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Offline LA2019  
#1 Posted : 18 June 2019 01:52:56(UTC)
LA2019

United States   
Joined: 18/11/2012(UTC)
Posts: 311
I'm thinking if adding a Kibri 39452 three bay roundhouse but without using a turntable for space reasons. I know it's probably not prototypical but I think I can use a C-track three way turnout to drive the loco's straight into the roundhouse. I've mocked up a what I'm thinking about with cardboard and some "paper" C track. Is there any reason I should not do this? Will there be any problems that I'm not seeing?

Any comments or ideas will be greatly appreciated!

ken


roundhouse
Ken
USofA
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Offline Bigdaddynz  
#2 Posted : 18 June 2019 02:26:41(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,661
Location: New Zealand
There's plenty of older M track plans in some of the old books that do this exact thing, so there's certainly nothing you're doing that hasn't been done before and certainly nothing you're doing wrong. As long as the tracks line up OK with the roundhouse doors there's no reason why you can't do this.
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Offline boitpo  
#3 Posted : 18 June 2019 06:29:06(UTC)
boitpo

New Zealand   
Joined: 29/05/2016(UTC)
Posts: 69
Location: Taupo
Good idea if you have reverse loops already and can turn locomotives around on them. Have thought of doing the same thing but wasn't sure with c track. Looks like it will work
Regards Stephen
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Offline applor  
#4 Posted : 18 June 2019 06:43:20(UTC)
applor

Australia   
Joined: 21/05/2004(UTC)
Posts: 1,653
Location: Brisbane, Queensland
I did this on my last layout, certainly not uncommon.

In fact in a lot of real scenarios you will see massive engine sheds with no turntable for repairs etc. Typically straight sheds though, you can easily do that instead of a roundhouse too.
modelling era IIIa (1951-1955) Germany
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Offline hxmiesa  
#5 Posted : 18 June 2019 09:14:48(UTC)
hxmiesa

Spain   
Joined: 15/12/2005(UTC)
Posts: 3,519
Location: Spain
Even if Märklin uses the roundhouse w.o. the turntable, I dont think it is prototipical correct.
Only in the cases where there once WAS a turntable, which was later removed, but the structures kept. In that case you would still need to model a kind of outline of the turntable installation, and thus almost nullifying the space-problem.
Best regards
Henrik Hoexbroe ("The Dane In Spain")
http://hoexbroe.tripod.com
Offline Alsterstreek  
#6 Posted : 18 June 2019 10:54:57(UTC)
Alsterstreek

Germany   
Joined: 16/11/2011(UTC)
Posts: 5,666
Location: Hybrid Home
Some standard gauge examples:

Leipzig-Leutzsch - roundhouse with two stalls, now abandoned, neither turnout nor turntable traces visible (switch to satellite modus):
https://www.google.de/ma...12%C2%B018'40.6%22E/@51.3558273,12.3117815,83m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x0:0x0!8m2!3d51.3557639!4d12.3112889

Zinnowitz - roundhouse with two stalls without turntable, still in use (switch to satellite modus):
https://www.google.de/ma...7454+Zinnowitz,+Germany/@54.0767037,13.8989639,532m/data=!3m2!1e3!4b1!4m5!3m4!1s0x47ab02237d9b2d03:0x5d984b20e25755f6!8m2!3d54.0767037!4d13.9011526

Greifswald: Already in the 1960s, the roundhouse was reduced to three stalls, and the turntable was removed. Two stalls kept connected to the central station via turnouts (the third stall entrance was bricked up). Last structures torn down at the beginning of the second millennium.
Source: https://www.tt-board.de/...heibe.28915/#post-473682
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Offline David Dewar  
#7 Posted : 18 June 2019 11:33:54(UTC)
David Dewar

Scotland   
Joined: 01/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 7,333
Location: Scotland
Some roundhouses are not good with C track going through the doors. However you can take away part of the C track ballast and it is OK.
Take care I like Marklin and will defend the worlds greatest model rail manufacturer.
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Offline Alsterstreek  
#8 Posted : 18 June 2019 17:14:16(UTC)
Alsterstreek

Germany   
Joined: 16/11/2011(UTC)
Posts: 5,666
Location: Hybrid Home
RLS1908Rwy-Handbook.png
What does the German 1908 "Handbuch des Eisenbahnwesens" [= Railway Hancbook], pg. 152 f. state?

"1. Locomotive roundhouse with turnout connection (figure 15). They are rare and are no longer being built at present."

Source:
https://books.google.pt/...enverbindung&f=false
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Offline dickinsonj  
#9 Posted : 19 June 2019 00:59:41(UTC)
dickinsonj

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC)
Posts: 1,676
Location: Crozet, Virginia
Originally Posted by: David Dewar Go to Quoted Post
Some roundhouses are not good with C track going through the doors. However you can take away part of the C track ballast and it is OK.


