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Offline Jabez  
#1 Posted : 08 October 2016 01:00:53(UTC)
Jabez

Belgium   
Joined: 30/08/2016(UTC)
Posts: 636
Location: Brussels
Are there any problems in running Roco or Fleischmann AC digital locos on Maerklin digital layouts?
I have researched past posts here and the answer appears to be that there are no problems.
I just ask because I would like a more current confirmation that this is the case.
(I have my eye on the Fleischmann 394673 KPEV tank loco. It's a little beauty.)
Thanks
Jabez
I heard that lonesome whistle blow. Hank Williams
Offline baggio  
#2 Posted : 08 October 2016 04:10:53(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
On the Italian site 3Rotaie they always talk about non-Marklin AC locos and there has never been any suggestion they don't work well that I know of.

Don't forget that in HO Marklin is the ONLY AC brand, so an AC loco by necessity has to run properly on a Marklin layout since there is no other layout to run on.

In fact, you are now making me think that I should myself buy a non-Marklin AC loco to add to my Marklin digital collection. (My 2-rail collection is analogue, albeit I have two digital 2-rail locos).

I would buy without hesitation if the loco is otherwise worth the money. Roco is at least as good as Marklin as an overall brand.

My 2 cents' worth.
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Offline applor  
#3 Posted : 08 October 2016 04:41:34(UTC)
applor

Australia   
Joined: 21/05/2004(UTC)
Posts: 1,653
Location: Brisbane, Queensland
They are sold specifically for use on Marklin.

If you are running C or K track you shouldn't have problems.
You may have issues with M track because it is old and design tolerances were different and the other possible issue is tight radius curves (R1).
modelling era IIIa (1951-1955) Germany
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Offline baggio  
#4 Posted : 08 October 2016 04:49:08(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
One warning about Roco radius specifications.

In 2-rail, Roco R2 is the equivalent of Marklin R1; Roco R3 is the equivalent of Marklin R2.

This is because Roco realizes that the smaller radius even if discontinued, still exists. Marklin for some reason in its measurements forgot about the smallest radius.

As a result, just check the actual measurement of the minimum radius that the loco you want to buy needs to run well and you will not have any problems.
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Offline Harryv40  
#5 Posted : 08 October 2016 09:30:53(UTC)
Harryv40

United Kingdom   
Joined: 07/08/2015(UTC)
Posts: 242
Location: Wilshire
Hi,
Re Roco locos,
I had a small problem earlier this week, RayF helped me, I managed to get The Marklin Digital System and DCC out of alignment, the lights started flashing and the loco ran in jerks.
I had to delete the loco and reinstall it, it now works ok, apart from the lights don't work, so it needs further investigation.
It's important to make sure the settings are the same for both systems, I was using my Mobile Station 2.

Harry

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Offline dennisb  
#6 Posted : 08 October 2016 10:03:31(UTC)
dennisb

Sweden   
Joined: 21/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 217
Location: Kronoberg
I love many of the Roco locos. They run very smooth compared to the Märklin equivalent. The sound is also many times more powerful. I often choose Roco before Märklin when it comes to locos, I really like them! never had any issues with the brand.

The one thing that to me is very strange is that Roco has much more silent pick up shoes than Märklin. One would expect it to be the other way around.

//Dennis
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Offline H0  
#7 Posted : 08 October 2016 10:08:39(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: Harryv40 Go to Quoted Post
It's important to make sure the settings are the same for both systems
It's important to select settings that have no conflicts.

I always use addresses greater than 255 for locos that support DCC.
With some Uhlenschrott decoders you have to disable analogue mode if you use a multi-protocol environment with mfx.
Current RoFl models should have Zimo decoders and should not be affected by this issue.

Follow some simple recommended practices and there will be no problems.

Roco make the better centre rail pickups and they also have better couplers, better details, better sounds.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline baggio  
#8 Posted : 08 October 2016 13:41:03(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Roco make the better centre rail pickups and they also have better couplers, better details, better sounds


Then WHY are we buying Markin locos? Confused
Offline baggio  
#9 Posted : 08 October 2016 13:50:52(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
By the way, Eroncelli (a supervisor on 3Rotaie and who is also a member of this forum) indicated upon my request on point that he, too, has had no problems with Roco or Fleischmann locos that were born for 3 rails.

