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Ian555		#1 Posted : 18 April 2012 16:38:55(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,288 Location: Scotland		Hi all, Here's my attempt at showing you how the double click to reverse the DA800 works. This means you can have 2 Locos on the same track, one moving and the other stationery with it's lights on, when you reverse them from the transformer, the moving one would stop and the other start. I must be honest and say that I haven't actually tried that yet. I would like to thank Ray for all his help and advice with this. Ian.
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hennabm		#2 Posted : 19 April 2012 19:49:31(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 22/09/2009(UTC) Posts: 2,073 Location: Edinburgh,		Hi Ian just like my little BR89 We never did get to try the two trains during the last visit. Maybe next time Mike
		1957 - 1985 era What's digital?
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Ian555		#3 Posted : 19 April 2012 19:55:57(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,288 Location: Scotland		Hi Mike, Next time will do then. Ian.
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BR01097		#4 Posted : 20 April 2012 01:10:22(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 17/11/2010(UTC) Posts: 228 Location: Denver, Colo. USA		AFAIK the DA800 is the only model produced with solenoid-activated reversing which has this feature. I first surmised that the second and fourth positions on the drum related to other functions the model might have wired. It's actually much better to back it down a dark spur, hit the switch, and leave the lights illuminated until the next run without having to use a signal to block it.
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Iamnotthecrazyone		#5 Posted : 20 April 2012 01:45:10(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 22/01/2012(UTC) Posts: 1,047		Originally Posted by: BR01097 AFAIK the DA800 is the only model produced with solenoid-activated reversing which has this feature. I first surmised that the second and fourth positions on the drum related to other functions the model might have wired. It's actually much better to back it down a dark spur, hit the switch, and leave the lights illuminated until the next run without having to use a signal to block it. I am not sure if I am misunderstanding your post but there are a few old locomotives with a solenoid reversing switch that have the "lights on/motor off" function.
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Ian555		#6 Posted : 20 April 2012 07:25:39(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,288 Location: Scotland		Hi all, I don't think the DA800 is the only Loco with this feature, hopefully some forum members will provide the information....thanks. Ian.
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hennabm		#7 Posted : 20 April 2012 10:49:56(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 22/09/2009(UTC) Posts: 2,073 Location: Edinburgh,		Originally Posted by: BR01097 AFAIK the DA800 is the only model produced with solenoid-activated reversing which has this feature. I first surmised that the second and fourth positions on the drum related to other functions the model might have wired. It's actually much better to back it down a dark spur, hit the switch, and leave the lights illuminated until the next run without having to use a signal to block it. If I'm reading your reply right then I can't agree. I have a CM800 BR89 and this clearly has the same function. Being in a red lift off top box I suspect it is from a similar era as Ian's DA800. Mike
		1957 - 1985 era What's digital?
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Ian555		#8 Posted : 20 April 2012 12:39:41(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,288 Location: Scotland		Hi all, Just loading a couple of video's showing my 1961 BR23 3005 and also a TM800 (date unknown) to see if they have the "double reverse" function. Ian.
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Ian555		#9 Posted : 20 April 2012 14:32:59(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,288 Location: Scotland		Hi all, Here's my 1961 BR23 3005, does it have the "double reverse" function. I'll let you watch the short video to find out. Ian.
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Ian555		#10 Posted : 20 April 2012 14:42:46(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,288 Location: Scotland		Hi all, And here's me checking my TM800 for the "double reverse" function. Sorry about the rather large bulbs fitted. Ian.
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Johnvr		#11 Posted : 20 April 2012 20:31:40(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 03/10/2010(UTC) Posts: 1,291 Location: Cape Town, South Africa		My CM800 also has a double reverse switch. It's quite fun to see the rotating dial on the reverse lever ! Regards, John
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Ian555		#12 Posted : 20 April 2012 20:52:35(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,288 Location: Scotland		Hi John, I've not taken the Loco body off yet to see how it works. Ian.