But the Märklin roundhouses are fine, correct?

I don't have either a roundhouse or a turntable yet butI might buy my first 3-segment roundhouse kit soon.
Regards,
Jim

I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains!
So many trains and so little time.
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Offline TEEWolf  
#10 Posted : 19 June 2019 19:24:22(UTC)
TEEWolf


Joined: 01/06/2016(UTC)
Posts: 2,465
Originally Posted by: LA2019 Go to Quoted Post
I'm thinking if adding a Kibri 39452 three bay roundhouse but without using a turntable for space reasons. I know it's probably not prototypical but I think I can use a C-track three way turnout to drive the loco's straight into the roundhouse. I've mocked up a what I'm thinking about with cardboard and some "paper" C track. Is there any reason I should not do this? Will there be any problems that I'm not seeing?

Any comments or ideas will be greatly appreciated!

ken


roundhouse


Are this still a roundhouse? I think it is more a 3 lane train shelter. I miss the roundnessBigGrin .
Offline LA2019  
#11 Posted : 20 June 2019 17:29:39(UTC)
LA2019

United States   
Joined: 18/11/2012(UTC)
Posts: 311
Originally Posted by: TEEWolf Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: LA2019 Go to Quoted Post


Are this still a roundhouse? I think it is more a 3 lane train shelter. I miss the roundnessBigGrin .



This is the kit I'm looking at. It may not be much of a roundhouse but it will do!



KI9452.jpg
Ken
USofA
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Offline TEEWolf  
#12 Posted : 20 June 2019 21:57:19(UTC)
TEEWolf


Joined: 01/06/2016(UTC)
Posts: 2,465
Originally Posted by: LA2019 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: TEEWolf Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: LA2019 Go to Quoted Post


Are this still a roundhouse? I think it is more a 3 lane train shelter. I miss the roundnessBigGrin .



This is the kit I'm looking at. It may not be much of a roundhouse but it will do!



KI9452.jpg


Of course it does. You are the English native speaker and my question to you, does it look like a ring in English?

For myself, more of interest is this house designed and constructed after the rail yard of Ottbergen. But that one is larger. Ottbergen is a small town between Kassel, Bielefeld, Hannover - oh or easier: quite near to Modellbahnshop Lippe (MSL) in Detmold.

https://www.google.de/ma...rgen,+37671+H%C3%B6xter/@51.7282548,9.246917,8.93z/data=!4m5!3m4!1s0x47bae3314f6508d5:0xa27f283d29fb160!8m2!3d51.7099452!4d9.3053818

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modellbundesbahn

And their website

https://www.modellbundesbahn.de/englisch

This yard is rebuilt as a MRR and plenty of videos you find at You Tube, like this one

At about 18:21 in this video you see their roundhouse.BigGrin





Have fun.
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Offline blid  
#13 Posted : 20 June 2019 22:24:10(UTC)
blid

Sweden   
Joined: 02/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 228
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
According to a Google check the angle is supposed to be 15 degrees. You have only about 12.
On my first layout I had the Marklin version of the roundhouse (also 15 degrees). After the 24630 I used a 24x15 followed by a 24206. You need to get the angle and distance correct to get thru the doors. To get the correct distance I can't remember if I used 24115 or 24215. Anyway, strange S-curves.
3-way roundhouse.JPG

Added: If the floor of your roundhouse is flat (Marklin's is not) the angel is max 15 degrees. Less is OK.

Edited by user 21 June 2019 10:21:13(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

OneGauge Marklin and MTH, ESU ECoS 2.1 on LGB tracks. MTH 3-rail 0-gauge, DCS on GarGraves tracks. Z: Rokuhan tracks, analog or DCC+TC Gold.
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Offline Alsterstreek  
#14 Posted : 21 June 2019 12:25:11(UTC)
Alsterstreek

Germany   
Joined: 16/11/2011(UTC)
Posts: 5,666
Location: Hybrid Home
On the occasion (abeit served by a roundtable), there is a three-bay roundhouse in Westerland/Sylt. At least since the end of the 1960s/beginning of the 1970s it has been like this. And looking at the map, there was never space for more than six bays. Furthermore, the status of the outer wall suggests that the roundhouse had only three bays from the onset.

