Analog motors running hot

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Analog motors running hot - especially my 3057 (151)

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Donb		#1 Posted : 01 February 2023 22:24:31(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 03/04/2013(UTC) Posts: 289 Location: Fraser Valley		Hi all, I have been running analog locos lately, and have noticed that my 3156 (140) and my 3043 (RC1) motors remain just warm to the touch, but the 3057( 3 axle bogie 151) gets very hot, cant hold a finger on the motor housing for more than a second. I have disassembled and cleaned the motor, fresh oil, made no difference. The loco runs very well, but the drive bogie is very hot! This cant be good. Any suggestions?
		Best Regards, Don ___________________________________________________________________________________ IB 2 and MFU modul, C track and Z scale, mostly DB/DR and SBB, SJ


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JohnjeanB		#2 Posted : 02 February 2023 01:36:13(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/02/2011(UTC) Posts: 3,343 Location: Paris, France		Hi Don The reasons for a motor to heat are the following: - often in DC motors is a weakening magnet, leading to poor power and heating - in A/C motors the reason can be that one (or more) of the coils (solenoids) have a loop in short circuit either on the inductor or on the rotor - one last possibility is the collector is incorrectly positioned (has rotated from its factory position) I don't know which cause it is in your case. Cheers Jean
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3 users liked this useful post by JohnjeanB		Donb, marklinist5999, ixldoc
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river6109		#3 Posted : 02 February 2023 02:29:39(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC) Posts: 14,782 Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square		Could it be over oiled and the brushes have partly dissintigrated and clogged up the rotor's 3 spaces John
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Donb		#4 Posted : 02 February 2023 06:24:06(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 03/04/2013(UTC) Posts: 289 Location: Fraser Valley		Originally Posted by: JohnjeanB Hi Don The reasons for a motor to heat are the following: - often in DC motors is a weakening magnet, leading to poor power and heating - in A/C motors the reason can be that one (or more) of the coils (solenoids) have a loop in short circuit either on the inductor or on the rotor - one last possibility is the collector is incorrectly positioned (has rotated from its factory position) I don't know which cause it is in your case. Cheers Jean Interesting suggestions Jean , I will look into those. Thank you
		Best Regards, Don ___________________________________________________________________________________ IB 2 and MFU modul, C track and Z scale, mostly DB/DR and SBB, SJ


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Bryan		#5 Posted : 03 February 2023 22:00:23(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 08/09/2010(UTC) Posts: 214 Location: Bowral, NSW, Australia		Dear Don Do you have an ammeter, to check the amperage, the very first step when a loco is not running well. The 3057 has a DCM motor which is better for less current draw than the earlier motors. A good running DCM motor is about 450mA. First step would be to fully service your loco, it is very old, and probably really needs it. Years of old oil, mixed oil, residue oil and accumulated dust will give you a high amp reading and thus heats up the motor. best regards David
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Donb		#6 Posted : 04 February 2023 04:59:47(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 03/04/2013(UTC) Posts: 289 Location: Fraser Valley		I ended up converting this loco to digital, Lokpilot 5 and Hamo magnet. I couldnt find an issue with the armature nor the coil. I am using the armature in the digital conversion and the loco operates nicely. The coil measured 12 ohms impedance, same as my other spare DCM coils, no short. So it remains a puzzle as to why the analog motor ran so hot.
		Best Regards, Don ___________________________________________________________________________________ IB 2 and MFU modul, C track and Z scale, mostly DB/DR and SBB, SJ

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marklinist5999		#7 Posted : 04 February 2023 11:56:18(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/02/2021(UTC) Posts: 3,402 Location: Michigan, Troy		Interesting Don! Maybe the old field coil had a tiny tear, just enough to heat up.

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JohnjeanB		#8 Posted : 04 February 2023 12:30:31(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/02/2011(UTC) Posts: 3,343 Location: Paris, France		Hi Don Great that you succeeded converting and solving the problem. Originally Posted by: Donb The coil measured 12 ohms impedance, same as my other spare DCM coils, no short. When there are only a few loops of the coil that are shorted (among the 300 to 600 ones) the multimeter will not show it. To detect you need a current measure in medium frequency voltage (1 kHz or so). Cheers Jean
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