Railcom) and run with the so called "long addresses" (above 128) ) For over a decade I used the Uhlenbrock Intellibox, the first multistandard controller, but it did not support automatic detection and had no capacity to "memorize" the many locos in the inventory All of it now runs from an ESU ECOS 2, which was *at the time* way more stable and more predictable than any Märklin gear...and still is today! Having no hands on experience with M newest gear, I cannot however provide an opinion. Just my two cents! Cheers
		Jacques Vuye aka Dr.Eisenbahn Once a vandal, learned to be better and had great success!
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mb300e4m		#94 Posted : 28 April 2017 16:42:29(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: jvuye Originally Posted by: mb300e4m Originally Posted by: franciscohg It was my pleasure to help you! I had read of the holes in the tender, had it in mind, but never really need it. Hi Francisco, I had thought of it too, but have not done it yet. I will see how she performs on the show layout this summer. Thanks again, I don't think I could have gotten there without you; I owe you big time. Any time you find yourself in Florida, USA, message me. Peter B. It was great to follow this thread and the step by step progress. I think it's wonderful to see two "perfect strangers" cooperating like this thousands and thousand of miles away! Peter, I do operate several different brands of trains too (Märklin, HAG, Roco, Liliput, Roxy, Metropolitan, Fulgurex, LS Models, REE, Rivarossi, Athearn, Kato, etc) but as for the digital conversions of all these models (accumulated over decades...) my approach is simple: 1° all Marklin locos since the year 2000 are left in their original digital format (i.e. motorola or mfx) 2° all "analog" older Märklin locos and other brands' have been converted to DCC, (now DCC + Railcom) and run with the so called "long addresses" (above 128) ) For over a decade I used the Uhlenbrock Intellibox, the first multistandard controller, but it did not support automatic detection and had no capacity to "memorize" the many locos in the inventory All of it now runs from an ESU ECOS 2, which was *at the time* way more stable and more predictable than any Märklin gear...and still is today! Having no hands on experience with M newest gear, I cannot however provide an opinion. Just my two cents! Cheers Hello again Jacques, good to hear from you and I am glad you like the thread, it was almost a boarder-line photo essay. If it encourages others to get into Digital, then that is a bonus. Here she is all buttoned up awaiting the arrival and installation of an ESU relay to drive the dual smoke units. In the picture I am sure you will recognise some of the locos including a well used 3102. The red loco is a Trix Twin LMS 0-4-0 Tender Engine from 1938, she is 3 years younger than my oldest H0 locos from 1935. I have started my search for a replacement digital controller, however I do have an unused, new in the box, Digitrax Zephy Xtra DCS51 All In One Command Station; I need to get it out of the box and read up on it. Best regards, Peter B.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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mb300e4m		#95 Posted : 05 May 2017 22:36:23(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Thread update: I am still waiting on the ESU relays. Peter B.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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mb300e4m		#96 Posted : 06 May 2017 01:29:47(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: mb300e4m Thread update: I am still waiting on the ESU relays. Peter B. I just got word that the relays will ship tomorrow. $23 USD for six with shipping. Not too shabby, yes? Peter B.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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mb300e4m		#97 Posted : 11 May 2017 17:06:01(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: mb300e4m Originally Posted by: mb300e4m Thread update: I am still waiting on the ESU relays. Peter B. I just got word that the relays will ship tomorrow. $23 USD for six with shipping. Not too shabby, yes? Peter B. The relays arrived a few days ago, so on with the saga of the 3702 conversion. There is plenty of room in the tender for the relay. The "orange" wire coiled up in the corner is the feed to the center pins of the two smoke units and will be soldered to the relay pin 5. I need to find a supply of the same gauge wire that ESU use for their decoders and adapters. Can anyone tell me the wire gauge and suggest a supplier in the USA? The wire used for the original 6090 decoder in this loco is much too thick and although stranded, it is too stiff. Peter B.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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kiwiAlan		#98 Posted : 11 May 2017 17:12:22(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC) Posts: 8,109 Location: ENGLAND, Didcot		Originally Posted by: mb300e4m I need to find a supply of the same gauge wire that ESU use for their decoders and adapters. Can anyone tell me the wire gauge and suggest a supplier in the USA? The wire used for the original 6090 decoder in this loco is much too thick and although stranded, it is too stiff. Peter B. Brawa 324xx series, depending what colours you want.
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mb300e4m		#99 Posted : 11 May 2017 23:28:49(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC) Posts: 424 Location: Florida		Originally Posted by: kiwiAlan Originally Posted by: mb300e4m I need to find a supply of the same gauge wire that ESU use for their decoders and adapters. Can anyone tell me the wire gauge and suggest a supplier in the USA? The wire used for the original 6090 decoder in this loco is much too thick and although stranded, it is too stiff. Peter B. Brawa 324xx series, depending what colours you want. Thanks for the link it shows the specifications (gauge) of the wire, albeit in metric, but I can convert to wire gauge. I was looking for someone in the USA, as I have never had any luck getting anything out of Brawa, not even from the so called retailers on this continent. They don't seem interested in spare parts and so on but would much prefer one to buy a $500 loco. Nevertheless Alan, I do appreciate your help, it was a good starting point. I have spent a good part of the day googling for suppliers. I did find one who supplies what is probably the right gauge stranded wire for a great price; 100 feet for less than $6 USD in just about any colour one would need for wiring decoders. I have ordered some and if it works out, I will post a link here for others members on this side of the planet or anywhere else for that matter. Best regards to all at marklin-users.net. Peter B.
		Peter B. In Sunny Florida most of the time. Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
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ixldoc		#100 Posted : 12 May 2017 00:12:38(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 18/11/2015(UTC) Posts: 220 Location: Brisbane,Australia		Hi Peter, I use ESU wire AWG 36 which comes in 10 metre lengths and ten colours ( used in DCC work). They are in the ESU catalogue but I buy mine from our local retailer in Brisbane ( Australia). The code is 519xx eg 51941 is purple. For what it's worth the address on the cardboard insert in each packet is ESU LLC ,112 Pine Ave E, PO Box 77, Upsala MN 56384. I looked up Upsala MN in Google and it seems a small town but that is the address on the packets. Regards, Howard.
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