Welcome to the forum   
Welcome Guest! To enable all features please Login or Register.

Notification

Icon
Error

Share
Options
View
Go to last post in this topic Go to first unread post in this topic
Offline oranda  
#1 Posted : 23 February 2021 11:30:26(UTC)
oranda

United Kingdom   
Joined: 21/04/2014(UTC)
Posts: 122
Location: ENGLAND
Just curious to know what happens when I shutdown my CS3+.

At the moment of a shutdown, does the CS3 also automatically create a save of all of its settings?

If so - is this save reloaded at the reboot/start of the CS3? And if so what is the file called?

Offline JohnjeanB  
#2 Posted : 23 February 2021 16:26:23(UTC)
JohnjeanB

France   
Joined: 04/02/2011(UTC)
Posts: 3,083
Location: Paris, France
Hi Oranda

I am far from being a specialist.
I believe the power down sequence is about finishing all editing and changes (MFX registration) and storing in final files.

So in the very large majority of cases, shutting off (without the power down) has no or little consequences. Edition lost, MFX registration lost or stuck.
It is NOT recommended because an abrupt stop during a memory clean-up (as computer do now) may have catastrophic consequences.
To know about the file details I suggest you look into the detail of back-up files (xx.zip). They include 2 folders: lokicons and work
The work directory contains 4 directories: config: locks; status; web
The config directory contains 6 directories: dev; fs (about routes); gbs (about track plan); lok (about locos definitions and CVs; mag (about magnetic devices); prefs (about selected preferences and the main station and on the slave station)

All the rest is about reverse engineering
Cheers
Jean
Offline Goofy  
#3 Posted : 23 February 2021 18:18:01(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 8,993
Originally Posted by: oranda Go to Quoted Post
Just curious to know what happens when I shutdown my CS3+.

At the moment of a shutdown, does the CS3 also automatically create a save of all of its settings?

If so - is this save reloaded at the reboot/start of the CS3? And if so what is the file called?



If you change some settings in the locomotive you must click on the upper right corner to confirm accept.
This way you did save the settings of the locomotive.
When you shut the CS3/CS3+ power off the system save all data.
But you must do correct way when you shut the system off.
I do see CS3 system are strangely designed by Märklin if we shall discuss about soft program.
The CS3 is excessive system in my opinion.

H0
DCC = Digital Command Control
Offline Mark5  
#4 Posted : 29 December 2022 23:32:28(UTC)
Mark5

Canada   
Joined: 29/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,420
Location: Montreal, Canada
Hello All,

Finally getting a few days here to try working with my CS3 after just trying to go through the book.

A couple of problems:
1)
I feel a bit dumb as I do not find a setting to restart or power down the system/CS3.
I don't want to just unplug the CS3, unless that is my only option.
As it indicated a power overload, I did unplug the wire from the track though.
(Edit: I found shutdown and restart in settings, must of just been distracted Huh )

So just for context, after adding a few locos on a programming track,
I then tried connecting it to a newly set up C-track layout and it says it has a power overload so I should restart.
What are the main causes for an overload? As in a short? I will probably just simplify the layout and/or test independently the switches that have built in decoders. Any suggestions of other track problems?

2)
As for success on the programming track... Addresses I knew worked out fine with an E103 and an E40. Although now the E103 lights flicker and I don't remember them doing that before with the 6021, although they might have. Also a shunter using a 60760 decoder also has light flickering.

Then on the programming track I put a 39758, BR 75.4. New from the shop with multiple sound functions and MFX decoder. The loco says it was reading successfully, as it read it does tiny jerking movements on the programming track. I then selected an address, wrote in my labels, clicked the check mark and seemed to save. However after first attempt I thought the address I chose was something it didn't like or I did something wrong. Then after leaving it a bit, I noticed it had added the item to the loco list without my having to enter in any labels and then all the sound functions and throttle worked as expected. (Sounds loud enough for my daughter to come out of her room and think I was watching a movie BigGrin) I then deleted the second entry that I had attempted to add manually in order to get the label I wanted. Later I added a more specific label to the automatic entry into BR 75.4 instead of BR75 and the image went poof. Re-added the image, saved and then took a minute to save, and then it worked.

So guess this may sound obvious but is just putting an mFX loco on the track and waiting without attempting to add it the best way to do it?
I know the book says using a programming track is unnecessary for mFX but I am just thinking of when I add locos to the list since I would like to have my lists read in a certain way. Guess I will do that next time and just edit later.

Any help or pointers wrt to track issues and/or lists would be greatly appreciated.

