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Offline Secret Experiment  
#1 Posted : 05 April 2022 06:11:52(UTC)
Secret Experiment

Australia   
Joined: 05/04/2022(UTC)
Posts: 10
Location: Victoria, Melbourne
Hi Everyone. As an absolute novice, I'd appreciate some advice on recommisioning a 1953 Marklin 3012. I have just bought it and I understand the previous owner had it in storage for 70 years. It is certainly in beautiful condition!

67081786437__33804D4D-6F7B-45EE-AE4E-4DD4631BB23E.jpgIMG_4437.jpg


My question is: given that it has not been used for so long, is it OK to right away put it onto a track and see if it goes? Or is there something I should check out first, maybe oil or clean something?

I have plenty of time, I am waiting for a new transformer to arrive in the mail. I have an old Marklin Super inherited from my father that looks totally lethal. Indeed, someone has cut off the power cord probably as a safety strategy and I think I'll leave it that way! It will make a good paper weight.

Thanks in advance, and apologies if this topic has been covered before - please point me towards it (I had a quick look).

Adrian
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Online cookee_nz  
#2 Posted : 05 April 2022 06:39:41(UTC)
cookee_nz

New Zealand   
Joined: 31/12/2010(UTC)
Posts: 3,996
Location: Paremata, Wellington
Hi Adrian, welcome along.

It would not surprise me in the slightest if you simply put it on the track, and away it went. We hear that story often. It looks pristine, lucky you.

It will likely need a drop of oil, and possibly may need motor brushes, but only if it had already done a few miles. The wear underneath would indicate how much, (if any) running it has done.

In particular, the state of the pickup slider, and the wheels. Can you add photos of the underside?

Oil both ends of the motor armature, single small drop to start. Ditto for the wheel axles. Again, just a small drop on each.

One thing to watch, make sure the red selector switch (shown in the second photo above the left bogie) remains in the down position as shown. It's easy to bump it up when handling and that will switch the power source from the track, to the overhead.

If you intend to remove the body to oil the motor, be aware that model probably requires the two headlight bulbs to be removed first - remove the single screw between them and the holder and bulbs will fall out.

Then you can remove the screws underneath at each end and lift the body shell off.

But, honestly, I'd just try it.

As for the Super Transformer, the main (and virtually only) problem with those is the mains-cord rubber perishes. This is obviously highly dangerous, but if the cord is replaced with a modern PVC cord, it will give good reliable performance.

They've been discussed here before and for obvious reasons it's best the work is done by a certified professional such as an electrician (if you know one) or an appliance repair technician.

Repair can work out cheaper than a new modern one.

Hope this helps


Cookee
NZ
Cookee
Wellington
NZ image
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Offline Secret Experiment  
#3 Posted : 05 April 2022 06:54:43(UTC)
Secret Experiment

Australia   
Joined: 05/04/2022(UTC)
Posts: 10
Location: Victoria, Melbourne
Great, thanks Cookee. It would have taken me a while to have figured out the power selector switch - and yes, it was in the overhead position. As for figuring out to take off the headlights first, nup, never.

Here's a picture of underneath - definitely been used looking at the slider, but up top it's almost like new. It's my first purchase ever and I'm very chuffed. Would sewing machine oil be OK?

IMG_4441.jpg


Cheers, Adrian


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Online cookee_nz  
#4 Posted : 05 April 2022 09:56:31(UTC)
cookee_nz

New Zealand   
Joined: 31/12/2010(UTC)
Posts: 3,996
Location: Paremata, Wellington
Hi Adrian, even better. Virtually no wear at all. The slider wear is only a little. The giveaway is the degree of chrome worn off the wheels, and/or noticeable backlash in the wheels/gears.

Yours is also one of the very first models to have traction tyres fitted. Those ones are the original plastic type, they are possibly very hard now and may be prone to slipping, but you would only notice this pulling a heavy consist, and particularly on an incline.

Modern tyres are black rubber. Unless they are causing an issue, I'd leave them be.

By the way, do you have the original box for it? 1953 / 3012 are a mismatch. The 3012 number came from 1957 onward with the numbering system change. From 1953 to 1956 it would likely have been SEF 800 except that model is from 1955 onward.

