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Offline Michael4  
#1 Posted : 18 January 2020 12:05:59(UTC)
Michael4

United Kingdom   
Joined: 02/02/2017(UTC)
Posts: 413
Location: England, South Coast
Caption on the back reads:

SBB class Ae 6/6 6,000 h.p. Co-Co electric loco No 11451 'WINTERTHUR' leaves Goschenen with the 15.03 Chiasso - Zurich HB with TC from Milan, Locarno and Ancona. 14th August 1964

I am a novice, what do HB and TC mean? Is that the bear insignia for Bern on the side? On closer inspection I'm not sure.

Also, Marklin 3050 11414 seems to have a bit more shape to the front and certainly more 'decoration' plus two central lights, not one as in the pic. Judging by the numbers presumably it was based on an earlier loco?

UserPostedImageSBB452 (1) by dralowid, on Flickr

Offline Unholz  
#2 Posted : 18 January 2020 14:03:02(UTC)
Unholz

Switzerland   
Joined: 29/07/2007(UTC)
Posts: 1,208
Location: Switzerland
Mostly easy Wink:
- HB is the abbreviation for Hauptbahnhof, and this means main station. Occasionally one also sees the older abbreviation Hbf, but it means the same.
- There are two main series of the Ae 6/6 type (total 120 machines). The first 25 units (numbered 11401 to 11425) are the so-called Cantonal Locos (in German Kantonsloks) which carry the crests/insignia of the 25 original Cantons (states) of the Swiss Confederation. These have much more decoration than the locos with the numbers 11426 to 11520. These machines are named after large Swiss communities.
- Two upper headlights: Correct, many of the Ae 6/6 and other SBB locos had two upper lamps for some time, and one of those was a red one. This was the so-called Fahrberechtigungssignal and was "fired up" by the driver when the train exceptionally ran on the right side of sections with double track (normally, one used to drive on the left side in Switzerland). Therefore, other train drivers and the station staff knew that the train was using the right track on purpose/deliberately and not due to some kind of error.
- But where do you have the "TC" from...? Unsure Probably some kind of Italian abbreviation (maybe "treno combinato" or "treno commerciale"), because the train is coming from the Italian-speaking South, but I can't place it exactly at the moment, sorry.

And wonderful, the good old Ae 6/6 11451 "Winterthur" in the picture - the town where the loco was built and also the town where I live. Wub But there shouldn't be any bear on the coat-of-arms, we have two lions in it. Smile
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Unholz
Offline Michael4  
#3 Posted : 18 January 2020 14:24:05(UTC)
Michael4

United Kingdom   
Joined: 02/02/2017(UTC)
Posts: 413
Location: England, South Coast
Yes, under a magnifying glass, Lions top right and bottom left, dividing line top left to bottom right?
Offline Unholz  
#4 Posted : 18 January 2020 14:28:41(UTC)
Unholz

Switzerland   
Joined: 29/07/2007(UTC)
Posts: 1,208
Location: Switzerland
Correct.
Winterthur.png
Oops, I didn't want it to appear that big...ThumbDown
Offline mike c  
#5 Posted : 18 January 2020 23:34:14(UTC)
mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 6,658
Location: Montreal, QC
According to the description, the train is made up of coaches from Italy (Milano and Ancona) and Swiss coaches from Locarno.
TC probably stands for "Through Coaches", which indicate that the coaches are attached to Swiss trains (e.g. Chiasso to Basel) and continue on to destinations outside the country.
Typically, such a consist would have a SBB element at either the front or rear, often with SBB dining coach, followed by international day coaches and couchette and sleeper night cars.

I am pretty sure that this is the English equivalent of the German term "Kurswagen" indicating coaches to a further destination attached to the Stammzug (Main consist)

Regards

Mike C
Offline Michael4  
#6 Posted : 19 January 2020 00:07:52(UTC)
Michael4

United Kingdom   
Joined: 02/02/2017(UTC)
Posts: 413
Location: England, South Coast
Ah Ha! I understand.

When I was young we would travel to Italy by train every year to stay with my Grandmother. We would catch the train at Victoria, London at 10.30 am, down to Dover and then by ferry to Calais where two friendly brown FS coaches would be waiting. We would get on these and get shunted (or so it seemed) all round Europe before waking up in Milan early the following morning, then without changing on down to our destination, Bologna.

As children we were warned never ever to leave our coach when the train was approaching a station, we might find ourselves cut off and shunted somewhere we didn't want to go.

I guess that would be called 'TC'.
Offline river6109  
#7 Posted : 20 January 2020 00:40:06(UTC)
river6109

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 13,111
Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
Originally Posted by: Michael4 Go to Quoted Post
Ah Ha! I understand.

When I was young we would travel to Italy by train every year to stay with my Grandmother. We would catch the train at Victoria, London at 10.30 am, down to Dover and then by ferry to Calais where two friendly brown FS coaches would be waiting. We would get on these and get shunted (or so it seemed) all round Europe before waking up in Milan early the following morning, then without changing on down to our destination, Bologna.

As children we were warned never ever to leave our coach when the train was approaching a station, we might find ourselves cut off and shunted somewhere we didn't want to go.

I guess that would be called 'TC'.


Funny you say this, I went from Graz (Austria) to Hannover in Germany with my mother as a kid to visit relatives, my mother must have been terrified, as a kid I never could sit still for a minute and was always on the move to explore, especially the last carriage as you could see behind the train, How I didn't finish up in another country or a different town or city is still a mystery but at least I'm still here to tell the story. BigGrin

John

https://www.youtube.com/river6109
https://www.youtube.com/6109river
5 years in Destruction mode
50 years in Repairing mode
Offline mike c  
#8 Posted : 21 January 2020 02:27:02(UTC)
mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 6,658
Location: Montreal, QC
Even recently, the EC Tiziano and other trains south through the Gotthard had coaches and the restaurant which ended their travel at Chiasso, so it occasionally happened that passengers booked to Milano ended up stranded at the Swiss border. Most often, they would be told to change cars by the conductors, but it still happened from time to time.
Today, ETR 610 travelling from Basel or via Zurich often contain two trainsets, one which ends in Lugano while the other continues on to Milano. If you don't get on the right one, you might have an unexpected layover and train change...

Currently, it is also possible to travel from Zermatt to St. Moritz via the Glacier Express Through coaches. They travel from Valais to Grisons attached to Zermatt to Brig trains, Brig to Disentis and and are then brought to destination by a scheduled RhB train. The complete Glacier Express consists run the whole route but not hourly.

Regards

Mike C
Offline robertsandboge  
#9 Posted : 11 May 2020 17:52:47(UTC)
robertsandboge

Sweden   
Joined: 06/05/2020(UTC)
Posts: 1
Location: Göteborg
Originally Posted by: Unholz Go to Quoted Post
Mostly easy Wink:
- Two upper headlights: Correct, many of the Ae 6/6 and other SBB locos had two upper lamps for some time, and one of those was a red one. This was the so-called Fahrberechtigungssignal and was "fired up" by the driver when the train exceptionally ran on the right side of sections with double track (normally, one used to drive on the left side in Switzerland). Therefore, other train drivers and the station staff knew that the train was using the right track on purpose/deliberately and not due to some kind of error.


I was wondering about that. The 39364 has this option. Now I know when to use this light option. Thanks!
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