So go out, buy a nice loco, and send us pictures of what you got and maybe a video. BigGrin ThumpUp

What I personally find interesting is that Roco still makes ANALOGUE 3 rail locos.

However, this also means that one needs to be careful in reading the ads since it is far from clear if the loco you see has a decoder or not. Even the digital reference often simply means "digital ready". The price and lack of sounds should guide you (or better still, ask the seller before you buy).
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Offline H0  
#10 Posted : 08 October 2016 15:08:20(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post
What I personally find interesting is that Roco still makes ANALOGUE 3 rail locos.
Really? Examples?
I haven't seen new analogue three-rail locos for Märklin AC for a long time (not counting Trix three-rail).
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline baggio  
#11 Posted : 08 October 2016 15:13:02(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
Offline Sparrow  
#12 Posted : 08 October 2016 15:44:44(UTC)
Sparrow

Spain   
Joined: 05/09/2011(UTC)
Posts: 219
I was born ¨three railer", and never have really felt the need to change to 2 rail, but being spanish, and loving spanish railroad, I have only two choices: shifting to 2 rail operation or modifying 2 rail locos to Märklin standard. Since I have no place to build two layouts, or incorporate two separate lines on my rather small layout, I had to choose the latter option. I have converted many 2 rail locos to 3 rail with very good results. The only problem is, some times, the lack of free space below the loco to allow for the elevation of the slider on turnouts. Most of the time I have been able to resolve the problem by using low profile sliders and/or carving a reccess in the loco chassis for each of the slider ends. DCC operation has always been flawless with my MS 2s.
Best regards.
Luis.
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Offline Unholz  
#13 Posted : 08 October 2016 16:02:03(UTC)
Unholz

Switzerland   
Joined: 29/07/2007(UTC)
Posts: 1,391
Location: Switzerland
Originally Posted by: Jabez Go to Quoted Post
Are there any problems in running Roco or Fleischmann AC digital locos on Maerklin digital layouts?


I have never had any problems with a Fleischmann AC digital sound loco on Marklin C track.

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Offline David Dewar  
#14 Posted : 08 October 2016 19:11:46(UTC)
David Dewar

Scotland   
Joined: 01/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 7,332
Location: Scotland
I have Brawa locos and they run very well on Marklin C track. They are expensive but detail is good and running qualities are excellent. I normally buy Marklin to support the brand.
Take care I like Marklin and will defend the worlds greatest model rail manufacturer.
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Offline Jabez  
#15 Posted : 08 October 2016 23:13:30(UTC)
Jabez

Belgium   
Joined: 30/08/2016(UTC)
Posts: 636
Location: Brussels
Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post
One warning about Roco radius specifications.

In 2-rail, Roco R2 is the equivalent of Marklin R1; Roco R3 is the equivalent of Marklin R2.

This is because Roco realizes that the smaller radius even if discontinued, still exists. Marklin for some reason in its measurements forgot about the smallest radius.


Yep, I noticed these Roco radius warnings for some locos.
Maerklin used to make an even smaller radius than R1 in the old M-track. I think they called it industrial radius or similar. I'm sure I have a complete circle or more of such curves amongst my old M-tracks.

I heard that lonesome whistle blow. Hank Williams
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Offline Jabez  
#16 Posted : 08 October 2016 23:27:19(UTC)
Jabez

Belgium   
Joined: 30/08/2016(UTC)
Posts: 636
Location: Brussels
Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post

Then WHY are we buying Markin locos? Confused

Good question. I suppose it is because M owns the three-rail AC territory and naturally offers a greater variety of locos for this system than the limited offerings of other mnfrs. But this certainly shouldn't blind us to the possibilities and even advantages of using other brands where attractive locos are available and compatibility exists.
This, I guess, was the feeling behind my original question here.