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hennabm		#13 Posted : 20 April 2012 21:40:36(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 22/09/2009(UTC) Posts: 2,073 Location: Edinburgh,		Hi Ian the reverser looks the same as any other excpet there are two prongs IIRC going to it. This means that for every one click it moves to the lights one position before moving onto the reverse function. Having had the body off my BR81 and compared it with my BR89, it is exactly the same reverser for a Telex equipped lok.
		1957 - 1985 era What's digital?
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Ian555		#14 Posted : 20 April 2012 22:03:23(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,288 Location: Scotland		Hi Mike, I'll have a look at that. Ian.
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Webmaster		#15 Posted : 20 April 2012 22:43:36(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 25/07/2001(UTC) Posts: 11,165		Most of the 50's locos had this rotary 4-step solenoid relay which Märklin called the "Perfekt-Schaltung"... In the late 50's and early 60's, the 2-way solenoid we all know came around - in the beginning assisted by a hand lever... The older solenoid was used for Telex later, instead of directional lights on - to have a "coupler open" state.
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Ian555		#16 Posted : 21 April 2012 07:26:01(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,288 Location: Scotland		Hi Juhan, Thanks for the information. Every day's a school day at Baden-Württemberg. Ian.
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Johnvr		#17 Posted : 21 April 2012 09:54:54(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 03/10/2010(UTC) Posts: 1,291 Location: Cape Town, South Africa		Hi, Here are some pictures to describe how it works : The coil activated spring mechanism pushes the lever, which rotates the dial, which switches the current. The spring then pulls the lever back again to wait for the next pulse. The rotating dial has 8 grooves. The grooves rotate the switcher around clockwise. The sequence of events goes like this on pulse from transformer : 1) loco runs forwards 2) loco stands still 3) loco runs backwards 4) loco stands still and then it repeats the sequence. Actually, having looked at it again, Marklin could have used all 8 grooves with different outcomes. So you could have had a function operated (eg Telex or Lights), so that the sequence above would have operated first with Function ON and then repeated but with Function OFF I love finding out "How Things Work" in the olde worlde of Maerklin !! Regards, John
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Ian555		#18 Posted : 21 April 2012 10:32:21(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,288 Location: Scotland		Hi John, Now, I know what I'm looking at when I take the body off. Ian.
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Brakepad		#19 Posted : 22 April 2012 08:29:10(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 25/08/2008(UTC) Posts: 633 Location: Montlouis sur Loire, France		I guess the fact is that Märklin may have tried to "unify" the reversing switch when they started to fit Telex couplers to some locomotives. As far as I know, the first locos with Telex were in the market in the early fifties. At some point it became evident that they could save money fitting more simple reversing switches in locos which did not need the "4 step" unit.
		check out http://maerklin-back-on-track.blogspot.com if you like to see how old Märklin locos are brought back into life! (in spanish by the moment)
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Ian555		#20 Posted : 22 April 2012 13:21:38(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,288 Location: Scotland		Hi all, Couple of photo's with the body off my 1954 DA800. Ian. Uploaded with ImageShack.us Uploaded with ImageShack.us
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Johnvr		#21 Posted : 22 April 2012 20:39:40(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 03/10/2010(UTC) Posts: 1,291 Location: Cape Town, South Africa		Ian, I just love these DA800 locomotives !! But your loco is in superb condition ! Model Engineering at its best Regards, John
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Ian555		#22 Posted : 22 April 2012 20:54:01(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,288 Location: Scotland		Hi John, Thanks. Did you notice, still got her plastic tires. Ian.
