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Offline DumbGuy  
#1 Posted : 10 January 2012 01:37:09(UTC)
DumbGuy

United States   
Joined: 25/12/2011(UTC)
Posts: 194
Location: Tennessee, USA
A few years ago, I tried to run a very nice #3092 analog loco (LFCM) that had been unused for years. It was inoperable because of bound gears from congealed oil. As a crass amateur, I was reluctant to try a DIY fix, so sent it out for repair. Three weeks and $60-ish later it was fine.

A while later, I had the same problem with an NIB FX digital loco (DCM) from eBay. Not wanting to spend extra cash again, I searched for a new solution. I found little guidance specific to Marklin, except for info saying oil-bound gears are a fairly common occurrence. I finally tried the simple 5-step DIY approach below which worked well.

After undoing the body shell . . . . . 1) Remove brushes & motor-shield, then remove magnet & rotor. 2) Apply a FEW drops of WD-40 to the gears with a syringe – DON’T use the spray – then wait overnight. 3) Next morning, apply a FEW drops of Naptha (lighter fluid) to rinse out the WD-40 residuals; apply the Naptha rinse once more several hours later, then wait overnight again. 4) Reassemble everything & do a very short low-power test on track. If the gears are still bound, repeat the process. 5) Once everything works, lube the motor & axles lightly with LaBelle 108 or equivalent and replace the body shell.

I’ve done this on three oil-bound DCM locos. Only one needed a second run-through, and nothing was ever electrically or cosmetically damaged. Total time = Not much . . . . a half-hour to disassemble, a half-hour to reassemble, and a couple nights of waiting in-between. A professional might be able to do it without disassembling and waiting, but I’m very far from an expert.

I’ve written this note because I couldn’t find clear Marklin-specific guidance the first time I had the problem, and I may well encounter it again. I’m sure there are alternate simpler ways, and my 5-steps may not be the best. CRITIQUES, CAUTIONS and BETTER METHODS much appreciated!! I hope this starts a useful thread. P.S. I’m a new Forum user.


Update on Jan 10 . . . Consensus from smarter guys with more experience says to avoid WD-40 (Omit my Step 2) because of potential gummy residuals that may develop later, and that the wait-time can be less. But Ronsonol-Naptha is a keeper! Thanks to all.

Edited by user 10 January 2012 20:51:00(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Long-time analog user, collector & tinkerer.
Discovered digital & began conversion a few years ago.
C-Track, CS2 Carpetbahn built, taken-down, rebuilt, etc.
Username reflects how much I still have to learn.
Offline rjftrains  
#2 Posted : 10 January 2012 03:59:11(UTC)
rjftrains


Joined: 14/12/2011(UTC)
Posts: 58
Location: Katonah, NY
You're on the right track (no pun intended). I've repaired (and "un-stuck") literally hundreds of locomotives that have exhibited the same problem as you are experiencing. The old oil hardens over time and you need to get it dissolved and get things moving smoothly again.

While WD-40 is really great stuff, I would strongly suggest that you do not use it. From your narrative I can see that you know you need to get it out of there once you have things moving again. If you don't, eventually it will dissipate and your locomotive will certainly sieze up on you -- that's a guarantee. Your use of lighter fluid will get the WD-40 out of there (in time), but I think there is a better way...

I too use lighter fluid. I use Ronson lighter fluid (in the US it comes in a blue/yellow plastic bottle). This was recommended to me by a fellow Marklin dealer years ago and I'm not bashful or ashamed to say he was right all along. This is great stuff. It dissolves the old, hardened oil and leaves absolutely no residue behind. (For that reason, it's great for cleaning track as well.)

But, I do suggest that you just skip the WD-40 step and go right to the lighter fluid. The lighter fluid will dissolve the old oil nicely -- maybe not quite as quickly as the WD-40, but then you won't have to worry about getting the WD-40 out of there later.

When you're sure you have all the old oil out of there, give the gears, etc. a good extra rinse with the lighter fluid, then use compressed air (make sure it has no moisture in it) to blow out all the lighter fluid, add a minimal amount of good quality lubrication (I like what Faller makes because it has a very nice needle-tip applicator) and you'll be in good shape.

