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dickinsonj
#51
Posted :
28 January 2019 15:15:52(UTC)
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Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC)
Posts: 1,806
Location: Crozet, Virginia
Originally Posted by: Minok
I’ll admit ignorance. Could you list a few places to buy high quality drop in replacement motors for the modern DC mass produced motors?
I was thinking of sb-modellbau.com when I posted that, although I am sure that there are others out there known to this community.
Originally Posted by: Minok
I’d have thought they use those because the good quality DC motor is now comoditised like good LED or good bolts. There are lots of sources and they all make good motors of equally longevity and attributes. But it appears that isn’t the case. Certainly some motors have very poor low end starting characteristics. Maybe that’s a gear ration issue as well. I’d love to spend the extra $30 and upgrade a loco, but I’d not looked into it and don’t know what models from what vendor.
Yes, that is largely true for DC motors. In my professional experience they are mostly commoditized at this point for many generic applications, but the inexpensive motors that Märklin uses today are more prone to problems with poor running characteristics and premature failure. The running problems can largely be overcome with good quality decoders but their longevity remains suspect.
The problem is that for easy replacement the motors need to have the proper performance specs and almost the same form factor. That means buying from a high quality source such as SB Modellbau, which is always going to be expensive. I have a friend who buys new Märklin locos and gives them a test run to to see that they were working properly from the factory. Then he replaces the decoders with ESU decoders and the motors too if necessary with good quality ones from SB Modellbau. That way he has the positive features of a Märklin loco without the drawbacks. This is an extreme tactic though IMO and we really should not have to do that just to have a loco of acceptably high quality, especially at today's prices.
I find the newest Märklin decoders acceptable and I run the original motors as long as they work. But I usually do not buy another cheap replacement motor from them, but prefer to upgrade to a better component if it is available. I also take that into account when deciding to spend the money on a Märklin model at this point and more transparency about the quality of the motors they install would be a big help in that decision. I assume that is why they don't care to share that info with us.
Regards,
Jim
I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains!
So many trains and so little time.
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RayF
#52
Posted :
28 January 2019 20:05:18(UTC)
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Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,870
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
I've had a couple of the cheap Marklin motors fail in the last few years, which is not bad considering how many locos I have (>150), although to be fair a large percentage of these are old style motors.
In both cases I bought a replacement motor from Marklin for under 30 Euro and these replacements have not failed yet. I'm quite happy with this situation, with my only concern being that the spare motors might not be available in the future.
I have no complaints about the running qualities of the locos fitted with these motors. Almost without exception they run more smoothly and quietly than the majority of DCM equipped locos.
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
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dickinsonj
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mbarreto
#53
Posted :
28 January 2019 21:28:44(UTC)
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Joined: 18/02/2008(UTC)
Posts: 1,334
When we talk about the 36xxx locomotives I accept they use cheap motors with cheap replacement posibility as long as they produce good results which seems to be the case for many of us.
When we talk about 39xxx locmotives, like for example the news 39880, 39150 and the all special (at least in price) 39520, that are by no means cheap, I think they must use really good motors and write in the specifications what motor the locomotive is using.
Unfortunately I don't think they will say what the motor is and also I don't think the motors of these more expensive models are from brands with a name like Faulhaber or Maxon. Probably they still use a Chinese motor with slightly better characteristics. The fact that the motor brand and model is hidden from is more or less the same as say/write it is Chinese (with all respect to the Chinese).
Of course there are good and bad products from China. Just we don't know if Märklin is using the good ones or the bad ones... Not specifying, again, makes us think...
Best regards,
Miguel
Mostly Märklin H0.
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TEEWolf
#54
Posted :
28 January 2019 22:03:08(UTC)
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Joined: 01/06/2016(UTC)
Posts: 2,465
Originally Posted by: mbarreto
When we talk about the 36xxx locomotives I accept they use cheap motors with cheap replacement posibility as long as they produce good results which seems to be the case for many of us.
