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Offline TEB007  
#1 Posted : 20 January 2023 00:18:27(UTC)
TEB007

United States   
Joined: 21/04/2022(UTC)
Posts: 7
Location: Connecticut, Hartford
I've recently updated my Swedish SJ Rc 3 (Marklin 3341) with a new Marklin 60943 motor, and an ESU 51968 adapter + 58419 decoder. I'm no expert, but I'm pretty sure I have all the wires connected correctly. When I put it on the track, my 60657 Mobile Station correctly identifies it as "SJ Rc3 1061", the front and rear lights work, and the sounds work. When I turn the throttle up, however, it moves only a few inches then it stops, the lights go out, and it's completely unresponsive. If I delete the loco from the Station, I can go through the whole process over again. Does anyone have a recommendation of what I should check?
Offline Bill L  
#2 Posted : 20 January 2023 02:08:34(UTC)
Bill L

United States   
Joined: 08/12/2021(UTC)
Posts: 39
Location: California, Sonoma County
My initial step would be to try to unsolder the 2 wires that go to the cover plate where the graphite brushes are, and use a simple DC power source to check if the motor does turn. Did the lok run fine before your digital conversion?
Offline TEB007  
#3 Posted : 20 January 2023 03:51:27(UTC)
TEB007

United States   
Joined: 21/04/2022(UTC)
Posts: 7
Location: Connecticut, Hartford
Good idea, Bill. I unsoldered the motor and was able to successfully test it forward and reverse. It did run fine before the conversion. I just wanted to add better speed control and new sounds!
Offline TEB007  
#4 Posted : 20 January 2023 03:53:46(UTC)
TEB007

United States   
Joined: 21/04/2022(UTC)
Posts: 7
Location: Connecticut, Hartford
Good idea, Bill. I unsoldered the motor and was able to successfully test it forward and reverse. It did run fine before the conversion. I just wanted to add better speed control and new sounds!
Offline TEB007  
#5 Posted : 20 January 2023 03:55:47(UTC)
TEB007

United States   
Joined: 21/04/2022(UTC)
Posts: 7
Location: Connecticut, Hartford
Does it matter which screw on the cover plate I connect the black wire from TRKL on the decoder to?
Offline maruju  
#6 Posted : 20 January 2023 07:38:27(UTC)
maruju

Japan   
Joined: 02/11/2021(UTC)
Posts: 12
Location: Hyogo, Takarazuka
Originally Posted by: TEB007 Go to Quoted Post
I've recently updated my Swedish SJ Rc 3 (Marklin 3341) with a new Marklin 60943 motor, and an ESU 51968 adapter + 58419 decoder. I'm no expert, but I'm pretty sure I have all the wires connected correctly. When I put it on the track, my 60657 Mobile Station correctly identifies it as "SJ Rc3 1061", the front and rear lights work, and the sounds work. When I turn the throttle up, however, it moves only a few inches then it stops, the lights go out, and it's completely unresponsive. If I delete the loco from the Station, I can go through the whole process over again. Does anyone have a recommendation of what I should check?


I don't have a marklin3341, but looking at the documentation on the net, the motor is DCM or LFCM.
The marklin60943 is a conversion kit for SFCM, so it should not fit.
The conversion kit for DCM is 60941 and the kit for LFCM is 60944.

If the brush of the original motor is a square prism, it is a DCM, and if it is a cylinder, it is an LFCM.
I'll find out if you upload a picture of the motor shield.
Offline river6109  
#7 Posted : 20 January 2023 10:38:43(UTC)
river6109

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 14,115
Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
Or use a multimeter and find out which wire is not responding, you've got a sound decoder, does the sound work ? I would not turn on the sound or activate the loco, a lokprogrmmer would be handy by ascertain if the decoder responds to the decoder ?, secondly make sure the brushes are clean and they slide in freely., another option is make sure the lever is in its right position (overhead/track) and also see if there is a connection between the slider and the lever., did the loco run alright before the conversion (check with multi meter), does the slider looks new or old ?, does the motor run freely when turning the axle with the cogwheel ? have you ticked the motor overload function ?

