Hi

I don’t know that answer to your question, but I would like to know this also. I use always older style plugs with my Märklin Super 30 VA transformer (Märklin 6123). Here is a photo:



Best regards,
Janne

Edited by user 31 March 2020 18:36:10(UTC)  | Reason: Corrected 280 => 6123

I know that all my plugs from my original train set dating back to 1958 were the large type, but all the plugs I've bought since I restarted with Marklin in the mid eighties are the small ones.

Maybe we can look back through old catalogues to see when they changed?

Already done that, but not helpful. The images in the catalogues back then were not really photographs rather than good drawings.

There are two places the connectors are shown. The first is in the accessories sections where the plugs and sockets are listed by code.

They are also shown with Turnouts and generally in those images they are depicted as smaller, more in proportion to the newer 11mm style. But this may be nothing more than artistic rendering.

In fact, you can check catalogues back to the mid-50's to find examples of this which is what I did at first but to no avail - hence my post.

So rather than relying on the catalogues, it seems to me the most reliable check would be items with the plugs attached, where the item date is reasonably accurate such as the box date code.

Yes I know this method is not certain hen it comes to dating Loco's or Rolling stock, but on the other hand, it you have for example a boxed set of turnouts or similar item, and you know for certain (because you personally purchased it) that it's how it came, then if the item is dated 1960 and has the newer style 11mm connector, then it can be taken reasonably reliably as being available at least as early as that.

I believe I can say from certainty (from products of my own) that the smaller 11mm connectors were available at least pre-1970.

Personally, I suspect around the late 50's / early 60's to be the change, but may have been a little earlier.

Cookee,

Maybe you should look at the Hirschmann connectors range from that time. I know that H W Clarke, who were the Marklin agents in NZ back then imported the identical connectors from Hirschmann as that was a range they had an agency for, were probably cheaper than Marklin, and probably supplied them against the marklin catalogue numbers in NZ. Check to see if any of the coloured bodies have an 'H' on them, if so they are Hirschmann items.

Alan

Perhaps a small question fired off to Märklin may eventually get the answer.

I would guess the import licensing regime of the time would have forced this on H W Clarke to maximise the product they could import under each category of licence.

Another thing to note from your pictures is it looks like all the Hirschmann ones do not have the side entry to piggyback an extra connection on.

Edited by moderator 01 April 2020 11:11:36(UTC)  | Reason: Edited to not include Cookee's entire post, as we don't need to read it twice!

Hi Åke,

Yes I had considered that, around 1956/57 would be quite possible, hopefully some others with year-specific items might narrow this down.

Edited by moderator 01 April 2020 11:12:26(UTC)  | Reason: Edited to not include Åke's entire post, as we don't need to read it twice!

I had before a lot of Märklin 3600 tracks and all of these which had any connector plugs had those bigger connectors. 3600 tracks were made 1947-1956. First versions from 1947-1952 and second versions from 1952-1956.

I’m just reading my old Koll’s catalogue from 2012 and it has an interesting note in transformer 280 A version 2 (1955-1961). This 280 A second version (6113 with normal plugs) and (6173 with schuko plugs).

I use those bigger connectors with my transformer but it has ”6123” in it’s nameplate. Not 6113 but I think 6123 relates to that 6113 more than 6173. 6123 has also three connecting points like 6113 has.

More info of these old transformers in German:

https://tischbahn.de/ble...0er-jahre-im-ueberblick/

Cheers,
Janne

Yes, I see, and they look like they have the 'H' logo.



I know that feeling ...



I would guess they bought them in. I would think they would be buying large enough quantities that they could get them without the 'H' logo, but why they didn't put the 'M' logo on is puzzling. Maybe they got some back yard plastic molder to produce the coloured pieces and only got the metal bits from Hirschmann.

Hi

The Märklin plugs are very old indeed


The history from 1930 and on is as follows (I have no facts before 1930)

1. 1930-1938: 13491S, 13491M, 13491K
2. 1939-1949: 493S, 493M, 494 UG
3. 1950-1956: 490S, 490M, 490SQ
4. 1957-2002: 711x, 712x, 713x
5. 2002- : 71400 series

In the early years till 1960 there were as well ready made wires with one M and one F plug each side under various Cat. No

Also there were plugs without plastic cover ready on the wires not available separately, but already fitted on the wires of various accessories.

During the years and specially for the 71xx series (they are available till today) there many variations.

Take in mind the plugs from other manufactures and you will see that we must have too many variations

Regards

Costas

Thanks for that Markus, those are a very good item to compare from. I have only one motor, but it's from the early 70's so is no help for this exercise.

It helps confirm what I suspect which is that for my model, the large connectors would be correct. Plus of course M. would likely still have plenty of the larger older ones in their workshops as would many of the retailers.

UPDATE - And as Alan has also pointed out in the quiz thread, the Grey plug makes its first appearance in the 1957 catalogue and I've not (yet) seen any large Grey or White plugs so 1957 would appear to be the year of change, even perhaps progressively over the next year or two if they needed to run any old stocks down.

Edited by user 02 April 2020 10:26:16(UTC)  | Reason: Edited to not include Markus' entire post, as we don't need to read it twice!