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Markus Schild		#23 Posted : 22 April 2012 21:09:36(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 14/01/2006(UTC) Posts: 1,802 Location: Wurttemberg		Hi, Märklin had to use the two-step switching because TRIX had a patent for one-step switching. That patent from 1937 ran out in 1957 when Märklin introduced the new reversing units. Same for the TELEX-couplers which were introduced in 1958, when the TRIX patent for remote uncoupling expired. In detail the TRIX patent described the cutting off of the motor from the supply when the reverser is in function. So Märklin-locos before 1957 cannot be switched without that little jump. Regards Markus
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CCS800KrokHunter3		#24 Posted : 22 April 2012 21:12:07(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 03/04/2007(UTC) Posts: 1,605		Originally Posted by: Markus Schild Hi, Märklin had to use the two-step switching because TRIX had a patent for one-step switching. That patent from 1937 ran out in 1957 when Märklin introduced the new reversing units. Same for the TELEX-couplers which were introduced in 1958, when the TRIX patent for remote uncoupling expired. In detail the TRIX patent described the cutting off of the motor from the supply when the reverser is in function. So Märklin-locos before 1957 cannot be switched without that little jump. Regards Markus Incredible information, Markus! Seems TRIX was a little ahead of Marklin in the electrical department. Now Marklin owns TRIX so we know who won in the end Paul
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Ian555		#25 Posted : 22 April 2012 22:27:09(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,288 Location: Scotland		Hi Markus, I agree with Paul, what wonderful information you have to share with us....Thanks. Ian. And I had thought that my DA800 had a problem when she was reversed,(2nd click)....a little jump....thanks again.
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Iamnotthecrazyone		#26 Posted : 22 April 2012 23:30:20(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 22/01/2012(UTC) Posts: 1,047		Originally Posted by: Markus Schild Hi, Märklin had to use the two-step switching because TRIX had a patent for one-step switching. That patent from 1937 ran out in 1957 when Märklin introduced the new reversing units. Same for the TELEX-couplers which were introduced in 1958, when the TRIX patent for remote uncoupling expired. In detail the TRIX patent described the cutting off of the motor from the supply when the reverser is in function. So Märklin-locos before 1957 cannot be switched without that little jump. Regards Markus I understand the telex part but what I don't is why did Trix need to patent a reverse unit? I thought Trix express and trix international were always DC therefore didn't need the reverse unit?
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Markus Schild		#27 Posted : 22 April 2012 23:46:00(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 14/01/2006(UTC) Posts: 1,802 Location: Wurttemberg		Hi, TRIX EXPRESS used AC with a reversing unit in the loco until 1953. In 1953 the system was changed to DC with switching by pole-reversing. BTW: The first Märklin 00- locos (1935) of the 700 series used the DC - pole reversing system. Reversing with AC was introduced at Märklin with the 800 series in 1938. Regards Markus
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drstapes		#28 Posted : 22 April 2012 23:55:50(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 23/08/2004(UTC) Posts: 764 Location: Bury St. Edmunds, Suffolk		Markus, thanks for your inexhaustable fund of knowledge on all subjects marklin!
		Regards Geoff (UK) marklin HO from the 50's and 60's
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Iamnotthecrazyone		#29 Posted : 22 April 2012 23:57:40(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 22/01/2012(UTC) Posts: 1,047		Originally Posted by: Markus Schild Hi, TRIX EXPRESS used AC with a reversing unit in the loco until 1953. In 1953 the system was changed to DC with switching by pole-reversing. BTW: The first Märklin 00- locos (1935) of the 700 series used the DC - pole reversing system. Reversing with AC was introduced at Märklin with the 800 series in 1938. Regards Markus Hi, I knew about the early Marklin being DC but never knew about Trix using AC in the early days, thank you!
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john black		#30 Posted : 28 April 2012 16:08:34(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 22/04/2004(UTC) Posts: 12,139 Location: New York, NY		Thanks a lot for 'em most helpful instruction videos, Ian
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Ian555		#31 Posted : 28 April 2012 17:05:11(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,288 Location: Scotland		Hi John, Thanks. Ian.
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Ian555		#32 Posted : 28 April 2012 17:08:46(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,288 Location: Scotland		Hi all, Double reverse function, 2 Loco's, same track, one transformer.....does it work.????? Find out tomorrow. Ian.
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Ian555		#33 Posted : 29 April 2012 08:06:42(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,288 Location: Scotland		Hi all, Here's the video showing the "double reverse" function working with 2 Loco's on the same track, controlled by 1 transformer. That must have been clever stuff way back in the early 1950's. Ian.
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