Happy Holidays!
Mark
DB DR FS NS SNCF c. 1950-65, fan of station architecture esp. from 1920-70.
In single point perspective, where do track lines meet?
Offline kiwiAlan  
#5 Posted : 30 December 2022 00:22:44(UTC)
kiwiAlan

United Kingdom   
Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC)
Posts: 8,082
Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
Originally Posted by: Mark5 Go to Quoted Post

...
So just for context, after adding a few locos on a programming track,
I then tried connecting it to a newly set up C-track layout and it says it has a power overload so I should restart.
What are the main causes for an overload? As in a short? I will probably just simplify the layout and/or test independently the switches that have built in decoders. Any suggestions of other track problems?


I would break the track up into sections, then add them back a section at a time. I do wonder in the tongues under the track that make connections between the sections have managed to get badly bent, although that would take some doing.

Originally Posted by: Mark5 Go to Quoted Post

2)
As for success on the programming track... Addresses I knew worked out fine with an E103 and an E40. Although now the E103 lights flicker and I don't remember them doing that before with the 6021, although they might have. Also a shunter using a 60760 decoder also has light flickering.

Then on the programming track I put a 39758, BR 75.4. New from the shop with multiple sound functions and MFX decoder. The loco says it was reading successfully, as it read it does tiny jerking movements on the programming track.


The loco jerking sounds like it was reading a DCC address, or maybe it would do that reading an MM address, but I haven't ever observed a loco do that reading an MM address. But yes, with an nfx loco just put it on the track or programming track, and let the controller find it. It will then set up all the icons for the various functions and put the loco in the database.

As for your locos with blinking lights, this typically happened with early decoders where one wire went to the bulbs, and the other side of the bulb is connected to the chassis, due to a peculiarity in the Marklin data transmission. But I have also observed it happen with a railcar that didn't blink the lights on an older controller, but they blinked quite badly on a system with mfx signal.



thanks 1 user liked this useful post by kiwiAlan
Offline Mark5  
#6 Posted : 30 December 2022 02:52:10(UTC)
Mark5

Canada   
Joined: 29/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,420
Location: Montreal, Canada
Thanks for that Alan,

I have added a few addresses from switches and it seems better. However I am finding the menus buggy. I have resorted to using a mouse only but still find it a bit buggy. I had to restart because I cant quite find how to save the solenoid article list and make the menu disappear. When I rebooted the few addresses I set had vanished but loco list was fine.

I did find one track not tightly fitted, but it may have been the order in which I started and put attached the plug while the CS was running. Not my standard practice.

[later edit] So still finding the solenoid article list not very responsive. i did manage to open and close the edit menu now. I see you just click where green dot is and it collapses. A different kind of navigability. However I find that sometimes requires multiple clicks to get the solenoid to move. The solenoid itself seems fine, just the software seems occasionally slow to respond or not at all.

Originally Posted by: kiwiAlan Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Mark5 Go to Quoted Post

[.....]
or test independently the switches that have built in decoders. Any suggestions of other track problems?


I would break the track up into sections, then add them back a section at a time.
[...]

Originally Posted by: Mark5 Go to Quoted Post

2)
[...]
light flickering.
[...]
as it read it does tiny jerking movements on the programming track.


The loco jerking sounds like it was reading a DCC address, or maybe it would do that reading an MM address, but I haven't ever observed a loco do that reading an MM address. But yes, with an mfx loco just put it on the track or programming track, and let the controller find it. It will then set up all the icons for the various functions and put the loco in the database.

As for your locos with blinking lights, this typically happened with early decoders where one wire went to the bulbs, and the other side of the bulb is connected to the chassis, due to a peculiarity in the Marklin data transmission. But I have also observed it happen with a railcar that didn't blink the lights on an older controller, but they blinked quite badly on a system with mfx signal.


Yes, it seems to have read it as a DCC but it was mFX. Might be since i had it on the programming track. idk

Do you know a way to rewire or change lights to remedy the blinking?

Thanks again
Mark
DB DR FS NS SNCF c. 1950-65, fan of station architecture esp. from 1920-70.
In single point perspective, where do track lines meet?
Offline Goofy  
#7 Posted : 30 December 2022 08:08:26(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 8,993
Try to reset locomotive by visit adress CV 8 and write 8 in value.
H0
DCC = Digital Command Control
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Goofy
Offline marklinist5999  
#8 Posted : 30 December 2022 12:57:01(UTC)
marklinist5999

United States   
Joined: 10/02/2021(UTC)
Posts: 3,070
Location: Michigan, Troy
Note; I shut down my CS3 from the system screen, not the stop bar, just as you do a computer.
thanks 2 users liked this useful post by marklinist5999
Offline rhfil  
#9 Posted : 30 December 2022 17:37:51(UTC)
rhfil

