Joined: 15/04/2003(UTC) Posts: 2,734 Location: ,
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For those of you that may not yet have seen or gotten this model, please find below some pictures which show the redesign that I mentioned some time earlier (in the thread about "another new beauty - #36871"). The still metal frame (Gehäuse) is no longer mounted via one of the domes but rather by two screws at the bottom body (Fahrwerk) - one of them underneath the front coupling. As you can see, the wheelsets are now mounted different as before behind the "break hood" (Bremsattrappe) and there is no longer any space planned for the old Telex - but "lets wait and see".  Driving characteristics is similar smooth like the 36871, even better due to the locomotive weight.    Regards, Lutz
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Joined: 06/01/2004(UTC) Posts: 913 Location: The Central Coast
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Lutz,Thanks for the pictures and the information,very informative |
worse things happen at sea |
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Joined: 10/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 2,162 Location: Portugal
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Any info on the specs of the decoder, including manufacturer?
Luis
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Joined: 14/04/2006(UTC) Posts: 304 Location: Southern California
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Hi, Sad to see that they put the cheapest available toy motor in it. Where did the famous german engineering go ?!?! When the brass flips, that act as brushes are gone, you need to replace the whole motor.
BR, Juha |
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Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC) Posts: 31,707 Location: United Kingdom
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Thanks for the pictures and review. |
Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy. |
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Joined: 06/03/2005(UTC) Posts: 1,159 Location: The Netherlands
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@ Hemmerich, could you adjust the link to your images?
And I wonder if this new decoder can be used to convert DC locomotives. |
Absolutly AFB-NOHAB fan ;-) |
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Joined: 06/02/2005(UTC) Posts: 1,383 Location: Darmstadt,
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Thanks for posting the pictures.
What I like very much is that the engineman's cab is free now, This will improve the overall impression drastically. And the casing has been revised, obviously.
Unfortunately they removed the Heusinger control of the valve gear, but this may be a matter of cost. Well, the valve gear of the old BR 81 was a little clumsy, indeed.
Allthough the motor looks like a cheap mass production product from somewhere in far east. Does the decoder have any load regulation ? If so, I suppose the running performance should be good. But it's a pity to see the old SFCM and DCM motors disappear from M's program.
Hans Martin
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Joined: 08/06/2002(UTC) Posts: 1,843 Location: Norway
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Hello,
As mentioned in the topic about the 36871 it is really sad to see that this is the future of Märklin loco's,,,
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Pål Paulsen Märklin Spur 1 Digital, epoche 3 |
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Joined: 15/04/2003(UTC) Posts: 2,734 Location: ,
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Quote:[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by laalves <br />Any info on the specs of the decoder, including manufacturer?
Hi All, the decoder is basically the same as mounted in the new BR89 (#30000) and alike. It's a programmable fx decoder especially manuactured for Märklin by a subcontracted Southern German company. The company name starts with "Z"  )and delivers as well the decoders for the BR185/TRAXX and some other locos like the SBB Ae 3/6 or the new starter sets #29655/29755. You'll/should not get these decoders direct from the subcontractor; they are only available by their corresponding part numbers from Märklin. You might also know this decoder type from the conversion set #60760. Yes, the decoder has full load regulation and is suitable for loco conversions with corresponding DC/HLA motors. As hopefully everyone can see, these decoders have nothing to do with ESU (a rumor that was spread around different forums by several people in the past). The following pictures show the basic decoder design (with additional f1 output).   Regards, Lutz
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Joined: 15/03/2003(UTC) Posts: 9,614 Location: Australia
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So this means that the ESU Lokprogrammer can not be used to change the settings on these units.. Is that true?