If you are certain 1953, that indicates maybe an SEW 800

You need to refer to a reference such as Koll's to narrow it down with the help of more detailed photos of the sides & ends. If you have the box and original service booklet, images of those and the date code would quickly help narrow it down.

Clear as mud!!

It's definitely a beauty Cool
Cookee
Wellington
NZ image
Offline Secret Experiment  
#5 Posted : 05 April 2022 10:48:20(UTC)
Secret Experiment

Australia   
Joined: 05/04/2022(UTC)
Posts: 10
Location: Victoria, Melbourne
All good, and thanks again Cookie.

Unfortunately I don't have the box, and the lovely lady who sold it to me (on behalf of her husband) only said that it is a "catalog number 301". I'm to blame for calling it a 3012, I image googled it and thought I had a match. She was pretty sure it was 1953 but I am happy whatever it turns out to be, it's a beautiful thing and to be honest I mainly bought it to look at it. But, now I've got it I've become hooked - I've got some track and a transformer coming soon and I can see the start of something big! It came with 6 passenger carriages, 1950s and 1960s (these do have boxes) so I've got a complete train.

I'll have a good look at the wheels and tyres too, thanks for that info.

Some interesting research to do over winter. I will definitely find out!

Cheers, Adrian
Offline PJMärklin  
#6 Posted : 05 April 2022 12:49:59(UTC)
PJMärklin

Australia   
Joined: 04/12/2013(UTC)
Posts: 2,261
Location: Hobart, Australia
Indeed a lovely model in beautiful condition.

My Märklin catalogue for 1953 shows the SEW 800 as below :

(Note there are no plastic pantograph insulators.)

UserPostedImage


My Koll’s indicates the SEW 800 was made 1951 to 1953 with “stromabnehmer” (pantograph) type 5.
Thereafter (SEW 800 version 3 in 1954 , and as 3012 in 1955-1976) had STA type 6.

STA type 5 has no plastic insulators on the pantograph gear (as seen in image above), whereas STA type 6 does have them.

The initial post images show pantographs with insulators, so unfortunately I do not think the item was from 1953.

Have fun with your magnificent locomotive !

PJ
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Offline Secret Experiment  
#7 Posted : 05 April 2022 22:58:48(UTC)
Secret Experiment

Australia   
Joined: 05/04/2022(UTC)
Posts: 10
Location: Victoria, Melbourne
Thanks PJ, that's great information. Is there a way of deciding between a SEW 800 version 3 and a 3012? I'm pretty sure the train is from the 1950s based on the seller's information (her husband was the original purchaser) but if not, so be it.
It is still a beautiful thing. I had no idea it would be so heavy and solid!
Cheers, Adrian
Offline Secret Experiment  
#8 Posted : 06 April 2022 02:59:35(UTC)
Secret Experiment

Australia   
Joined: 05/04/2022(UTC)
Posts: 10
Location: Victoria, Melbourne
First, thank you both for your helpful replies.

I think I'm making progress although I've already been wrong a couple of times already, so any corrections really welcome.

On the front of the engine is the serial number SEH 800 (photo below). The closest match (and it appears identical) I've found on google is at this site for a "Märklin H0 - 3012.2 - Electric locomotive - BR 1101 green (SEH800) 1957 - SNCF".
: this site:

The site has this interesting information:

"Electric locomotive of the French Railways (SNCF) type BR 10000
Inscription SEH 800, running number 1101

Very good condition.
This concerns version 2, released in 1957.
Recognizable by silver beige roof and coupling type 7.
In replacement (Auhagen box) packaging
"

What, I wonder, is a coupling type 7?

Anyhow, the search goes on! Feel free to correct or add information, apologies if I'm going on a bit - I'm hoping by documenting what I'm doing might be helpful for someone else one day!

Regards, Adrian

IMG_4442.jpg
Offline PJMärklin  
#9 Posted : 06 April 2022 06:38:53(UTC)
PJMärklin

Australia   
Joined: 04/12/2013(UTC)
Posts: 2,261
Location: Hobart, Australia
Originally Posted by: Secret Experiment Go to Quoted Post
Is there a way of deciding between a SEW 800 version 3 and a 3012?