One last tip -- when lubricating, you need not put oil on the gear teeth themselves (these don't mesh that tightly that you need to put oil on them). But do put a LITTLE on any parts that rotate, like the ends of axle shafts, the end of the armature and the ends of any "pins" or "shafts" around which a gear rotates. Remember, the less oil used, the better. If it runs fine and doesn't make any strange noises, you have plenty of lubrication in there already!
Robert Frowenfeld
RJFtrains@aol.com
www.RJFtrains.com
914-232-5546
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by rjftrains
Offline river6109  
#3 Posted : 10 January 2012 04:34:49(UTC)
river6109

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 13,634
Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
Welcome to the forum, no longer a dumbguy

Robert,

Compressed air ? A few ideas have come to my mindLOL

I use the waterhose and let it dry out or use a hairdryer to get rid of any moisture.

there are so many ways of doing it, not one is the ultimate solution, so long you're happy with the visual outcome

John
https://www.youtube.com/river6109
https://www.youtube.com/6109river
5 years in Destruction mode
50 years in Repairing mode
Offline sudibarba  
#4 Posted : 10 January 2012 05:22:39(UTC)
sudibarba

United States   
Joined: 28/07/2006(UTC)
Posts: 876
Location: Augusta, GA USA
Robert,
Helmut Wilkness told me to use Ronson lighter fluid years ago . Maybe he is the that told you.
Anyway, I buy Naphtha (same thing) at ACE hardware by the gallon cheaper than the bottles of lighter fluid.
Eric
Offline jvuye  
#5 Posted : 10 January 2012 10:54:59(UTC)
jvuye

Belgium   
Joined: 01/03/2008(UTC)
Posts: 2,881
Location: South Western France
Originally Posted by: sudibarba Go to Quoted Post
Robert,
Helmut Wilkness told me to use Ronson lighter fluid years ago . Maybe he is the that told you.
Anyway, I buy Naphtha (same thing) at ACE hardware by the gallon cheaper than the bottles of lighter fluid.
Eric


I can only agree with Robert (RJFtrains);
Skip the WD-40! (It could damage paint on wheels and other details...)
Apply lighter fluid liberally and, rather quickly, you'll notice you'll be able to un-stuck the whole mechanism quickly.
No need to wait for a night or so AFAIK

I tend to diverge from Robert on one point though: there is at least *one* gear that will welcome some oil: the small pinion that's part of the motor shaft (7 or 8 teeth) will welcome a little oil.
This is were the speed of the moving parts is the highest, and thus the friction ( =resistance+noise!! ) plays the biggest influence (it grows with the square of the speed)
Your loco will run *much* smoother and *much* quieter!

One of Dr. Eisenbahn's little secrets...(not!)BigGrin

Cheers
Jacques Vuye aka Dr.Eisenbahn
Once a vandal, learned to be better and had great success!
Offline blackrock  
#6 Posted : 10 January 2012 11:34:47(UTC)
blackrock


Joined: 07/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 10
Location: Cohasset Massachusetts
Gentlemen,

Thank you for this info. I am getting back into marklin after a 12 year absence.

There is a lot to learn and relearn.

Thanks again,

sean
Offline BillJ  
#7 Posted : 10 January 2012 14:36:43(UTC)
BillJ


Joined: 08/06/2009(UTC)
Posts: 75
Location: White Mountains, NH
Thanks for starting this thread, and to those who contributed. Clear and detailed. Very helpful.

Bill
Offline GSRR  
#8 Posted : 10 January 2012 17:54:08(UTC)
GSRR

United States   
Joined: 01/03/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,339
Location: USA
DG,

Welcome to the forum. There are two threads I recall one on cleaning Loks and another on Wagons, however the search function is failing me. I grabbed this from an old post I made.


Below is a collection of tips I've gathered across the forum. The CRC 2-26 is very useful on the bogies and gears.



...../


Materials, Lubrication, Cleaning

Cleaning:

Denatured Alcohol
Mineral Spirits (hardened oil)
Isopropyl alcohol
Mineral Spirit (White) oily gunk
Wahl clipper oil

Use for simple cleaning: keep away from red paint

++++++

WD-40
CRC 2-26
CRC Brakeclean (goes anywhere, dries clean)
Lighter fluid

Use for cleaning, mostly grease, oily grime

++++

Trix Modellbahn Fluid 66624

Use for cleaning plastic, removing rust.

++++

Cyanoacrylate (Super glue, Crazy glue)

Use for repairs.

++++

Labelle 107 http://www.con-cor.com/Labelle.html

Trix 66626 special grease For regular and worm gear mechanisms. Use very sparingly. Suggested dosage is one pinhead size.

++++

"Alcohols are more aggressive to plastics like PS or ABS often used in models. Aliphatic hydrocarbons like lighter fluid, heptane's or heavier like Stoddard solvent or white spirit are non polar and will affect in much lesser degree such plastics. I prefer the latter ones because the higher flash point makes them safer to keep and use, the only disadvantage is they take more time for evaporate and dry. Regarding rust, if the damage is not easy to remove mechanically to the point of showing clean metal, you may dip, sponge or wipe the corroded surface with a “phosphatizing” solution usually found at paint stores which converts iron oxide to a more stable form which can be painted after thorough drying with lint free wipe."


Another great item for rust, Coca Cola bath.