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Adrian Australia flag by abFlags.com |
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Joined: 22/04/2004(UTC) Posts: 12,139 Location: New York, NY
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Quote:[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Sad to see that they put the cheapest available toy motor in it. Where did the famous german engineering go ?!?! Well, this world is bad, and so are this forum's members. Never satisfied, always muttering. It's a shame ... M is making gigantic efforts for us, wanna give us their latest high tech for our worthless cash - and what's your reaction, huh ???!!! [:o)] *** Seriously - never saw so much garbage assembled in one single engine. Talk about latest edition of china junk. If this is M's future - thank you [xx(][xx(][xx(] That "motor" [xx(][xx(][xx(] is an insult for any loco !!! When we visited her family in June, Roro bought this pocket airconditioner near Place de la Concorde. Same motor - but €1.99      John |
I hope no one visits a poor Southener's layout in Brooklyn. Intruders beware of Gators. AT&SF, D&RGW, T&P, SP, WP, UP, BN, NYC, ARR, epI-III - analog & digital Marklin Classics only. CU#6021 FX-MOTOROLA DIGITAL SYSTEM. Fast as lightning and no trouble. What else ... Outlaw Member of BIG JUHAN's OUTSIDER CLUB. With the most members, worldwide
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Joined: 29/08/2003(UTC) Posts: 1,915 Location: Netherlands
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I have only one hobby loc with this engine. It is a hobby model nothing more and nothing less. I will not buy this kind of locs. For 50 euro more you have a better Marklin loc and engine.
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M-track with a CS2. |
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Joined: 10/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 2,162 Location: Portugal
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Let me say that you guys never seem happy sometimes......
That's a cheap motor for a cheap lok, aimed at a market target which is not necessarily us, avid buyers of the best of the best.
Märklin continues to treat us with those beauties, so why complain if they decide to provide a cheaper range? Don't like them, dont buy them, buy the whole Karl Belingrodt series, for example....[}:)]
I'm not a customer for these loks, either, but most likely my kid will be.
BTW, I have had literally hundreds of these sealed motors types around during my life and I never saw a single one fail.
And to tell you you the truth, the old style of AC Märklin motors really suck, because they are so extraordinarily ineficient and irregular runners. The permanent DC 5-pole motors are more eficient but are not exactly the best construction around. The brush holders design is quite bad, and often result in brush misalignment, wearing down one of the brushes more than the other.
Be thankful for Märklin reviving the Primex concept, instead of wooeing big M down. And it's really weird seing people sighing to have Primex branded loks back and wooeing Märklin for coming back with a strongly revived Hobby range.
Luis
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Joined: 29/08/2003(UTC) Posts: 1,915 Location: Netherlands
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"And to tell you you the truth, the old style of AC Märklin motors really suck, because they are so extraordinarily ineficient and irregular runners".
You are right of course. The old three star engines were a diseaster.
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M-track with a CS2. |
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Joined: 03/01/2003(UTC) Posts: 5,193 Location: Southern New Jersey, USA
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Hardly a "disaster" but certainly not the smooth low speed runners we are expecting in today's market. The S- and L- FCM motors are rugged and dependable. I have seen some uneven brush wear on the DCM's, but still they are a good motor. Although I have converted most of mine to 5 pole digital, I still keep a few unconverted loks with "Universal" motors around for nostalgic reasons and set them up on some M-track when I get the mood. |
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Joined: 22/04/2004(UTC) Posts: 12,139 Location: New York, NY
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Quote:[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by laalves <br />so why complain if they decide to provide a cheaper range? Wrong. M doesn't provide a cheaper range as a new add-on to their line of locos. This non-expensive range was always there:   But now they make junk out of a truly excellent and affordable little loco. And since I am a customer for such locos I do complain. And refuse buying some of their new ones [}:)] I'm watching M's new products, concentrated. Especially since M's management framed me heavily with that Harry Potter Garbage Set, made of cheap china plastic - €300 down the drain, then. Only two months later M made a reduction in prices, down to €170 ... [xx(][xx(][xx(] John |
