 Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,289 Location: Scotland
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Hi all, Here's my attempt at showing you how the double click to reverse the DA800 works. This means you can have 2 Locos on the same track, one moving and the other stationery with it's lights on, when you reverse them from the transformer, the moving one would stop and the other start. I must be honest and say that I haven't actually tried that yet.  I would like to thank Ray for all his help and advice with this.  Ian.
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 1 user liked this useful post by Ian555
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Joined: 22/09/2009(UTC) Posts: 2,073 Location: Edinburgh,
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Hi Ian just like my little BR89  We never did get to try the two trains during the last visit.  Maybe next time Mike |
1957 - 1985 era
What's digital? |
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Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,289 Location: Scotland
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Hi Mike, Next time will do then. Ian.
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 Joined: 17/11/2010(UTC) Posts: 228 Location: Denver, Colo. USA
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AFAIK the DA800 is the only model produced with solenoid-activated reversing which has this feature. I first surmised that the second and fourth positions on the drum related to other functions the model might have wired. It's actually much better to back it down a dark spur, hit the switch, and leave the lights illuminated until the next run without having to use a signal to block it.
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Collector of Märklin fine-quality trains since 1966.
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 Joined: 22/01/2012(UTC) Posts: 1,047
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Originally Posted by: BR01097 
AFAIK the DA800 is the only model produced with solenoid-activated reversing which has this feature. I first surmised that the second and fourth positions on the drum related to other functions the model might have wired. It's actually much better to back it down a dark spur, hit the switch, and leave the lights illuminated until the next run without having to use a signal to block it.
I am not sure if I am misunderstanding your post but there are a few old locomotives with a solenoid reversing switch that have the "lights on/motor off" function.
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Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,289 Location: Scotland
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Hi all,
I don't think the DA800 is the only Loco with this feature, hopefully some forum members will provide the information....thanks.
Ian.
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Joined: 22/09/2009(UTC) Posts: 2,073 Location: Edinburgh,
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Originally Posted by: BR01097
AFAIK the DA800 is the only model produced with solenoid-activated reversing which has this feature. I first surmised that the second and fourth positions on the drum related to other functions the model might have wired. It's actually much better to back it down a dark spur, hit the switch, and leave the lights illuminated until the next run without having to use a signal to block it.
If I'm reading your reply right then I can't agree.  I have a CM800 BR89 and this clearly has the same function. Being in a red lift off top box I suspect it is from a similar era as Ian's DA800. Mike |
1957 - 1985 era
What's digital? |
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Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,289 Location: Scotland
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Hi all,
Just loading a couple of video's showing my 1961 BR23 3005 and also a TM800 (date unknown) to see if they have the "double reverse" function.
Ian.
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Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,289 Location: Scotland
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Hi all, Here's my 1961 BR23 3005, does it have the "double reverse" function. I'll let you watch the short video to find out. Ian.
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1 user liked this useful post by Ian555
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Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,289 Location: Scotland
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Hi all, And here's me checking my TM800 for the "double reverse" function. Sorry about the rather large bulbs fitted. Ian.
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1 user liked this useful post by Ian555
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 Joined: 03/10/2010(UTC) Posts: 1,293 Location: Cape Town, South Africa
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My CM800 also has a double reverse switch. It's quite fun to see the rotating dial on the reverse lever ! Regards, John
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Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,289 Location: Scotland
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Hi John,
I've not taken the Loco body off yet to see how it works.
Ian.
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Joined: 22/09/2009(UTC) Posts: 2,073 Location: Edinburgh,
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Hi Ian
the reverser looks the same as any other excpet there are two prongs IIRC going to it.
This means that for every one click it moves to the lights one position before moving onto the reverse function.
Having had the body off my BR81 and compared it with my BR89, it is exactly the same reverser for a Telex equipped lok. |
1957 - 1985 era
What's digital? |
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Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,289 Location: Scotland
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Hi Mike, I'll have a look at that. Ian.
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Joined: 25/07/2001(UTC)
Posts: 11,165
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Most of the 50's locos had this rotary 4-step solenoid relay which Märklin called the "Perfekt-Schaltung"...
In the late 50's and early 60's, the 2-way solenoid we all know came around - in the beginning assisted by a hand lever...
The older solenoid was used for Telex later, instead of directional lights on - to have a "coupler open" state. |
Juhan - "Webmaster", at your service...
He who asks a question is a fool for five minutes. He who does not ask a question remains a fool forever. [Old Chinese Proverb] |
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Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,289 Location: Scotland
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Hi Juhan, Thanks for the information. Every day's a school day at Baden-Württemberg. Ian.
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Joined: 03/10/2010(UTC) Posts: 1,293 Location: Cape Town, South Africa
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Hi, Here are some pictures to describe how it works : The coil activated spring mechanism pushes the lever, which rotates the dial, which switches the current. The spring then pulls the lever back again to wait for the next pulse. The rotating dial has 8 grooves. The grooves rotate the switcher around clockwise. The sequence of events goes like this on pulse from transformer : 1) loco runs forwards 2) loco stands still 3) loco runs backwards 4) loco stands still and then it repeats the sequence. Actually, having looked at it again, Marklin could have used all 8 grooves with different outcomes. So you could have had a function operated (eg Telex or Lights), so that the sequence above would have operated first with Function ON and then repeated but with Function OFF    I love finding out "How Things Work" in the olde worlde of Maerklin !!  Regards, John
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Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,289 Location: Scotland
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Hi John, Now, I know what I'm looking at when I take the body off. Ian.
