Originally Posted by: Minok 
Originally Posted by: clapcott 
===============
Re: Categorisation
No. You are being far to specific.
Ok so then I still don't have any idea when the m83 vs m84 should be chosen. Can someone who knows clarify?
For reference we have to start somewhere ...
m83 60831 = medienpdb.maerklin.de/product_files/1/pdf/60831_betrieb.pdf
m84 60841 = medienpdb.maerklin.de/product_files/1/pdf/60841_betrieb.pdf
and from the Marketing hype .. 2017 New Items page 136
60832 m83 Decoder
#1 - This is a receiver for switching turnouts, signals and uncoupler tracks
.. and ..
#2 - A 60821 accessory set is required per pair of outputs for motor drives
.. and ..
#3 - the m83 has 8 outputs that may be controlled on pairs or separately
and
60842 m84 Decoder
#4 - This is a receiver for for turning on/off continuous current ...
.. and ..
#5 - The m84 has 8 relays in 4 galvanically isolated groups for switching users
-- and ..
#6 - ... the m84 has 8 inputs for manually switching the relays
.. and ..
#7 - (similar to a 7244)Explaination/Limitations
see also
https://www.marklin-users.net/forum/posts/t28608-m83-60831-m84-60841---60821-60822-----light-reading#1,
- This is the
prime design objective of the m83 - and is a replacement for the k83
- the reference to turnouts and signals is making the assumption that the turnouts are pulse driven. This is, indeed, common in the Marklin product range, but is not exclusive (e.g. hobby range) and if you have units that need continuous power, an external relay or m84 might be the required option
- for uncoupling, UNLIKE the k83 the m83 does not hold a port energised while the fingure holds the controller button down. the time duration is set within the m83. although holding the button down will cause pulses of activity - which is sometimes desirable - most operations I am aware of prefer the Relex mode where a relay (k84) is used to turn the uncoupler on while the train moves over the ramp and then turns it off afterwards.
#2
- This is a "Me too" wanabe , but it is a valid option for motor control. Although the power comes from within the unit!
- It has a very specific and limited usability in the Marklin world - The only init I am aware of is the 1-Guage Hubner rebranded turnout motor
- the grammar is wrong - the 60821 does provide 4 units - so one 60821 kit has the necessary hardware for all 4 port pairs
https://www.marklin-user...light-reading#post469234#3
- note: you may configure ports and port pairs individually within the same m83
(e.g. 1(pr)=60821 motor, 1(pr)=7039 signal, 1(pr)=74491 turnout motor, 2(individual light circuits)
- further, the configuration does allow for more complex interaction of the ports - e.g. one button switching of 3Way turnouts and Double slips
#4
- This is the
prime design objective of the m84 - and is a simulated replacement for the k84 (as already mentioned the m84 is NOT latching)
#5
- This is correct. each port pair is created by two DPST relays to appear, by default, as DPDTs with a common common. They may be switch individually but the common remains the same.
- One pair of poles is used for the "continuous current" switching of the users choice - e.g. DC, AC, Track Digital, Sound to speakers
- The 2nd pair of poles is used internally to provide a solution for the LED circuits of the Hobby range of signals - the brightness may be controlled (per whole m84 = CV39)
#6
- Aimed at the hobby ,
Non digital use of the m84 box.
- beware that these inputs must be pulse driven (e.g. (Mom)-Off-(Mom) ) - using a fixed switch (e.g. On-Off-On) causes problems
(I used to be optimistic that a "update" might have addressed this)
#7
- not a very good analogy really. the 7244 is a single 4PDT (one control pair address). I suggest you ignore
FWIW,
my recommendation to anyone who asks about a k84/m84 is to use a "k83/m83 plus external latching relay" instead.
Note, the k83 provided a -22V regulated pedestal voltage, while the m83 has a stabalised 16V. - i.e. a 24V relay would work with the k83 but not the m83.
Quote:And did I read that right that they can/are both powered just fine directly from a DC power supply and the intermediate part 60822 is not needed?
Yes
- Of course the load current through the m84 relays are outside this power discussion.
- Note that the Marklin provided solutions offer 2Amp (36VA @18 volts)
- - the units themselves show "20V" on the underside
- - the specs for each m83 allow for 3Amp - go figure.
For CV programming with a MS2 you really
need an external power supply as the reads usually drop a bit (bit 0). And even then do not try extensive read/writes - the m83 overheats.