I heard that lonesome whistle blow. Hank Williams
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Offline kiwiAlan  
#17 Posted : 09 October 2016 00:11:21(UTC)
kiwiAlan

United Kingdom   
Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC)
Posts: 8,082
Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post


Every one of those is "AC Digital", "AC Digital with sound" or "Marklin AC Digital"

Not one of them is AC only. In two cases the title is that long that only the "AC" shows in that list, but as soon as you open the item it is absolutely clear that it is "AC Digital".

As far as I am aware for at least the last 20 or more years any non-Marklin manufactured AC capable loco has had a digital decoder simply because that was the cheapest way to drive a DC motor that all these locos used - the possible exception is Hag who i believe may have used universal motors similar to Marklin.
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H0
Offline baggio  
#18 Posted : 09 October 2016 01:51:21(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
"Every one of those is "AC Digital", "AC Digital with sound" or "Marklin AC Digital"

Not one of them is AC only. In two cases the title is that long that only the "AC" shows in that list, but as soon as you open the item it is absolutely clear that it is "AC Digital".

If you read the description, none of them says it has a decoder.

If they do not say "sound" it's VERY unlikely they have a decoder. I think these locos are "digital ready". For the money asked, it seems so.

You could write to the seller, but they are unlikely to respond, especially considering they are moving away from the Vancouver area.

You are welcome to buy one and tell us what happens.

This is my 2 cents' worth.
Offline H0  
#19 Posted : 09 October 2016 08:40:38(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post
If you read the description, none of them says it has a decoder.
So "AC Digital" indicates analogue locos without a decoder?
Have you checked any of those "analogue" locos on roco.cc?

How can they be "digital" without a decoder? Truly analogue locos are only "digital ready".
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline H0  
#20 Posted : 09 October 2016 09:05:06(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post
Then WHY are we buying Markin locos? Confused
There are different preferences.
And even the Märklin products vary a lot from cheap plastic models to finely detailed high-end models.
And you may find that Hornby models run faster than Märklin models.

Who is "we"? Are "we" still buying Märklin?

My latest Märklin loco came with a discount of almost 54% below RRP. At that price I thought it was acceptable value for the money. That might have been in 2015.
Before that I bought some highly discounted Märklin models with three-pole motors and lousy decoders. I consider those unacceptable value for the money and since them I am very cautious when it comes to buying Märklin. No more loco pre-orders. I want to see reviews before placing my order.

2012 was the last year when I pre-ordered new Märklin locos from the new items brochure. Back then they still had SDS models in the new items brochure.
I do care about the motor and the decoder I get - and the price I have to pay.

I bought some "Märklin" freight cars this year. Two affordable gondolas from split starter sets and three Tillig tank cars that came in Märklin boxes. Does that count as Märklin or as Tillig?

What "we" buy in Märklin boxes can be Tillig, Fleischmann, or whatever.

We are not limited to buying "Märklin only" even if we are using Märklin tracks.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline ilekrib  
#21 Posted : 09 October 2016 18:33:36(UTC)
ilekrib

Norway   
Joined: 04/02/2015(UTC)
Posts: 3
Location: Hordaland, Bergen
Hallo
I got Fleischmann ice 3 br 407
Runs perfect

Vidar

IMG_1465.JPG
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Offline mike c  
#22 Posted : 09 October 2016 20:23:03(UTC)
mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 7,880
Location: Montreal, QC
Ever since the 1980s, most DC companies who release models for 3 Rail AC have released what are basically DC models with electronic circuit that converts AC to DC and understands the Maerklin inversion pulse and reverses polarity so that the locomotive reverses. Since the mid 1990s, those electronic circuits have been replaced by digital decoders, which allow for digital control but still fulfill the same function in analog operation. As of a decade ago, Roco and many other companies have completely stopped the manufacture of AC analog models or analog models with optional (user installed) decoder. Today, the companies offer fully digital ready locomotives and the trend is now more and more towards offering full digital with sound.

Most companies manufacture their AC models with wheelsets for the Maerklin profile. Some may still have slight differences in wheel spacing or in flange height, but you will find little trouble with these locomotives on K or C track. If used on older M track, some locomotives may have issues with switch tracks. A few manufacturers have had issues with models where the slider lifts the bogie off the rails. Such problems can usually be resolved by installing a different slider. I had one issue with a model where the slider had a tendency to short out against one of the axles, but that was solved by wrapping the axle between the wheels with heat shrink tape.