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 Joined: 25/08/2008(UTC) Posts: 633 Location: Montlouis sur Loire, France
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I guess the fact is that Märklin may have tried to "unify" the reversing switch when they started to fit Telex couplers to some locomotives.
As far as I know, the first locos with Telex were in the market in the early fifties.
At some point it became evident that they could save money fitting more simple reversing switches in locos which did not need the "4 step" unit. |
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Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,289 Location: Scotland
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1 user liked this useful post by Ian555
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Joined: 03/10/2010(UTC) Posts: 1,293 Location: Cape Town, South Africa
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Ian, I just love these DA800 locomotives !! But your loco is in superb condition ! Model Engineering at its best Regards, John
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Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,289 Location: Scotland
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Hi John, Thanks. Did you notice, still got her plastic tires. Ian.
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 Joined: 14/01/2006(UTC) Posts: 1,802 Location: Wurttemberg
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Hi,
Märklin had to use the two-step switching because TRIX had a patent for one-step switching. That patent from 1937 ran out in 1957 when Märklin introduced the new reversing units. Same for the TELEX-couplers which were introduced in 1958, when the TRIX patent for remote uncoupling expired. In detail the TRIX patent described the cutting off of the motor from the supply when the reverser is in function. So Märklin-locos before 1957 cannot be switched without that little jump.
Regards
Markus
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3 users liked this useful post by Markus Schild
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Joined: 03/04/2007(UTC) Posts: 1,605
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Originally Posted by: Markus Schild Hi,
Märklin had to use the two-step switching because TRIX had a patent for one-step switching. That patent from 1937 ran out in 1957 when Märklin introduced the new reversing units. Same for the TELEX-couplers which were introduced in 1958, when the TRIX patent for remote uncoupling expired. In detail the TRIX patent described the cutting off of the motor from the supply when the reverser is in function. So Märklin-locos before 1957 cannot be switched without that little jump.
Regards
Markus Incredible information, Markus! Seems TRIX was a little ahead of Marklin in the electrical department. Now Marklin owns TRIX so we know who won in the end Paul |
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Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,289 Location: Scotland
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Hi Markus, I agree with Paul, what wonderful information you have to share with us....Thanks. Ian. And I had thought that my DA800 had a problem when she was reversed,(2nd click)....a little jump....thanks again.
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Joined: 22/01/2012(UTC) Posts: 1,047
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Originally Posted by: Markus Schild Hi,
Märklin had to use the two-step switching because TRIX had a patent for one-step switching. That patent from 1937 ran out in 1957 when Märklin introduced the new reversing units. Same for the TELEX-couplers which were introduced in 1958, when the TRIX patent for remote uncoupling expired. In detail the TRIX patent described the cutting off of the motor from the supply when the reverser is in function. So Märklin-locos before 1957 cannot be switched without that little jump.
Regards
Markus I understand the telex part but what I don't is why did Trix need to patent a reverse unit? I thought Trix express and trix international were always DC therefore didn't need the reverse unit?
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Joined: 14/01/2006(UTC) Posts: 1,802 Location: Wurttemberg
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Hi,
TRIX EXPRESS used AC with a reversing unit in the loco until 1953. In 1953 the system was changed to DC with switching by pole-reversing. BTW: The first Märklin 00- locos (1935) of the 700 series used the DC - pole reversing system. Reversing with AC was introduced at Märklin with the 800 series in 1938.
Regards
Markus
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4 users liked this useful post by Markus Schild
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 Joined: 23/08/2004(UTC) Posts: 764 Location: Bury St. Edmunds, Suffolk
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Markus,
thanks for your inexhaustable fund of knowledge on all subjects marklin! |
Regards
Geoff (UK)
marklin HO from the 50's and 60's |
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Joined: 22/01/2012(UTC) Posts: 1,047
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Originally Posted by: Markus Schild Hi,
TRIX EXPRESS used AC with a reversing unit in the loco until 1953. In 1953 the system was changed to DC with switching by pole-reversing. BTW: The first Märklin 00- locos (1935) of the 700 series used the DC - pole reversing system. Reversing with AC was introduced at Märklin with the 800 series in 1938.
Regards
Markus Hi, I knew about the early Marklin being DC but never knew about Trix using AC in the early days, thank you!
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Joined: 22/04/2004(UTC) Posts: 12,139 Location: New York, NY
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Thanks a lot for 'em most helpful instruction videos, Ian |
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Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,289 Location: Scotland
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Hi John, Thanks. Ian.
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Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,289 Location: Scotland
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Hi all, Double reverse function, 2 Loco's, same track, one transformer.....does it work.????? Find out tomorrow. Ian.
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Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC) Posts: 20,289 Location: Scotland
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Hi all, Here's the video showing the "double reverse" function working with 2 Loco's on the same track, controlled by 1 transformer. That must have been clever stuff way back in the early 1950's. Ian.
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