I hope no one visits a poor Southener's layout in Brooklyn. Intruders beware of Gators. AT&SF, D&RGW, T&P, SP, WP, UP, BN, NYC, ARR, epI-III - analog & digital Marklin Classics only. CU#6021 FX-MOTOROLA DIGITAL SYSTEM. Fast as lightning and no trouble. What else ... Outlaw Member of BIG JUHAN's OUTSIDER CLUB. With the most members, worldwide
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Joined: 10/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 2,162 Location: Portugal
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Quote:[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote: Originally posted by john black<br /> Quote:[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by laalves <br />so why complain if they decide to provide a cheaper range? Wrong. M doesn't provide a cheaper range as a new add-on to their line of locos. This non-expensive range was always there:   But now they make junk out of a truly excellent and affordable little loco. And since I am a customer for such locos I do complain. And refuse buying [}:)] John Sorry John, but the BR 81 was never sold in the normal range with a 6090 and 5-star motor, the bigger tech advancement it ever saw was a Delta decoder and the DCM motor.... There was only a starterset (29185) with a 6090 equipped BR 81. So, if you look at this right, the BR 81 NOW has a smooth running DC motor and a load regulated decoder [}:)] Up until 2005, there were no DC motorised, load regulated loks in the Hobby range. Luis
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Joined: 22/04/2004(UTC) Posts: 12,139 Location: New York, NY
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Luis: You're right with that picture (sorry, got no other one at the moment) so I officially withdraw it. But it is an especially nice picture, isn't it ?! [:o)] ... And the facts ? - they remain. It's great discussing things though staying polite, old friend  Have a nice day, John |
I hope no one visits a poor Southener's layout in Brooklyn. Intruders beware of Gators. AT&SF, D&RGW, T&P, SP, WP, UP, BN, NYC, ARR, epI-III - analog & digital Marklin Classics only. CU#6021 FX-MOTOROLA DIGITAL SYSTEM. Fast as lightning and no trouble. What else ... Outlaw Member of BIG JUHAN's OUTSIDER CLUB. With the most members, worldwide
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Joined: 10/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 2,162 Location: Portugal
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Quote:[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote: Originally posted by john black<br />Luis  : You're right with that picture (sorry, got no other one at the moment) so I officially withdraw it. But it is an especially nice picture, isn't it ?! [:o)] ... And the facts ? - they remain. It's a great picture al'righty! But it doesn't correspond to a normal range lok.... I don't think that it corresponds to the starterset lok I mentioned, that one didn't have Telex couplers, AFAIK. And by "facts" what do you refer to? I believe we have established the Hobby loks have in fact been upgraded in smoothness, load regulated decoders, electromechanical efficiency (included MUCH lower current consumption) AND even looks: the main complaint I have regarding some Märklin loks is the non-see-through cabins [}:)]. And thank you for the compliment!!! It's great to have friends here, indeed! Next time I drop by in NY, I'll drop by in your precinct! Is it the 13th  ? Luis
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Joined: 22/04/2004(UTC) Posts: 12,139 Location: New York, NY
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I see, detailing is an important factor for you - whereas I referred to technics, only. Sorry, my mistake. Well, some locos have grown better with time, some not. Just try to run that Harry Potter Steamer #29551 (analog or digital layout, no difference) - this loco's running qualities are pure horror [:0] Whereas my stone old SFCM BR81s (2x M#3032, 1x P#3196) are sailing super smoothly ... [:p][:p][:p]
No, it's Federal Building, 26 Federal Plaza. But drop me a line, before.
John
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I hope no one visits a poor Southener's layout in Brooklyn. Intruders beware of Gators. AT&SF, D&RGW, T&P, SP, WP, UP, BN, NYC, ARR, epI-III - analog & digital Marklin Classics only. CU#6021 FX-MOTOROLA DIGITAL SYSTEM. Fast as lightning and no trouble. What else ... Outlaw Member of BIG JUHAN's OUTSIDER CLUB. With the most members, worldwide
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Joined: 10/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 2,162 Location: Portugal
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Ahhhhh, but the Harry Potter set is Bachmann, which is just about the crappiest manufacturer around, together with Mehano.....
Märklin shouldn't have put their brand name on it....