When we talk about 39xxx locmotives, like for example the news 39880, 39150 and the all special (at least in price) 39520, that are by no means cheap, I think they must use really good motors and write in the specifications what motor the locomotive is using.
Unfortunately I don't think they will say what the motor is and also I don't think the motors of these more expensive models are from brands with a name like Faulhaber or Maxon. Probably they still use a Chinese motor with slightly better characteristics. The fact that the motor brand and model is hidden from is more or less the same as say/write it is Chinese (with all respect to the Chinese).
Of course there are good and bad products from China. Just we don't know if Märklin is using the good ones or the bad ones... Not specifying, again, makes us think...
Somewhere I read, Märklin certifies for all Insider models the locos are all produced in Germany. Explains their price up to a certain extend.
WWW
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mbarreto
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kiwiAlan
#55
Posted :
28 January 2019 22:23:13(UTC)
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Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC)
Posts: 8,496
Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
Originally Posted by: TEEWolf
Originally Posted by: mbarreto
When we talk about the 36xxx locomotives I accept they use cheap motors with cheap replacement posibility as long as they produce good results which seems to be the case for many of us.
When we talk about 39xxx locmotives, like for example the news 39880, 39150 and the all special (at least in price) 39520, that are by no means cheap, I think they must use really good motors and write in the specifications what motor the locomotive is using.
Unfortunately I don't think they will say what the motor is and also I don't think the motors of these more expensive models are from brands with a name like Faulhaber or Maxon. Probably they still use a Chinese motor with slightly better characteristics. The fact that the motor brand and model is hidden from is more or less the same as say/write it is Chinese (with all respect to the Chinese).
Of course there are good and bad products from China. Just we don't know if Märklin is using the good ones or the bad ones... Not specifying, again, makes us think...
Somewhere I read, Märklin certifies for all Insider models the locos are all produced in Germany. Explains their price up to a certain extend.
Well, all MHI models have 5 year warranty. Non-MHI models have a shorter warranty AIUI.
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dickinsonj
#56
Posted :
29 January 2019 03:43:57(UTC)
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Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC)
Posts: 1,806
Location: Crozet, Virginia
Originally Posted by: TEEWolf
Somewhere I read, Märklin certifies for all Insider models the locos are all produced in Germany. Explains their price up to a certain extend.
They are definitely produced in Germany but no doubt with parts from around the world. I seldom have a problem with the finishes and assembly quality of Märklin models but I do question the motors and how long replacements will remain available. When I check on spare part availability on the Märklin site I often see the dreaded red light next to the motors, making me wonder just how long I can count on Märklin supplying them.
Regards,
Jim
I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains!
So many trains and so little time.
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LaurentNL
#57
Posted :
29 January 2019 19:42:22(UTC)
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Joined: 14/01/2019(UTC)
Posts: 15
Originally Posted by: kimballthurlow
Hi Laurent,
Many of us here just love C track, and are always keen to to see different applications.
If you have any ideas about smart use of C track, please feel free to post them in this topic.
https://www.marklin-user...s--uses--and-innovations
I'll see if I can add anything valuable.
Quote:
Did you know that the radii used in model trains is just most unrealistic.
But Maerklin get it to work so well.
A main line in real life is usually a minimum 800m radius, which equates to 9.24 metres in HO scale.
Whereas Maerklin's largest curve is the 24912, or R9, which is 1.114 metres.
That is only 12% of what it should be to be a realistic 1:87.
So in my opinion the length of HO scale locos, wagons or coaches is not as important as the ability for them to operate on toy train curves.
regards
Kimball
Wellknown. That's why I prefer longer sections of straight. But then, you have to turn around somewhere.
Originally Posted by: dickinsonj
R6 would be a dream for me too. Although I fear that it will also remain that way - just a dream.
I know. So I took things into my own hands.
I made a first prototype which already has been tested (used it in a loop) successfully.
Laurent
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