This is probably best done using Koll’s catalogue (which defines the characteristics of the various versions) whilst you have the loco in hand. :

UserPostedImage



Originally Posted by: Secret Experiment Go to Quoted Post
What, I wonder, is a coupling type 7?



This coupling is shown in Koll's thus :

UserPostedImage
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Online cookee_nz  
#10 Posted : 06 April 2022 07:27:52(UTC)
cookee_nz

New Zealand   
Joined: 31/12/2010(UTC)
Posts: 3,996
Location: Paremata, Wellington
Ok, that photo certainly helps. An internals photo or two would not go astray either

Basically there are two near-identical models, both released in 1955 and differing mainly in colour.

SEF 800 is Green, became 3012 from 1957 (F = France)
** I believe the body is still marked "SEH 800"? **

SEH 800 is Blue becoming 3013 from 1957. (H = Holland)

Determining the exact year range for models like this will come down to specific details including Panto, Couplings, roof colour etc, assuming parts are as original

CATALOGUE IMAGE from 1956 and BW page introducing the new number

1956 (1256)-p12.jpg


PARTS SHEETS from 1958....

3012und3013 (O 0458 kn)-1.jpg

3012und3013 (O 0458 kn)-2.jpg


And, the all important multi-linga original instruction leaflet (PDF 2.4Mb)

3011_3012_3013_3014-68311-an-1057-en.pdf (2,477kb) downloaded 29 time(s).

(Image is the cover only)

3011~3014 (68311 AN 1057 en)-r.jpg
Cookee
Wellington
NZ image
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Online cookee_nz  
#11 Posted : 06 April 2022 08:22:52(UTC)
cookee_nz

New Zealand   
Joined: 31/12/2010(UTC)
Posts: 3,996
Location: Paremata, Wellington
PS - that's some documentation sorted, now you need to make a box BigGrin

http://www.3rotaie.it/3r...tola_Replica.htm#English
Cookee
Wellington
NZ image
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Offline Secret Experiment  
#12 Posted : 07 April 2022 00:00:43(UTC)
Secret Experiment

Australia   
Joined: 05/04/2022(UTC)
Posts: 10
Location: Victoria, Melbourne
Cookie and MarklinPJ, you are legends!

The catalog and Koll pages are spot on and I think I can make the match. Later today I'll take some detailed photos and post them for comparison with the information you've posted.

Cheers, Adrian
Offline DanK  
#13 Posted : 07 April 2022 21:22:11(UTC)
DanK

United States   
Joined: 26/01/2022(UTC)
Posts: 16
Location: New York, Buffalo
Here is a similar one. My parents got it for me, used, in the mid 1960s. I think it is a model 3014, but am not sure. It still runs fine. It's heavy (metal) and has a strong motor. I never digitalized it (i.e. installed a decoder), but am thinking of doing so now.

IMG_8018 2 copy.jpg
Offline Secret Experiment  
#14 Posted : 08 April 2022 00:24:27(UTC)
Secret Experiment

Australia   
Joined: 05/04/2022(UTC)
Posts: 10
Location: Victoria, Melbourne
That's a nice engine Dan, I'd have it.

An update on my SEF/SEH/SEW/3012/whatever - it goes perfectly! I got my new transformer in the mail yesterday and, thank you Cookee, plugged it in and tried out the loco. Initially, nothing but after adjusting the slider a bit, full motion forward and reverse! 3 out of 4 headlights work.

I'm going to give it a clean and oil before using it too much more. I'll just slip in the comment here that I bought the damn thing to look at and now I'm completely hooked - I've got lots of track on order and am thinking about a layout!!!!

Oh, and regarding what year it is - I've been delayed on going through the information you've kindly provided but will do so in a sec. But at a glance, the couplings are none of the ones from your Koll, MarklinPJ, but look more like the ones in the catalog from Cookee, which shows a 1956 model. I've also made direct contact with the gentleman who bought it in the UK and he is pretty sure he bought it in 1955 or 1956 (His wife initially thought 1953, fair enough). So, we're getting closer, and maybe it's enough to leave it at 1955/6 (to be confirmed, of course). Again, thanks for all your help.