One other thing I did was to take the armature / commutator and with an eraser / rubber clean the face. Seems to help. I would not use anything abrasive.














r/Thomas

ETE UserPostedImage ECoS iTrain TouchCab C-Gleis German Era Id & IIIb USA Era IIIb SBB Era III SJ Era IV GC Era V
Offline DumbGuy  
#9 Posted : 10 January 2012 18:49:37(UTC)
DumbGuy

United States   
Joined: 25/12/2011(UTC)
Posts: 194
Location: Tennessee, USA
My thanks to Robert, Jacques, Thomas and everyone else. From your consensus, WD-40 will disappear from my approach (making it a simpler 4-step process). I may also take some time over the next month or so to give the locos I've already "fixed" an extra Ronsonol-Naptha bath just to ensure that WD residuals are really gone. Much appreciated.

Best regards -- DG
Long-time analog user, collector & tinkerer.
Discovered digital & began conversion a few years ago.
C-Track, CS2 Carpetbahn built, taken-down, rebuilt, etc.
Username reflects how much I still have to learn.
Offline steventrain  
#10 Posted : 10 January 2012 18:56:30(UTC)
steventrain

United Kingdom   
Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC)
Posts: 31,394
Location: United Kingdom
Hi Sean and DG,

Welcome to the forum.
Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy.
Offline Webmaster  
#11 Posted : 10 January 2012 22:00:49(UTC)
Webmaster


Joined: 25/07/2001(UTC)
Posts: 11,100
Had a really tough one this summer... Used WD40 and that solved most of it, but not the suck gears in the frame.
The gear axles were heavily stuck, "glued" inside the frame and I had to tap the gear axles with proper tools to get them unstuck...
Some more WD40, and the gears were free again. Converted with a 60903, since the stuck gears had caused the original 6080 in it to fry.

I have no negative experience with WD40, except that you have to carefully wipe the oily bits off. For vintage models, it's maybe a no-no as Jacques & Robert says...

End result was fine, after oiling with some Faller "Teflon-Öl" it was smooth as silk.
That loco is now south of the equator, and I hope the nevw owner is happy with it...Smile
Juhan - "Webmaster", at your service...
He who asks a question is a fool for five minutes. He who does not ask a question remains a fool forever. [Old Chinese Proverb]
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Webmaster
Offline nevw  
#12 Posted : 10 January 2012 23:16:44(UTC)
nevw

Australia   
Joined: 27/08/2005(UTC)
Posts: 11,058
Location: Murrumba Downs QLD
Its lovely and is loved in Hot sunny QLD

OGN
wearing the Pink Pinny, which is hard to see and now have 2 new shiny tin Hips that is badly in Need of Repair matching tin shoulders
and a hose pipe on the aorta
Junior member of the Banana Club, a reformist and an old Goat with a Bad memory, loafing around
Offline elinkjoe  
#13 Posted : 16 January 2012 04:04:04(UTC)
elinkjoe


Joined: 27/05/2003(UTC)
Posts: 129
Location: Atlanta, GA
There are a lot of really good synthetic lubricants that will break down and replace dried old oils. Just dissolves it. I use Slip 2000. It's actually a gun lubricant, but so far it's done a great job unsticking the two locos I used it on.
elinkjoe
Offline NZMarklinist  
#14 Posted : 17 January 2012 07:16:43(UTC)
NZMarklinist

New Zealand   
Joined: 15/03/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1,757
Location: Auckland NZ
Originally Posted by: elinkjoe Go to Quoted Post
There are a lot of really good synthetic lubricants that will break down and replace dried old oils. Just dissolves it. I use Slip 2000. It's actually a gun lubricant, but so far it's done a great job unsticking the two locos I used it on.



Here's a synthetic lubricant available on ebay as "Absolute Best synthetic lubricant for Marklin" Huh
However He has it in lots of other categories under the same heading for all, including Guns, RC Models etc, etc. Unsure
I've been curious to try it, however shipping is as much as the product unless you order multiples which would be the thing to do, but whilst it's not too expensive, I have plenty of the Labelle products so I haven't bothered, as yet !

Has anybody tried this product ?

ebay link; http://www.ebay.com/itm/...&hash=item4cef8d8f8e
Glen
Auckland NZ

" Every Marklin layout needs a V200, a Railbus and a Banana car", not to mention a few Black and red Steamers, oh and the odd Elok !

CS1 Reloaded, Touch Cab, C Track Modules, K track layout all under construction. Currently Insider
Offline cookee_nz  
#15 Posted : 18 January 2012 11:35:13(UTC)
cookee_nz

New Zealand   
Joined: 31/12/2010(UTC)
Posts: 3,640
Location: Paremata, Wellington
Originally Posted by: NZMarklinist Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: elinkjoe Go to Quoted Post
There are a lot of really good synthetic lubricants that will break down and replace dried old oils. Just dissolves it. I use Slip 2000. It's actually a gun lubricant, but so far it's done a great job unsticking the two locos I used it on.


