Yes, if the catenary is hung correctly. Although, I don't think our models make much heat. Long runnung may cause uneven wear if the overhead cable isn't staggered.

True, but each mast has two fixations-points; one for short arms, and one for long arms. So you still get the staggered overhead wire.
I suppose they thought it was a good idea to rationalize the production of mast like that... (Even my cheap Hobbex system has two different masts, so WTF¿?)

Yes, Sommerfeldt is still in business, or was when I looked at their website on Instagram a few months back. I think they may still supply to Marklin. Thye aren't far away from Goppigen.

Sommerfeldt provides pantographs to Maerklin, Hag and many other brands. Viessmann was chosen as the company to make the current Maerklin catenary system.
The Sommerfeldt catenary is much more fragile and requires a more complex assembly, whereas the Viessman masts still clip to the track and can be set up and taken down with relative ease. Sommerfeldt masts are anchored to the layout, and there is soldering involved, making takedown much more complex.


Regards

Mike C

Indeed is very worthwhile purchasing, as noted above by Legless

I posted on this five years ago :

https://www.marklin-user...rklin-Catalog#post507185

May I also point out that the Sommerfeldt Catenary system is not "much more fragile" but is very robust. It is the only system I have seen readily available that has a good representation of the structure of DB catenary and reflects the same functional aspects as true as possible to the prototype.

Good question, would be great if there was an English version

Like an instruction manual, Tom ? Good that it is bilingual !

Cheers,
Ranjit

May I please add a correction :

The current, up-to-date manual is only bi-lingual (apologies, Tom)

(The catalogue remains tri-lingual)

I've been using Sommerfeldt for donkey years and never had a problem with it, I think Märklin produces the best pantographs., most other brands, their spring isn't strong enogh to keep the wiper against the wire., meaning the are not suitable running locos from the oerhead system power.

Ranjit, to build and construct the Sommerfeldt catenary system is not a job for the faint hearted., you need certain skills an patience to construct an overhead system.
all masts are metal and you have a choice of wire gauges 03mm, 05mm and 07 mm., I'm using 07 gauge because it is robust and epeciallwhen using the overhead system as it was intended.,
also the myth about using a catenary when running digital trains is absolutely false and misleading, I've used it for over 40 years.
At one stage I've ordered just wires and constructed my own wires but since than, unfortunately I've realized I used an inferior flux which didn't keep the uprights from breaking away when handling trains., since than my son bought ready made wires and when I have time will replace the old ones, a lot of work turned out to be a waste of time.
the Sommerfeldt sytem is not cheap but on the other hand it lasts a life time., with the odd bump of a cross span mast (one particular it is very close to the edge of the board) I've repaired it about 4 times and it is still standing today.
the application of the catenary has shifted slightly over the years with more locos being produced authentically or prototypical and this includes the pantograph and the wipers width, the SBB system used wipers with a narrower wiper and this makes it it again harder to reproduce to acomodate the tollerance between left & right (staggered application).
so what was perfectly before has now become somewhat trouble some and there had been a lot of alterations to the allowed width which ment to adjust the arm to its right position but it also made it impossible to adjust the wire within a curve and the masts had to be relocated to its new position,
Yes we had a few unrepairable pantographs but in hindsight we've learned our lesson., we also had incidents whereas trains were running for month with a hitch and than for no reason at all another pantograph got hooked up., well this was until I've investigated the cause, in one incident the track had moved, in others the downwire got broken off from the bottom wire or other pantographs have a very sharp edge and any rough soldering spot got caught, this is the main reason we're changing it to ready made wires and the doldering point is limited to the mast where 2 wires are joined together.

I wouldn't recommend it for clumsy people as it needs adjustment to be aware there is an overhead system present and it takes some time to get used to it, its not an ideal situation when you change locos or wagons on a regular basis and we are still working on this how to overcome it.
its like with everthing else in life you have to live with it and except it., I wouldn't change anything and I couldn't see myself having electric locos without a catenary system, some people may have a different view of an overhead system but when you build one you never look back, the only think you regret the mistakes you've made in the past but with making mistakes you never can go forward with fresh and more constructive ideas.

John

Thank you, John, for your very detailed account of your "hands-on" experience using catenary systems for over forty (40) years !! I too agree with you that you can't run electric locomotives without a catenary system.