Cheers, Adrian
Offline Bogenschütze  
#15 Posted : 13 April 2022 18:19:05(UTC)
Bogenschütze

United Kingdom   
Joined: 10/09/2019(UTC)
Posts: 151
Location: England, Chichester
Originally Posted by: Secret Experiment Go to Quoted Post
On the front of the engine is the serial number SEH 800 (photo below). The closest match (and it appears identical) I've found on google is at this site for a "Märklin H0 - 3012.2 - Electric locomotive - BR 1101 green (SEH800) 1957 - SNCF".

IMG_4442.jpg


As a former fan and modeler of the SNCF, I have always been bemused by this model. Instead of the standard SNCF roundel on the ends of the locomotive, the Märklin product had this strange logo that seemed to me to be a stylized "CTC".

Having just received in the post my Insider Club News 2/2022 today, I read the article on the "The Brand" (page 19) and was amazed to learn that this logo was actually the Märklin trade mark from 1929 to 1963. As I am sure many of our learned members already know, it is actually an intertwined "GMC" (Märklin, Gebrüder, Cie). You live and learn.
Marklin - "The train set I never had as a child."
Keith Bowman
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Offline kiwiAlan  
#16 Posted : 13 April 2022 20:13:55(UTC)
kiwiAlan

United Kingdom   
Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC)
Posts: 8,475
Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
Originally Posted by: Bogenschütze Go to Quoted Post

Having just received in the post my Insider Club News 2/2022 today, I read the article on the "The Brand" (page 19) and was amazed to learn that this logo was actually the Märklin trade mark from 1929 to 1963. As I am sure many of our learned members already know, it is actually an intertwined "GMC" (Märklin, Gebrüder, Cie). You live and learn.


I got my 2/2022 issue today as well, and while I knew that was the Marklin trademark, I always thought of it as a bicycle, I hadn't realised it actually incorporated the initials of Gebr. Marklin & Cie, or that it is a stylised steam engine. It is actually a very clever logo when looked at like that.

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Offline Secret Experiment  
#17 Posted : 14 April 2022 08:33:08(UTC)
Secret Experiment

Australia   
Joined: 05/04/2022(UTC)
Posts: 10
Location: Victoria, Melbourne
Interesting stuff on the logo, thanks.
Although my SEF-800/3012 ran perfectly well out of the box, I have decided to send it to an experienced Marklinista for a service. It seemed a bit noisy when I ran it although the Marklinista assures me they make a bit of a whirring sound anyway. I plan on having the engine for a long time so it will be worth looking after.
I've also sent the 3005 that I inherited from my father for a service too (and to have a repair that I butchered corrected - who'd have thought the wires on a 70 year old engine would be so brittle......). In the future I am going to leave the innards to those with better fine motor skills than me!! Maybe I'll work up to being able to clean the engines and change the brushes, that would do.
Cheers, A.


Online cookee_nz  
#18 Posted : 18 April 2022 00:46:22(UTC)
cookee_nz

New Zealand   
Joined: 31/12/2010(UTC)
Posts: 3,996
Location: Paremata, Wellington
Originally Posted by: Secret Experiment Go to Quoted Post
Interesting stuff on the logo, thanks.
Although my SEF-800/3012 ran perfectly well out of the box, I have decided to send it to an experienced Marklinista for a service. It seemed a bit noisy when I ran it although the Marklinista assures me they make a bit of a whirring sound anyway. I plan on having the engine for a long time so it will be worth looking after.
I've also sent the 3005 that I inherited from my father for a service too (and to have a repair that I butchered corrected - who'd have thought the wires on a 70 year old engine would be so brittle......). In the future I am going to leave the innards to those with better fine motor skills than me!! Maybe I'll work up to being able to clean the engines and change the brushes, that would do.
Cheers, A.




This can be a real trap, and has caught me a number of times. The plastic insulation does indeed become very hard, and almost totally inflexible. When trying to disassemble, no matter how careful you are the rigidity causes greater stress to the exposed wire and you can be sure it will break, and Murphy's Law dictates that will most likely be where the wire comes out of the field magnet, or the reverse unit coil. The copper wire itself remains quite flexible, it's just the outer plastic insulation being the problem.

For this reason, I unsolder before disassembly (taking photos first is always a good idea), and wherever possible I remove the brittle hard insulation and slide on a new pliable section. Sure it's not then absolutely original, but that is still more preferable than a broken wire.
Cookee
Wellington
NZ image
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