Here's a synthetic lubricant available on ebay as "Absolute Best synthetic lubricant for Marklin" Huh
However He has it in lots of other categories under the same heading for all, including Guns, RC Models etc, etc. Unsure
I've been curious to try it, however shipping is as much as the product unless you order multiples which would be the thing to do, but whilst it's not too expensive, I have plenty of the Labelle products so I haven't bothered, as yet !

Has anybody tried this product ?

ebay link; http://www.ebay.com/itm/...&hash=item4cef8d8f8e


Hmmm, would you trust someone telling you that they have the best snake oil for your marklin and not even have enough brains to know what a marklin train looked like? - the image looks like some cheap kamakooza brand to me. The same image is used with his Bachmann, American Flyer, Branchline, Lionel etc etc, plus of course various assorted slot cars, audio turntables, clocks you name it.

It might be a good product, but someone who does spam/keyword listings like this won't get my $

Tacky tacky, maybe like the oil will be in 5 years?

I can't find his listings for steak knives but I'm sure he must sell those also, but wait, there's more...........
Cookee
Wellington
NZ image
Offline blackrock  
#16 Posted : 20 January 2012 13:34:54(UTC)
blackrock


Joined: 07/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 10
Location: Cohasset Massachusetts
Thank you very much Robert!!!!!!!!!!!!

I used your method to clean 6 Marklin HO locs, and 1 Marklin Z loc.

I never thought the Z loc would run again.

The grime the lighter fluid flushes out is amazing.

For those without a air compressor, you can buy canned air at the hardware store.

sean
Offline sudibarba  
#17 Posted : 21 January 2012 06:43:43(UTC)
sudibarba

United States   
Joined: 28/07/2006(UTC)
Posts: 876
Location: Augusta, GA USA
Originally Posted by: blackrock Go to Quoted Post
Thank you very much Robert!!!!!!!!!!!!

I used your method to clean 6 Marklin HO locs, and 1 Marklin Z loc.

I never thought the Z loc would run again.

The grime the lighter fluid flushes out is amazing.

For those without a air compressor, you can buy canned air at the hardware store.

sean


I have compressed air available but seldom use it. I disassemble the lok and place it in an appropriate sized alum. or plastic tray ( cheap alum. bread pan - small) and soak it for a while in naptha (lghter fluid). I then dispose of the first bath and put in some clean fluid and swish it around. Take the lok out and let it dry. Clean as a whistle.
Eric
Offline elinkjoe  
#18 Posted : 03 February 2012 16:37:23(UTC)
elinkjoe


Joined: 27/05/2003(UTC)
Posts: 129
Location: Atlanta, GA
Originally Posted by: NZMarklinist Go to Quoted Post


Here's a synthetic lubricant available on ebay as "Absolute Best synthetic lubricant for Marklin" Huh
However He has it in lots of other categories under the same heading for all, including Guns, RC Models etc, etc. Unsure
I've been curious to try it, however shipping is as much as the product unless you order multiples which would be the thing to do, but whilst it's not too expensive, I have plenty of the Labelle products so I haven't bothered, as yet !

Has anybody tried this product ?

ebay link; http://www.ebay.com/itm/...&hash=item4cef8d8f8e


This fellow gets a bit of flack on some of the slot car boards. From what I read, he takes an existing sythetic oil and repackages it in these smaller bottles. Good stuff that can be purchased more economically in it's original form. I can't remember the name of the oil he is repackaging.
elinkjoe
Offline BR01097  
#19 Posted : 03 February 2012 20:41:39(UTC)
BR01097

United States   
Joined: 17/11/2010(UTC)
Posts: 228
Location: Denver, Colo. USA


At least two otherwise brand-new models purchased over eBay have been locked similarly. I have found complete disassembly of the commutator housing unnecessary; rather just loosening of the retaining screws to allow the motor core to be rotated freely by hand to be sufficient.

However, I was unaware of the harm of deposits left by such products as WD-40. I have employed something similar called Liquid Wrench which may have the same effect. So far, none of the locomotives treated to this cleaning have run less than smoothly, but in future I may just use the lighter fluid as a cleanser.

____________________________________________________________________________

Collector of Märklin fine-quality trains since 1966.




Offline RayF  
#20 Posted : 03 February 2012 21:36:21(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,768
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
There's a lot of rubbish said about WD40. I've used it for years with no negative effects.

The best thing about WD40 is that it improves electrical conductivity as well as loosening jammed parts.

Of course, as with all products, you have to know how to use it and be careful in its application. I find the best way is to spray some from the can into an old Marklin oil bottle and use it sparingly from there.

Having said that, if you need to clean off old oil, I find the kind of electrical cleaner that comes in spray cans is ideal for the job. You can spray it through the mechanism and it washes off all the old oil and carbon deposits.
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
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