Westerland-Sylt-RLS-DS (2).jpg
Source: Google Maps

A 1972 b/w photograph can be found here (see post #18):

http://www.bundesbahnzeit.de/seite.php?id=463
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Offline Alsterstreek  
#15 Posted : 21 June 2019 12:36:49(UTC)
Alsterstreek

Germany   
Joined: 16/11/2011(UTC)
Posts: 5,666
Location: Hybrid Home
And another one from the North of Germany: The four-bay roundhouse (again with turntable) in Heiligenhafen was erected in 1938, and remained like that until torn down in 1974.
Heiligenhafen-BW-RLS-DS.jpg
Sources:
https://www.sundfaehre.de
https://www.drehscheibe-online.de
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Offline kiwiAlan  
#16 Posted : 22 June 2019 21:30:51(UTC)
kiwiAlan

United Kingdom   
Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC)
Posts: 8,082
Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
Originally Posted by: Alsterstreek Go to Quoted Post
On the occasion (abeit served by a roundtable), there is a three-bay roundhouse in Westerland/Sylt. At least since the end of the 1960s/beginning of the 1970s it has been like this. And looking at the map, there was never space for more than six bays. Furthermore, the status of the outer wall suggests that the roundhouse had only three bays from the onset.

Westerland-Sylt-RLS-DS (2).jpg
Source: Google Maps

A 1972 b/w photograph can be found here (see post #18):

http://www.bundesbahnzeit.de/seite.php?id=463


There is actually four tracks going into the roundhouse, which matches the photo in the link you provided.

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Offline LA2019  
#17 Posted : 12 July 2019 01:20:25(UTC)
LA2019

United States   
Joined: 18/11/2012(UTC)
Posts: 311
I picked up a three-way switch and did a mock up with the roundhouse and all seems to be working fine. There is a slight curve to the track in the roundhouse but I'm OK with the way it looks. I did not have power to the tracks so I ran some passenger cars into the roundhouse with no problems. So far, so good.....

IMG_0803.jpg

IMG_0804.jpg
Ken
USofA
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Offline ocram63_uk  
#18 Posted : 14 July 2019 19:36:38(UTC)
ocram63_uk

United Kingdom   
Joined: 07/01/2015(UTC)
Posts: 704
Location: England, Suffolk
so, item 9452 doesn't come up o Kibri's website. I can't find it anywhere. where can I find info for this item ? Thank you
Offline kiwiAlan  
#19 Posted : 14 July 2019 21:24:20(UTC)
kiwiAlan

United Kingdom   
Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC)
Posts: 8,082
Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
Originally Posted by: ocram63_uk Go to Quoted Post
so, item 9452 doesn't come up o Kibri's website. I can't find it anywhere. where can I find info for this item ? Thank you


That is because Kibri are now owned by Viessmann. They have added another digit in front of the Kibri catalogue number to distinguish the Kibri component line within their catalogue.

See this link for the updated number.

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Offline ocram63_uk  
#20 Posted : 17 July 2019 10:04:48(UTC)
ocram63_uk

United Kingdom   
Joined: 07/01/2015(UTC)
Posts: 704
Location: England, Suffolk
Thank you very much. I have missed your reply :-(
Offline madhu.gn.71  
#21 Posted : 28 February 2020 13:16:35(UTC)
madhu.gn.71

India   
Joined: 16/04/2014(UTC)
Posts: 738
Location: Bangalore, India
Originally Posted by: LA2019 Go to Quoted Post


IMG_0804.jpg


Ken, could you post the track pieces with which you achieved this? I have a three way turnout and intend to do this as well

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Offline Alsterstreek  
#22 Posted : 28 February 2020 13:57:21(UTC)
Alsterstreek

Germany   
Joined: 16/11/2011(UTC)
Posts: 5,666
Location: Hybrid Home
Originally Posted by: madhu.gn.71 Go to Quoted Post
Ken, could you post the track pieces with which you achieved this? I have a three way turnout and intend to do this as well

According to post no. 1 Ken foresaw 24912 curves. And on the most recent photos it looks like he really employed them on the outer tracks.
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Offline Janne75  
#23 Posted : 01 March 2020 10:00:51(UTC)
Janne75

Finland   
Joined: 23/03/2012(UTC)
Posts: 2,550
Location: Finland
Hi all,

I have on my layout also a 3-way turnout with three-bay roundhouse. It works very well. Instead of using 24912 curved tracks as the outer rails I have straight tracks in the roundhouse and just short curved track pieces closest to that 3-way turnouts outer tracks. I can not remember what track piece these curved tracks are as they are permanently installed. But I did this installation around ten years ago and used the tracks Märklin recommended from C-track with this setup. I use Märklin three-bay roundhouse.

Cheers,
Janne
Märklin H0 digital layout. I have analog and digital H0 Collection. Rolling stock mostly from era I, II, III and IV. Märklin 1 gauge beginner.
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Offline madhu.gn.71  
#24 Posted : 01 March 2020 14:53:17(UTC)
madhu.gn.71

India   
Joined: 16/04/2014(UTC)
Posts: 738
Location: Bangalore, India
Originally Posted by: Alsterstreek Go to Quoted Post

According to post no. 1 Ken foresaw 24912 curves. And on the most recent photos it looks like he really employed them on the outer tracks.


