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Offline Donb  
#1 Posted : 01 February 2023 22:24:31(UTC)
Donb

Canada   
Joined: 03/04/2013(UTC)
Posts: 289
Location: Fraser Valley
Hi all,

I have been running analog locos lately, and have noticed that my 3156 (140) and my 3043 (RC1) motors remain just warm to the touch, but the 3057( 3 axle bogie 151) gets very hot, cant hold a finger on the motor housing for more than a second.
I have disassembled and cleaned the motor, fresh oil, made no difference. The loco runs very well, but the drive bogie is very hot! This cant be good.
Any suggestions?



Best Regards,
Don
___________________________________________________________________________________
IB 2 and MFU modul, C track and Z scale, mostly DB/DR and SBB, SJ
Offline JohnjeanB  
#2 Posted : 02 February 2023 01:36:13(UTC)
JohnjeanB

France   
Joined: 04/02/2011(UTC)
Posts: 3,220
Location: Paris, France
Hi Don
The reasons for a motor to heat are the following:
- often in DC motors is a weakening magnet, leading to poor power and heating
- in A/C motors the reason can be that one (or more) of the coils (solenoids) have a loop in short circuit either on the inductor or on the rotor
- one last possibility is the collector is incorrectly positioned (has rotated from its factory position)

I don't know which cause it is in your case.
Cheers
Jean
thanks 3 users liked this useful post by JohnjeanB
Offline river6109  
#3 Posted : 02 February 2023 02:29:39(UTC)
river6109

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 14,766
Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
Could it be over oiled and the brushes have partly dissintigrated and clogged up the rotor's 3 spaces

John
https://www.youtube.com/river6109
https://www.youtube.com/6109river
5 years in Destruction mode
50 years in Repairing mode
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Offline Donb  
#4 Posted : 02 February 2023 06:24:06(UTC)
Donb

Canada   
Joined: 03/04/2013(UTC)
Posts: 289
Location: Fraser Valley
Originally Posted by: JohnjeanB Go to Quoted Post
Hi Don
The reasons for a motor to heat are the following:
- often in DC motors is a weakening magnet, leading to poor power and heating
- in A/C motors the reason can be that one (or more) of the coils (solenoids) have a loop in short circuit either on the inductor or on the rotor
- one last possibility is the collector is incorrectly positioned (has rotated from its factory position)

I don't know which cause it is in your case.
Cheers
Jean

Interesting suggestions Jean , I will look into those.
Thank you
Best Regards,
Don
___________________________________________________________________________________
IB 2 and MFU modul, C track and Z scale, mostly DB/DR and SBB, SJ
Offline Bryan  
#5 Posted : 03 February 2023 22:00:23(UTC)
Bryan

Australia   
Joined: 08/09/2010(UTC)
Posts: 213
Location: Bowral, NSW, Australia
Dear Don

Do you have an ammeter, to check the amperage, the very first step when a loco is not running well. The 3057 has a DCM motor which is better for less current draw than the earlier motors. A good running DCM motor is about 450mA. First step would be to fully service your loco, it is very old, and probably really needs it. Years of old oil, mixed oil, residue oil and accumulated dust will give you a high amp reading and thus heats up the motor.

best regards
David
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Offline Donb  
#6 Posted : 04 February 2023 04:59:47(UTC)
Donb

Canada   
Joined: 03/04/2013(UTC)
Posts: 289
Location: Fraser Valley
I ended up converting this loco to digital, Lokpilot 5 and Hamo magnet.
I couldnt find an issue with the armature nor the coil. I am using the armature in the digital conversion and the loco operates nicely.
The coil measured 12 ohms impedance, same as my other spare DCM coils, no short.
So it remains a puzzle as to why the analog motor ran so hot.
Best Regards,
Don
___________________________________________________________________________________
IB 2 and MFU modul, C track and Z scale, mostly DB/DR and SBB, SJ
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Donb
Offline marklinist5999  
#7 Posted : 04 February 2023 11:56:18(UTC)
marklinist5999

United States   
Joined: 10/02/2021(UTC)
Posts: 3,228
Location: Michigan, Troy
Interesting Don! Maybe the old field coil had a tiny tear, just enough to heat up.
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Offline JohnjeanB  
#8 Posted : 04 February 2023 12:30:31(UTC)
JohnjeanB

France   
Joined: 04/02/2011(UTC)
Posts: 3,220
Location: Paris, France
Hi Don
Great that you succeeded converting and solving the problem.
Originally Posted by: Donb Go to Quoted Post
The coil measured 12 ohms impedance, same as my other spare DCM coils, no short.

When there are only a few loops of the coil that are shorted (among the 300 to 600 ones) the multimeter will not show it.
To detect you need a current measure in medium frequency voltage (1 kHz or so).
Cheers
Jean

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