United States   
Joined: 05/09/2014(UTC)
Posts: 422
Location: NEW HAMPSHIRE, Somersworth
From someone who has been all through this, the first thing you want to do is download the CS3 manual onto your computer: https://www.maerklin.de/...tal-book-cs3-software-20
Entering a loco into the CS3 depends on what protocol the loco decoder has. Any mfx loco will be found by the CS3 if it is on the layout. Does not need to be on a programming track. The others should be on a programming track. You should never shut down the CS3 by disconnecting the power supply. Always do a shutdown. If there is a short fix that before you shut down. In most instances it will be a derailment. You should immediately begin practicing safe computer sex by creating a restore file. That is simplest done by entering the date into the save name of the file. It is even better to get a thumb drive and do the same there. That way if things really go to hell you can bring back the system before that happened by using the restore feature to bring back the system on the date you last made a restore file before the problem. If you look on the screen when you select "System" and "System" and "Save" you should see the save file "cs3-backup-001.zip". That is the file, unless you change it, that the CS3 saves to and uses at start up each time. Apparently one with "leer" is the one the CS3 uses for a factory reset. I have asked the Marklin Dudes to make a video on best practices which includes explaining what each of the files listed has in it. Too many users of the CS3, which in my mind is absolutey the best train controller out there right now, have no idea how to do all of the above.
thanks 3 users liked this useful post by rhfil
Offline dickinsonj  
#10 Posted : 31 December 2022 01:37:20(UTC)
dickinsonj

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC)
Posts: 1,676
Location: Crozet, Virginia
Good post rhfil.

I am a software professional and find myself at a loss with the Marklin interfaces way too often. Luckily I have the skills to sort it out but you should not have to be a software developer to make this stuff work.

As has long been the case, Marklin's API is rich but incredibly poorly documented, and I suspect that is on purpose. If the Marklin Dudes could pull together a solid overview of the file structure it would be a great help to a whole lot of users.
Regards,
Jim

I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains!
So many trains and so little time.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by dickinsonj
Offline Goofy  
#11 Posted : 31 December 2022 08:56:26(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 8,993
Märklin do have sometimes bad service with information about CS3.
Theirs latest upgraded version was april month and nothing has been informed since then.
When i shutdown my CS3 i follow step by step before shut the power feeder off too.

By the way...i think there will be changed system by Märklin but what is it i don´t know.
Possible new soft program or a new digital box by use mobil devices as cab control or via PC.
H0
DCC = Digital Command Control
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Goofy
Offline Mark5  
#12 Posted : 31 December 2022 09:45:48(UTC)
Mark5

Canada   
Joined: 29/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,420
Location: Montreal, Canada
Thank you for that.

Yes, found shutdown and backup. Have yet to back up to thumb drive.
I have a bunch of other locos to load in, but only a few a day.
Lots to learn and was a great test of patience to work with while showing a couple of friends.
Interesting to see the limits of patience but fun to see how they were delighted with the sequence of sounds.

Today we had a good day of sharing what we do have with friends.
Originally Posted by: rhfil Go to Quoted Post
From someone who has been all through this, the first thing you want to do is download the CS3 manual onto your computer: https://www.maerklin.de/...tal-book-cs3-software-20
Entering a loco into the CS3 depends on what protocol the loco decoder has. Any mfx loco will be found by the CS3 if it is on the layout. Does not need to be on a programming track. The others should be on a programming track. You should never shut down the CS3 by disconnecting the power supply. Always do a shutdown. If there is a short fix that before you shut down. In most instances it will be a derailment. You should immediately begin practicing safe computer sex by creating a restore file. That is simplest done by entering the date into the save name of the file. It is even better to get a thumb drive and do the same there. That way if things really go to hell you can bring back the system before that happened by using the restore feature to bring back the system on the date you last made a restore file before the problem. If you look on the screen when you select "System" and "System" and "Save" you should see the save file "cs3-backup-001.zip". That is the file, unless you change it, that the CS3 saves to and uses at start up each time. Apparently one with "leer" is the one the CS3 uses for a factory reset. I have asked the Marklin Dudes to make a video on best practices which includes explaining what each of the files listed has in it. Too many users of the CS3, which in my mind is absolutey the best train controller out there right now, have no idea how to do all of the above.


DB DR FS NS SNCF c. 1950-65, fan of station architecture esp. from 1920-70.
In single point perspective, where do track lines meet?
Offline Mark5  
#13 Posted : 31 December 2022 09:52:00(UTC)
Mark5

Canada   
Joined: 29/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,420
Location: Montreal, Canada
Originally Posted by: dickinsonj Go to Quoted Post
Good post rhfil.