Luis
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Joined: 22/04/2004(UTC) Posts: 12,139 Location: New York, NY
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Quote:[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by laalves <br />Märklin shouldn't have put their brand name on it ... Yeah. And we never know what further junk this poor abused logo will meet in the future ... [}:)] |
I hope no one visits a poor Southener's layout in Brooklyn. Intruders beware of Gators. AT&SF, D&RGW, T&P, SP, WP, UP, BN, NYC, ARR, epI-III - analog & digital Marklin Classics only. CU#6021 FX-MOTOROLA DIGITAL SYSTEM. Fast as lightning and no trouble. What else ... Outlaw Member of BIG JUHAN's OUTSIDER CLUB. With the most members, worldwide
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Joined: 02/10/2005(UTC) Posts: 856 Location: ,
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Isn't the Harry Potter train made by Hornby. I see it oft when I order my Skaledale houses. |
You are never too late to become a Märklin fan. |
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Joined: 22/04/2004(UTC) Posts: 12,139 Location: New York, NY
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Mine reads Marklin. So M is responsible for. But they never cared about. This is fraud. M's management is just good for collecting the cash [xx(]
John
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I hope no one visits a poor Southener's layout in Brooklyn. Intruders beware of Gators. AT&SF, D&RGW, T&P, SP, WP, UP, BN, NYC, ARR, epI-III - analog & digital Marklin Classics only. CU#6021 FX-MOTOROLA DIGITAL SYSTEM. Fast as lightning and no trouble. What else ... Outlaw Member of BIG JUHAN's OUTSIDER CLUB. With the most members, worldwide
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Joined: 03/01/2003(UTC) Posts: 5,193 Location: Southern New Jersey, USA
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This set, along with the Thomas set, was a grab at quick cash capitalizing on a popular theme. Neither set, IMHO, will entice a newby to look further at Marklin for other train items. Many people will have these sets as their impressions of Marklin quality. |
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Joined: 15/04/2003(UTC) Posts: 2,734 Location: ,
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Quote:[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by xxup <br />So this means that the ESU Lokprogrammer can not be used to change the settings on these units.. Is that true?
Why should ESU support a decoder they have nothing to do with? Programming of those decoders is described by Märklin, for their digital control units with programming capabilities (6021, MS/CS). ESU has published its list of decoders supported by the LokProgrammer. AFAIK the only Märklin item shown in that list is the mfx decoder - obviously.  Regards, Lutz
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Joined: 15/04/2003(UTC) Posts: 2,734 Location: ,
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Quote:[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by hmsfix Unfortunately they removed the Heusinger control of the valve gear, but this may be a matter of cost. Well, the valve gear of the old BR 81 was a little clumsy, indeed. From all what I can tell, you can still mount the valve gear with Heusinger control known from previous versions of this model. They have the part #227959 (right) and #227965 (left). Regards, Lutz
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Joined: 15/04/2003(UTC) Posts: 2,734 Location: ,
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Quote:[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by laalves <br />Let me say that you guys never seem happy sometimes......
Well, this attribute was mostly put to Germans in the past - but since the soccer event that has surely changed!!!   Quote:[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:And to tell you you the truth, the old style of AC Märklin motors really suck, because they are so extraordinarily ineficient and irregular runners. The permanent DC 5-pole motors are more eficient but are not exactly the best construction around. The brush holders design is quite bad, and often result in brush misalignment, wearing down one of the brushes more than the other. This is an interesting quote - since it EXACTLY matches with Märklin's determination and subsequent decision, also cost based to change their construction concept for those motors. Version 1 (low cost models, like this) - inexpensive "off the shelf" DC motors. Version 2 (high value/cost models, like Taurus, V200, etc.) - high performance compact C-Sine motors. In conjunction with these changes, the mechanical design of the corresponding models is also updated for easier manufacturing (less labor cost) and better reuse for possibly planned two-rail versions. Can't see anything wrong with that. Regards, Lutz
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Joined: 15/04/2003(UTC) Posts: 2,734 Location: ,
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Quote:[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by john black And since I am a customer for such locos I do complain. And refuse buying some of their new ones [}:)]
John, you like anyone else have the right to complain (if you have "nothing better to do") and refuse buying something YOU don't like. However, who cares? [}:)][}:)][}:)] Märklin? They even don't know how much money they earn from you and if they don't get it from you they will earn it from other customer that are still attracted by this nice model. Frankly speaking, I too could not care less about things you don't wanna buy, since I'm only interested in learning from people about their personal experience with those models.  Regards, Lutz Regards, Lutz
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Joined: 03/01/2003(UTC) Posts: 5,193 Location: Southern New Jersey, USA
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Lutz: The problem is that we have become accustomed to expecting anything with the Marklin name on it to be Marklin quality. It is not a matter of not buying something you don't like, since we don't know it is inferior until after we have already paid. This type of product will undermine the brand loyalty we have had for Marklin in the past.