Regards

Mike C
Offline baggio  
#23 Posted : 10 October 2016 00:33:57(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
I am not sure where this is taking us, Mike.

When you see a loco around $200.00, do you anticipate it will have a decoder already installed?

Take a look at the website in question, I doubt those locos have a decoder.

Offline dennisb  
#24 Posted : 10 October 2016 07:15:36(UTC)
dennisb

Sweden   
Joined: 21/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 217
Location: Kronoberg
Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post
I am not sure where this is taking us, Mike.

When you see a loco around $200.00, do you anticipate it will have a decoder already installed?

Take a look at the website in question, I doubt those locos have a decoder.



Yes they do. I have a few of them (none of the cheap of that list) on that list and they all have decoders. Also Roco's Hobby line which is very cheap includes a decoder and runs very smoothly. But not that detailed. If you check the website you find that they also sell Märklin locos with mfx decoders from 138 and mfx with sound from 178 USD. So Roco are not cheaper in that respect.

//Dennis
Offline baggio  
#25 Posted : 10 October 2016 08:05:03(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
Originally Posted by: dennisb Go to Quoted Post


If you check the website you find that they also sell Märklin locos with mfx decoders from 138 and mfx with sound from 178 USD. So Roco are not cheaper in that respect.



USD$178 with a SOUND decoder? That "sounds" too good to be true (pun intended).

Where did you find these bargains?

On the Eurorail website, I found one loco with "sound" for US$187.96, but it was a misprint - when you go to the description, it says it has no decoder:

"Interface according to NEM 652 standards for the adaptation of digital decoders."

Here is the url:

Euro Rail - electric locos - USD
Offline H0  
#26 Posted : 10 October 2016 08:22:56(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post
On the Eurorail website, I found one loco with "sound" for US$187.96, but it was a misprint - when you go to the description, it says it has no decoder:

"Interface according to NEM 652 standards for the adaptation of digital decoders."
With both Märklin and Roco you have to learn how to decode the catalogue texts.

I quote a bit more: "Interface according to NEM 652 standards for the adaptation of digital decoders. Coupler pocket according to NEM 362 standards. [...] AC model with digitallly switchable sound functions. " (sic)

One text for "AC" and "DC" - read it to the end.

However there is a copy'n'paste error: the loco comes with a decoder, but without sound. Probably an error by the dealer, the Roco site does not indicate sound.

No sound, but definitely with decoder.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline dennisb  
#27 Posted : 10 October 2016 10:22:50(UTC)
dennisb

Sweden   
Joined: 21/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 217
Location: Kronoberg
Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: dennisb Go to Quoted Post


If you check the website you find that they also sell Märklin locos with mfx decoders from 138 and mfx with sound from 178 USD. So Roco are not cheaper in that respect.



USD$178 with a SOUND decoder? That "sounds" too good to be true (pun intended).

Where did you find these bargains?

On the Eurorail website, I found one loco with "sound" for US$187.96, but it was a misprint - when you go to the description, it says it has no decoder:

"Interface according to NEM 652 standards for the adaptation of digital decoders."

Here is the url:

Euro Rail - electric locos - USD


I was referring to the Märklin hobby line to compare the Roco prices. For example the BR 245 is 184 USD (don't know how I got it to 178...?)
http://www.eurorailhobbi...amp;pr=2&stock=36645

My point is that I think that you can be fairly confident that those Roco locos have a decoder :)

D.
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Offline kiwiAlan  
#28 Posted : 11 October 2016 00:02:11(UTC)
kiwiAlan

United Kingdom   
Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC)
Posts: 8,082
Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: dennisb Go to Quoted Post


If you check the website you find that they also sell Märklin locos with mfx decoders from 138 and mfx with sound from 178 USD. So Roco are not cheaper in that respect.



USD$178 with a SOUND decoder? That "sounds" too good to be true (pun intended).

Where did you find these bargains?

On the Eurorail website, I found one loco with "sound" for US$187.96, but it was a misprint - when you go to the description, it says it has no decoder:

"Interface according to NEM 652 standards for the adaptation of digital decoders."