Ak, since I don't have 24912, are there any other track combinations, which you can think of would let me achieve the same?

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Offline Alsterstreek  
#25 Posted : 01 March 2020 15:18:19(UTC)
Alsterstreek

Germany   
Joined: 16/11/2011(UTC)
Posts: 5,666
Location: Hybrid Home
In line with my slogan “never without my Maerklin 24206”: yes.
:o)

A German Maerklinista and owner of a Kibri “Ottbergen” three-stall roundhouse reported in a German forum that he uses the C track three way turnout and two 24206 C track pieces, one on each of the two outer tracks (and adjacent to the curved turnout “stubs”), respectively, to attain the correct angle(s).

Source: https://www.h0-modellbah...t-Weichen-befahrbar.html
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Offline madhu.gn.71  
#26 Posted : 02 March 2020 03:39:31(UTC)
madhu.gn.71

India   
Joined: 16/04/2014(UTC)
Posts: 738
Location: Bangalore, India
Oh yes! 24206. I do remember your famous line on 24206 that made me buy a box couple of years back. Let me explore this option. I'm not able to view the images in the above blog as they demand login I guess.
Regards,
Madhu
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Offline LA2019  
#27 Posted : 03 March 2020 16:52:22(UTC)
LA2019

United States   
Joined: 18/11/2012(UTC)
Posts: 311
Originally Posted by: madhu.gn.71 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: LA2019 Go to Quoted Post


Ken, could you post the track pieces with which you achieved this? I have a three way turnout and intend to do this as well






Madhu, the outer tracks are 24912 + 24094 while the inner is 24188 + 24172. The three final tracks inside the roundhouse were trimmed to size with my Dremel tool.


Ken
USofA
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Offline madhu.gn.71  
#28 Posted : 07 December 2022 10:20:38(UTC)
madhu.gn.71

India   
Joined: 16/04/2014(UTC)
Posts: 738
Location: Bangalore, India
After two years of discussing here, I build my setup. Even though this setup works perfectly fine, there is one glitch. One of the doors of the left\right bay brushes the C track bed. Two simple solutions to this, grind the surface of the track (which I plan to do) or file the bottom surface of the door. With the second approach there is a slight fear of messing up the symmetry of the doors.
Here is the setup. In the below pic you can spot the engine shed that I scratch built, that is almost to scale :)
Kibri_Mysetup.jpeg
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Offline Mark5  
#29 Posted : 07 December 2022 23:04:53(UTC)
Mark5

Canada   
Joined: 29/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,420
Location: Montreal, Canada
Originally Posted by: LA2019 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: madhu.gn.71 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: LA2019 Go to Quoted Post

Ken, could you post the track pieces with which you achieved this? I have a three way turnout and intend to do this as well



Madhu, the outer tracks are 24912 + 24094 while the inner is 24188 + 24172. The three final tracks inside the roundhouse were trimmed to size with my Dremel tool.



So it looks like you have the 3-bay roundhouse well in hand.
Nice work on the adjustments.

I was going to offer you my old Vollmer 3-bay house with a C-triple if needed. And I have an old m-track turntable to offer since I have decided on something quite different for my upcoming layout. If there is anyone else in need of these items, just make an offer. Anything will be considered if you are willing to pay the postage from Canada. The house is assembled, of course. My dad built it for us in the around 1970 and doors still appear to function quite well last i looked. I loved how they closed with just a nudge of the loco.

- Mark




DB DR FS NS SNCF c. 1950-65, fan of station architecture esp. from 1920-70.
In single point perspective, where do track lines meet?
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Offline madhu.gn.71  
#30 Posted : 12 December 2022 07:56:56(UTC)
madhu.gn.71

India   
Joined: 16/04/2014(UTC)
Posts: 738
Location: Bangalore, India
@Mark5, could you post a listing under "I want to sell.." section with details like price and pictures? Please ignore if already done\known.
Offline Alsterstreek  
#31 Posted : 18 February 2024 16:40:32(UTC)
Alsterstreek

Germany   
Joined: 16/11/2011(UTC)
Posts: 5,666
Location: Hybrid Home
Prototype example: I just found a three-bay roundhouse next to the "Lübeck Travemünde Hafen" train station.
IMG_5708.jpg
It even has a street address due to a car tyre shop residing there: Mühlenberg 2a, 23570 Lübeck
IMG_5709.jpg
Google Maps view:
LTHRH.jpg

Edited by user 19 February 2024 14:49:27(UTC)  | Reason: Photo fixed

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