John
https://www.youtube.com/river6109
https://www.youtube.com/6109river
5 years in Destruction mode
50 years in Repairing mode
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by river6109
Offline JohnjeanB  
#8 Posted : 20 January 2023 14:34:04(UTC)
JohnjeanB

France   
Joined: 04/02/2011(UTC)
Posts: 2,382
Location: Paris, France
Originally Posted by: TEB007 Go to Quoted Post
I've recently updated my Swedish SJ Rc 3 (Marklin 3341) with a new Marklin 60943 motor, and an ESU 51968 adapter + 58419 decoder. I'm no expert, but I'm pretty sure I have all the wires connected correctly. When I put it on the track, my 60657 Mobile Station correctly identifies it as "SJ Rc3 1061", the front and rear lights work, and the sounds work. When I turn the throttle up, however, it moves only a few inches then it stops, the lights go out, and it's completely unresponsive. If I delete the loco from the Station, I can go through the whole process over again. Does anyone have a recommendation of what I should check?

Hi
One other possibility is, when changing the motor the adjustment are not correct, causing the rotor to rub against the stator, causing heat that may shut off the decoder for protection.

How to check and solve?
- remove the brushes
- check if the motor turns freely by trying to rotate driving wheel GENTLY
- if there is a rub (friction), then unscrez a little the 2 screws (1 turn max) holding the brush holder and move the brush holder and the inductor (the magnetic circuit) until the driving wheels rotate freely. Then screw back and check.

IMO, the motor connections (Blue and Green wires) are probably OK otherwise the loco wouldn't move at all
Cheers
Jean

My layout videos
latest vid
marshalling yard
Offline TEB007  
#9 Posted : 20 January 2023 22:04:21(UTC)
TEB007

United States   
Joined: 21/04/2022(UTC)
Posts: 7
Location: Connecticut, Hartford
I don't think it's a motor problem, but I adjusted the cover plate screws a bit. I tried it on the track several times with sporadic results. Half the time it found no loco, half the time it found the correct loco, but it wouldn't move. This last time smoked the decoder so I'm back to square one.

My question now is whether the 21MTC Adapter was damaged and I need to replace that too. It looks like there's nothing on the card but wires going to the pins for the decoder.
Offline TEB007  
#10 Posted : 28 January 2023 01:46:33(UTC)
TEB007

United States   
Joined: 21/04/2022(UTC)
Posts: 7
Location: Connecticut, Hartford
OK. I've reconfirmed that the motor works forward and reverse by directly connecting it to a transformer. I've checked the brushes and cover plate screws. I've installed a new Marklin 60977 Conversion Decoder Set for Electric Locomotive. My Mobile Station easily finds it, and all the lights and sounds work great. When I turn up the throttle, it'll move anywhere from an inch up to a couple of feet then it stops dead. If I push down or jiggle the chassis it'll start up again just to stop again. When I do that, I don’t move my wiring at all. I checked the pickup shoe and everything seems tight. What the heck is wrong?
Offline klarinettmeister  
#11 Posted : 28 January 2023 08:24:38(UTC)
klarinettmeister

Sweden   
Joined: 13/02/2008(UTC)
Posts: 788
Location: Kirseberg
Hi!

I've covered some of these models 3341/3341/33411/83341. They all use the same motors. I'm pretty sure I've used 60760 for some of them just to get them running. That's the same motor parts in 60941.

Märklin included instructions with the older versions of conversation sets which motor for which locomotive. I'll try to find it off it's helpful.
Offline Goofy  
#12 Posted : 28 January 2023 12:50:33(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 8,720
Did you follow correct color schema?
H0
DCC = Digital Command Control
Offline owidgie  
#13 Posted : 29 January 2023 20:21:51(UTC)
owidgie

United States   
Joined: 03/06/2007(UTC)
Posts: 135
Originally Posted by: TEB007 Go to Quoted Post
OK. I've reconfirmed that the motor works forward and reverse by directly connecting it to a transformer. I've checked the brushes and cover plate screws. I've installed a new Marklin 60977 Conversion Decoder Set for Electric Locomotive. My Mobile Station easily finds it, and all the lights and sounds work great. When I turn up the throttle, it'll move anywhere from an inch up to a couple of feet then it stops dead. If I push down or jiggle the chassis it'll start up again just to stop again. When I do that, I don’t move my wiring at all. I checked the pickup shoe and everything seems tight. What the heck is wrong?


Just a guess here, it sounds like you only have a chassis ground to the motor which has rubber tires, you also need to ground to the frame to get a good return through the other truck. Also clean the other truck where it contacts the frame.


Just a guess

Rick

Offline cintrans  
#14 Posted : 29 January 2023 21:39:19(UTC)
cintrans

Aruba   
Joined: 11/07/2018(UTC)
Posts: 82
Location: Aruba (general), Oranjestad
Like Rick said

Run an extra ground wire from the motor to another point on the chassis and see what happens.
Had the "poor" grounding issue happen to me after a conversion.....

Jean-Pierre
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by cintrans
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