Here is the url:

Euro Rail - electric locos - USD


Why not that cheap? Recently we had a thread on how Aldi in Australia were marketing a start set with a loco with an mfx decoder for <A$100. And that came with the IR controller, a circle of track and IIRC a point and buffer stop. OK the loco doesn't have sound, but historically the mfx decoder has been about twice the price of a non-mfx one. If Marklin can do that for a start set then I am sure Roco can for a loco with sound decoder. There are enough decoder manufacturers out there that make fx compatible decoders with sound.

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Offline H0  
#29 Posted : 11 October 2016 08:43:53(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: kiwiAlan Go to Quoted Post
[...] but historically the mfx decoder has been about twice the price of a non-mfx one.
Has been. This makes only a few cents in production costs.
New technology is more expensive in the first place, but prices go down when it becomes common.
The first Mobile Station came in two versions with 1.2 A and 1.9 A. At some stage they switched to 1.9 A for all because the extra cost for handling two ref. numbers ate the benefit of cheaper components for one of those.
Probably the same story with mfx and fx decoders. Cheaper to have mfx everywhere.
And maybe use starter sets to get rid of old, obsolete decoders.

Originally Posted by: kiwiAlan Go to Quoted Post
If Marklin can do that for a start set then I am sure Roco can for a loco with sound decoder.
Märklin sound decoders were dumped into the market for €40 incl. VAT.
ESU decoders are more expensive. Maybe competition by Zimo, Uhlenbrock, and D&H will lead to cheaper sound options.

Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline Harryv40  
#30 Posted : 13 October 2016 09:04:39(UTC)
Harryv40

United Kingdom   
Joined: 07/08/2015(UTC)
Posts: 242
Location: Wilshire
Hi Everyone
I started this thread and it appears to have broaden somewhat, this is my view on the points raised.

I run The Marklin three rail system using Marklin mobile station 2, yes it is limited compared with the Marklin central station, but it's what I can afford.
I tend to buy the best models I can afford, Marklin, HAG, Roco and Brawa, they are always at reduced prices, I recently purchased a Marklin 37526 baby croc for £195 new.

It's is important to support the Marklin brand, but they have to remember not to price themselves out of the market, why? Well it no good in years to come saying what happen to Marklin when they disappear. Don't forget the crisis a few years ago.

But for all companies in model railway manufacture they must make a profit and by standardising parts it helps to reduce costs.

To buy items I use several different online shops, my favourite is Lok Museum, if you register you get great prices, and they provide good service. I also use Scograil in Ipswich, if you contact Neal, he is normally able to get you a price for an item, cheaper then Gaugemaster. I recently enquired about a Piko 59200, he came back to me and said the best price was a online shop in Germany and provided a link.

That's what I call service, no sales for him, but a great deal of respect from one customer.

One last point, in terms of improvement, I am sure people remember Marklin Delta locos and slow running issues, well if Marklin did not develop and improve the digital chips we would still have them, I am sure people don't mind paying a few pennies extra for MFX.

Harry

Offline H0  
#31 Posted : 13 October 2016 11:58:38(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: Harryv40 Go to Quoted Post
[...] I am sure people remember Marklin Delta locos and slow running issues [...]
Delta decoders were downgraded to provide entry-level digital locos for those with analogue layouts or Delta controllers.
Many locos came in two versions: Delta plus 37xx/37xxx with load regulation.
Delta was the regression of Digital, the "improved" decoder existed at the same time and even earlier than Delta.
Yes, Märklin digital started with just one function and without load regulation. Load regulation was a huge improvement.