If it is a fact that now "Hobby" means "inferior" at least we have a benchmark then to make a rational decision. I don't beleive that either the Harry Potter or the Thaomas set were so marked. |
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Joined: 22/04/2004(UTC) Posts: 12,139 Location: New York, NY
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Quote:[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by Hemmerich <br />However, who cares? [}:)][}:)][}:)] Märklin ? No. Their banks ...    Lutz: However, I'm NOT against new, affordable models - this is good policy by M. It's just as Ron said - we all are used a certain level of quality by the world's top class MRR maker. And since there has been some downgrading of quality on certain M locos in the recent past - this forum is watching ...  BTW, re your "If you have nothing better to do": This is correct - not at the moment ... And right now I'm busy bashing M's clown management for their sh*t they produced and the good money they drew from my wallet  Best Regards, John |
I hope no one visits a poor Southener's layout in Brooklyn. Intruders beware of Gators. AT&SF, D&RGW, T&P, SP, WP, UP, BN, NYC, ARR, epI-III - analog & digital Marklin Classics only. CU#6021 FX-MOTOROLA DIGITAL SYSTEM. Fast as lightning and no trouble. What else ... Outlaw Member of BIG JUHAN's OUTSIDER CLUB. With the most members, worldwide
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Joined: 14/04/2006(UTC) Posts: 304 Location: Southern California
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Ron really got the point. This new trend of china junk locos from Märklin is also bad brand management. Consumers expect certain quality from different brands, and my expectation from Märklin is the "Mercedes" quality and durability.
The new 36320 costs around $125 in US and 94 EUR in Germany, which is way too much. For the same money people can get a full Bachmann set, which is built the same way. They both last past the Christmas, and that may be enough, but it won't bring any newcomers to the hobby, and build any brand loyalty.
If you don't have a BR81 yet, go to Ebay. It's still full of classic true Märklin 3031 variants.
BR, Juha
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Joined: 06/02/2005(UTC) Posts: 1,383 Location: Darmstadt,
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I think we shouldn't judge on the overall quality of the new BR 81 model from a simple view on the motor. The motor (probably a Mabuchi or so) is one aspect of the model, there are a few others which I consider even more important, such as the casing and the blackened wheels. See it from the enginering point of view: get a cheaper solution for the propoulsion system (low priced standard motor + load regulated but inexpensive decoder) with some new features (e.g. digital) and replace the old and more expensive SFCM/DCM technology. Maybe the new motor is even cheaper than a set of new brushes for the old one  . This is good business practice. Most of us here (me included) live from this philosophy. Otherwise we wouldn't chat here on the internet using our Pentium and Atlon computers with 1 GByte of RAM, 80 GB hard disk, TFT monitor etc. but would rather attend, say, a Benny Goodman or Cole Porter concert on our valve radios [:o)]. These times are gone, allthough I like some of those things that have been left over. Hans Martin
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Joined: 10/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 2,162 Location: Portugal
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Quote:[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by hmsfix <br /> .......but would rather attend, say, a Benny Goodman or Cole Porter concert on our valve radios [:o)]. These times are gone, allthough I like some of those things that have been left over.
Namely some high quality Benny Goodman and Cole Porter vinyl pressings....  Luis
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Joined: 12/01/2002(UTC) Posts: 2,578 Location: Sweden
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Quote:[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by rschaffr <br />The problem is that we have become accustomed to expecting anything with the Marklin name on it to be Marklin quality. It is not a matter of not buying something you don't like, since we don't know it is inferior until after we have already paid. This type of product will undermine the brand loyalty we have had for Marklin in the past.