I am a software professional and find myself at a loss with the Marklin interfaces way too often. Luckily I have the skills to sort it out but you should not have to be a software developer to make this stuff work.

As has long been the case, Marklin's API is rich but incredibly poorly documented, and I suspect that is on purpose. If the Marklin Dudes could pull together a solid overview of the file structure it would be a great help to a whole lot of users.


As they use a Linux build, is there a way to read the main directory of files??
Some way of going to a Shell or DOS type prompt line?

I am not a programmer but have fiddled around with computers for years and done a few box builds, so I get a bit about structure. HOWEVER, if the GUI is not as user friendly as it could be, then somethings should change. I might start looking at videos but I much prefer text-based tutorials and FAQs. Watching Video steps for setups can get tedious.

Thanks again for feedback.

DB DR FS NS SNCF c. 1950-65, fan of station architecture esp. from 1920-70.
In single point perspective, where do track lines meet?
Offline rhfil  
#14 Posted : 31 December 2022 14:27:59(UTC)
rhfil

United States   
Joined: 05/09/2014(UTC)
Posts: 422
Location: NEW HAMPSHIRE, Somersworth
There is a user manual 03093 which is quite good. If you select "Restore" it brings up a bunch of files but do not go any further as it default restores to the factory setting. I have found it great to bring up a YouTube video on my laptop or iPad while at the CS3. That way I can follow as fast or slow as I choose. I stop the video at each step and do not go ahead until I have achieved the exact same display as on the video. Sometimes I need to go back to see if I missed something. And if the instructor is long winded I can go ahead to the next step.
The range of capabilities of the CS3 is truly amazing. I love being able to adjust the functions. Every one of my locos has the long whistle changed from on/off to a time so that I do not have to turn it off each time. And then there is the "Event" feature - a whole world in itself.
thanks 2 users liked this useful post by rhfil
Offline marklinist5999  
#15 Posted : 31 December 2022 16:16:50(UTC)
marklinist5999

United States   
Joined: 10/02/2021(UTC)
Posts: 3,070
Location: Michigan, Troy
Which I too reccomend!
Offline Mark5  
#16 Posted : 31 December 2022 16:32:35(UTC)
Mark5

Canada   
Joined: 29/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,420
Location: Montreal, Canada
Yes, I have the book. Its packed with good stuff and essential imho.
DB DR FS NS SNCF c. 1950-65, fan of station architecture esp. from 1920-70.
In single point perspective, where do track lines meet?
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Mark5
Offline kiwiAlan  
#17 Posted : 31 December 2022 19:47:35(UTC)
kiwiAlan

United Kingdom   
Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC)
Posts: 8,082
Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
Originally Posted by: Mark5 Go to Quoted Post

As they use a Linux build, is there a way to read the main directory of files??
Some way of going to a Shell or DOS type prompt line?


No, they have it well password locked down. You can telnet in but unless you know the user names and passwords you won't get any further.

thanks 2 users liked this useful post by kiwiAlan
Offline dickinsonj  
#18 Posted : 01 January 2023 01:09:34(UTC)
dickinsonj

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC)
Posts: 1,676
Location: Crozet, Virginia
Originally Posted by: kiwiAlan Go to Quoted Post

No, they have it well password locked down. You can telnet in but unless you know the user names and passwords you won't get any further.


Marklin digital security for their system makes my former employer, the NSA, look lax,

The factory decoders are locked down tight and can't be updated, except for firmware. You can make CV updates with a controller, but if you want or need full control, what you need is a new decoder. Thanks Marklin, I like you too.

At least it gives you the chance to get an ESU decoder, which is a nice upgrade anyway.

Edited by user 01 January 2023 14:54:55(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Regards,
Jim

I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains!
So many trains and so little time.
thanks 2 users liked this useful post by dickinsonj
Offline marklinist5999  
#19 Posted : 01 January 2023 14:05:10(UTC)
marklinist5999

United States   
Joined: 10/02/2021(UTC)
Posts: 3,070
Location: Michigan, Troy
So then what benefit does a decoder firmware update provide?
Offline kiwiAlan  
#20 Posted : 01 January 2023 14:29:32(UTC)
kiwiAlan

United Kingdom   
Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC)
Posts: 8,082
Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
Originally Posted by: marklinist5999 Go to Quoted Post
So then what benefit does a decoder firmware update provide?


Fixes of software problems in the decoder. Addition of new features to a decoder (not so important to existing installed decoders)

There is a thread by Clapcott where he keeps track of the revisions of decoder software, but I couldn't find it on a quick search.

thanks 3 users liked this useful post by kiwiAlan
Users browsing this topic
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

| Powered by YAF.NET | YAF.NET © 2003-2024, Yet Another Forum.NET
This page was generated in 0.677 seconds.