Take care and stay safe.

Ceers,
Ranjit

Hi Ranjit, thanks. The issue I have with the wires is that they get in the away and are out of scale. Even the fine scale 0.5mm wires are well oversize. I may yet decide to use them but I have a lot of scenery work to do and I am sure I would damage the wires if I put them up first. John's layout is a good example of how good the catenary can look if done right.

I am not going to power the catenary, it is purely cosmetic. I run the layout digitally through the track and will not change that. I do plan to add a restraining wire to the pantographs that will allow them to run in the up position near to where they would be if there were a wire.

Roger

Thanks Ranjit. I'll try to post some pictures soon.

Roger

Ranjit;

Give some thought to the cost of adding catenary. Build a rough spreadsheet of the masts needed paying particular attention to where you have multiple tracks. One particular curve of mine has 11 double masts ( Viessmann part 4160). Reynaulds prices those at 33 usd each and that is one curve. It can mount up. However, it is a great project and looks great.

Thanks

Referring back to the original post about the wire zig zagging to spread wear evenly on the top of the pantograph, this is important on the full size railway as the contact surface is carbon and does wear - the carbon part is replaced frequently. Much easier to replace than the miles of wire of course.
On miniature railways the contact is often plated metal and wear is not significant, the current is comparatively small.
Similarly do our HO or Z rails ever show wear? Or the wheels even? I once made some soft brass replacement wheels for a loco to see if I could detect any wear after prolonged running but all I saw was polished areas.
On the London Underground with its many sharp curves it has long been a delicate compromise between hardened wheels or hardened rails each having pros and cons. On British Railways wear of wheels and rails causes problems near insulated rail joints and powerful magnets have been installed at these joints to attract the filings to avoid short circuiting the IRJs, again, luckily that doesn’t affect us!
The sliders/skis do wear of course on HO three rail, perhaps the studs should zig zag.
ChisG

Hello Alan,

A very good observation.
I own this locomotive (39511) and am pleased to report it is supplied with an additional set of wide pantograph wipers wich the user can fit in lieu of the standard ones.
By the way, this is a stunning piece of modelling from Märklin in every respect.

Kimball

If you do decide to install the wires, here is a tip for making your life easy:
https://cabin-layout.mixmox.com/2002/05/catenary-guide.html

As hinted, I used to install the actual wires but found them to be:
a) too much in the way
b) easily bent via a small bump, and then cannot be straightened properly
c) unrealistic - too thick (even with the fine Sommerfeld profi wire, painted, etc.)

So on my new layout, I am only putting the masts up.

It looks fine, see first image at:
https://cabin-layout.mixmox.com/2016/11/distances-markers.html

It is cheaper.

And yes, the pantographs on the locos have to be run either in the down position or tied with a tiny thread.
And yes, you don't see little sparks (not that I would place wires in hidden areas to run power through the visible areas anyway).

Arguments for missing realism of this approach have to set aside that the model wires are simply too thick in HO scale to even start. See photographs of real trains photographed from 180' (2' in HO scale) and see of rarely one can see the wires!

sure, I used to think the same way.

Order enough for to do a trial stretch.
See how it looks.
Wait until it gets bumped, then try to straighten the wire.

Note how the realism has now gone out the window....

It is of course all a matter of personal choice, but seeing the masts along my mainline very convincingly persuades the viewer that there is a complete catenary system in place that resembles real life.

There is no doubt that Dale has "derailed" !!

Cheers,
Ranjit

Hi All...

Does anyone know if the MIBA Report 19 - Elektrische Leitungen by Lothar Wiegel (update by Bernd Zoellner/Bruno Kaiser) available in English ? If not, is there a translation of this publication in English ?

Cheers,
Ranjit

Hello Dale,

I am sorry for your experience with the wires.

Fortunately this has not been my experience, as detailed in the link provided at my earlier post # 12

Regards,

Philip

Of course, you may also touch base with John who has years of experience working with catenary systems, Dale. When you say, "Sommerfeld catenary is rock solid high quality stuff", and at the same time, you say, "it is simply impractical as the slightest bump bends the running wires", there must be something that you are not doing right. Check it out.

Take care and stay healthy.

Cheers,
Ranjit

The work you've undertaken is amazing,

Got it !