If it is a fact that now "Hobby" means "inferior" at least we have a benchmark then to make a rational decision. I don't beleive that either the Harry Potter or the Thaomas set were so marked.
I think you are right that a lot of people buy Märklin because they expect Märklin quality. Märklin quality means (or used to mean ?) not just a certain level of quality, but also a certain kind of quality. Märklin quality does not necessarily mean that the products have the best performance or the best modelling accuracy, not even does it mean that the things don't break. All this may vary from model to model. But what you always can expect (or at least could) is that the Märklin items do not break beyond repair and that they do not have so bad performance that they are totally useless. Märklin have made cheap junk before but that cheap junk still runs after 40 years with just a minimum of service. The "it-will-work-next-time-too" quality of Märklin has been an almost unique feature among toy manufacturers. Probably this is more important to keep the "toy consumers" attracted in the long run than to keep the serious model railroaders. The "serious model railroader" may very well accept that the model is crap, as long as it is accurately modelled. He (very seldom a "she", unfortunately) will also keep himself informed, and make the decision to buy or not based on the characteristics of the specific model rather than the general perception of the brand. The "toy consumer" or not so serious model railroader however will loose the interest if the things stop working all the time. And he/she will buy what he/she sees in the shop, if he/she trusts the brand. These people are many more than the "serious" ones so even if they do not buy that much each they sum up to a big market. Quote:[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by Hemmerich <br />However, who cares? Märklin ?
I think Märklin should care, if they are interested in keeping the "toy" train market. Bad running characteristics is OK in that segment. Inaccurate or even clumsy modelling too. But not irreparable break down. I can't tell whether the motor in the discussed model will break or not, but at least I get the feeling that Märklin haven't made the analysis, and that is bad enough.
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Joined: 12/01/2005(UTC) Posts: 703 Location: ,
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You should all ask Kato to make more H0 models ;)
I got a new N-scale Kato set today, an 8-part Japanese container express train. The detailing on the thing is incredible. The couplers are a Scharfenberg type, and there's brakehoses as well, which from a distance (the distance you'll usually see them running at) look like they connect from 1 car to the next. The printed details are excellent as well, each car has it's own number, and each container has it's own number as well. It uses LED's for front and rear lights, forwards it's 5 white lights, backwards 2 red ones. Running characteristics are also excellent (it can pull a full 16-car train (if you get the add-on as well) up a 4% slope). Quite frankly, it's hands down the best N-scale trainset I've seen, and close to the best overal set in any scale. The whole set comes in a high quality case, and it cost around 160-170 euro.
If Kato were to make all their N-scale US loco's in an H0 version, they'd make a fortune ;) |
- Martijn (early planning : H0-scale Era I K.Bay.sts.b) (active planning : N-scale mixed late Era Japanese) (possibly something Z-scale as well ;)) |
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Joined: 22/04/2004(UTC) Posts: 12,139 Location: New York, NY
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Hans Martin and Per: Thanks for your most interesting statements, they bear lots of logic. That single model isn't important at all - but it could be the writing on the wall ...
I confess I was shocked deeply when seeing this thing called "motor" the very first time in a Marklin [:0] And it's still hard to believe this shall be a genuine Marklin loco. Since components like Mabucchi motors and worm drives are known all to well here in 2-rail land - they are loud and rough runners, and notorious for breakdowns.