Originally Posted by: Harryv40 Go to Quoted Post
[...] I am sure people don't mind paying a few pennies extra for MFX.
I don't need mfx, I want DCC. I don't mind spending a few extra pennies for mfx if the loco has DCC.
Märklin's factory-installed decoders often are crippled versions with some restrictions.
With Delta decoders, the hardware was cheaper as parts were missing. Nowadays the crippling is just a matter of different firmware.
Some customers get all they want and are fully satisfied. Some customers feel they get crippled items and are not fully satisfied.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline skeeterbuck  
#32 Posted : 13 October 2016 16:16:15(UTC)
skeeterbuck

United States   
Joined: 15/12/2015(UTC)
Posts: 523
Location: Maryland, Baltimore
I know this isn't a Roco or Fleischmann Loco, but I have a Brawa 0-10-0 BR94 0-10-0 steam switcher (pic) and it supposed to be able to run on R1 track but it doesn't. I can only handle R2 or greater. Mad

I still a nice loco and the sound is really a nice change from the usual Marklin sounds. I just have to be careful where I run it.Wink

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Offline Jabez  
#33 Posted : 13 October 2016 23:08:07(UTC)
Jabez

Belgium   
Joined: 30/08/2016(UTC)
Posts: 636
Location: Brussels
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post

However there is a copy'n'paste error


Yep, as we used to say in the days of hard-copy, 'die Kollegen von Solingen' have much to answer for.
I heard that lonesome whistle blow. Hank Williams
Offline Tex  
#34 Posted : 14 October 2016 01:52:36(UTC)
Tex

United States   
Joined: 30/01/2004(UTC)
Posts: 276
Location: Houston, Texas
I have had a series of problems with my Roco 69382 V80 ( 280 ) on my Marklin system. I have M track and a 6021 control unit. I have programed the engine with my 6020 on a remote track as called for in the instructions that came with the engine. It ran painfully slow when I used the factory settings and the last time the engine was on the layout it stalled and made sounds indicating it was awaiting input for coding. I have pretty much given up on this engine as it does not run the way I want it to even when it is coded in accordance with the instructions. I had it coded by a dealer a number of years ago and it ran well for a while but do not want to spend more money on it as I have twelve other engines, including a Brawa V 160, that run fine!

Tex

Edited by user 14 October 2016 06:57:02(UTC)  | Reason: corrected control unit number

thanks 2 users liked this useful post by Tex
Offline H0  
#35 Posted : 14 October 2016 08:00:02(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: Tex Go to Quoted Post
I have had a series of problems with my Roco 69382 V80 (280) on my Marklin system.
That's a model from 2003. It might have a Lenz decoder or an early ESU decoder.
Since then Roco switched to better ESU decoders, then Uhlenbrock decoders, now Zimo decoders.

All companies had progress (and regress) with their decoders in the last 12 years. And that is one aspect to pay attention to when buying older locos from eBay.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline baggio  
#36 Posted : 14 October 2016 14:14:02(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
"All companies had progress (and regress) with their decoders in the last 12 years. And that is one aspect to pay attention to when buying older locos from eBay."

Is there a decoder one should skip?

Is there a decoder one should prefer?

Thanks.
Offline H0  
#37 Posted : 14 October 2016 17:22:54(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post
Is there a decoder one should skip?
Lenz decoders with DIP switches are problematic. Especially in locos without decoder socket. Piko locos with AnDi decoders or Märklin locos with 608x decoders or Delta decoders are not on the level.

ESU LokSound V2 is very "old school" nowadays. Märklin sound locos with DIP switches sound even worse.
Those were good decoders when they were made, but sound technology has advanced a lot since then.

Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post
Is there a decoder one should prefer?
That depends strongly on personal taste.
I like fx decoders with DIP switches because they have the smoothest acceleration and braking delay I've ever seen. I also like ESU V3 and V4 decoders.

Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline Tex  
#38 Posted : 14 October 2016 20:43:17(UTC)
Tex

United States   
Joined: 30/01/2004(UTC)
Posts: 276
Location: Houston, Texas
Tom

I purchased the Roco engine new approximately 15 years ago and it is equipped with a ESU LokSound decoder . I have a Brawa 21147 V 160 engine nearly as old that has run well with a ESU Loksound decoder. Most of my engines, however, have Marklin fx decoders or ESU lokpilot V2 decoders. I have only one Marklin mfx engine and it is one of my poorer performing engines. Your comment on the ESU V3 and V4 decoders is interesting.

I am 84 years old and have severe hearing loss and have no interest in new sound technology. In fact I believe that those of us who prefer the older digital system should have our own digital subsection to exchange information.

Tex
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