John
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I hope no one visits a poor Southener's layout in Brooklyn. Intruders beware of Gators. AT&SF, D&RGW, T&P, SP, WP, UP, BN, NYC, ARR, epI-III - analog & digital Marklin Classics only. CU#6021 FX-MOTOROLA DIGITAL SYSTEM. Fast as lightning and no trouble. What else ... Outlaw Member of BIG JUHAN's OUTSIDER CLUB. With the most members, worldwide
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Joined: 10/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 2,162 Location: Portugal
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Quote:[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote: Originally posted by hmsfix<br /> Maybe the new motor is even cheaper than a set of new brushes for the old one  . The motor for the BR81 is not yet listed but, for the 36871 (106144), which is similar, list price is 37.89€, exactly the same for the decoder of that lok, ref. 102097. List price for a pair of the standard DCM brushes is 2.25€. I would suspect that these motors will last quite a bit more than a pair of DCM brushes. I don't think Märklin would accept less than that. Luis
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Joined: 07/11/2001(UTC) Posts: 256 Location: ,
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Kato does make HO versions of their US locomotives, and they do quite well here in the USA. It is widely known here that Kato N scale locomotives (without decoders) are the smoothest running locomotives available. Trememdous slow speed running and great quality.
Kato does not for the most-part make a lot of HO compared to N scale, but their HO products are simply amazing too.
Is newer Marklin version definately Made in China -- and is it 3 or 5 pole? I see it appears to have a fly wheel, which is a start --
But there's something about the Marklin I know -- the German made Marklin product, noisy and rough, that has a certain appeal I feel will be gone in the future.
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Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC) Posts: 15,871 Location: Gibraltar, Europe
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This thread reminds me of a bumper sticker I once saw: "Nostalgia isn't what it used to be"  Ray |
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
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Joined: 15/12/2005(UTC) Posts: 3,602 Location: Spain
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I wonder if I can install a NINCO EXTREME-3 motor in that chassis? ;-) -I'm already preparing to wire my controllers for electro-dynamic braking! ;-) Now I REALLY need banking on the curves! ;-)
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Joined: 15/03/2003(UTC) Posts: 9,614 Location: Australia
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Quote:[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote: Originally posted by RayPayas<br />"Nostalgia isn't what it used to be"  Now that's really profound... [:0] |
Adrian Australia flag by abFlags.com |
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Joined: 06/03/2005(UTC) Posts: 1,159 Location: The Netherlands
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Quote:[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote: Originally posted by RayPayas<br />This thread reminds me of a bumper sticker I once saw: "Nostalgia isn't what it used to be"  Ray Simone Signoret once said that. |
Absolutly AFB-NOHAB fan ;-) |
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Joined: 07/11/2001(UTC) Posts: 256 Location: ,
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Seems we are all dealing with the emotional attachment to what we perceive as what Marklin is and is becoming.
I remember when Coca Cola changed it's formula, coming out with Coke II (new Coke) and it was not long before they dropped that idea.
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Joined: 03/01/2003(UTC) Posts: 5,193 Location: Southern New Jersey, USA
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I don't have a problem with Marklin bringing out a toy line to attract kids and generate cash, but it should be clearly marked as such. They should also be careful, even here, to create a line that will entice the new owner to look for a better quality product once they have used it, not just dismiss it as "another toy".
I guess when I bought the Thomas set, I should have expected this, but I was so used to the Marklin name meaning a certain level of quality, I was taken in. |
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Joined: 22/04/2004(UTC) Posts: 12,139 Location: New York, NY
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How about the Thomas Steamer's level of quality, Ron ? |
I hope no one visits a poor Southener's layout in Brooklyn. Intruders beware of Gators. AT&SF, D&RGW, T&P, SP, WP, UP, BN, NYC, ARR, epI-III - analog & digital Marklin Classics only. CU#6021 FX-MOTOROLA DIGITAL SYSTEM. Fast as lightning and no trouble. What else ... Outlaw Member of BIG JUHAN's OUTSIDER CLUB. With the most members, worldwide
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Joined: 12/01/2002(UTC) Posts: 2,578 Location: Sweden
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To illustrate what I said in my previous post, I could take myself and my own family as an example. When I was a boy, we had a Märklin model railroad, a Faller slot car system, a Meccano building kit, and LEGO.
All four were good toys to play with, but rather quickly I gave up Meccano because it did not work in practice. The quality/precision of it was not good enough to realise my ideas. LEGO, although much more childish and limited in principle (at that time at least), kept me and my brothers interested throughout the childhood, because it worked the way it was intended to.
We ran the Märklin railroad and the Faller slot cars both separately and together on a layout. We had a lot of fun with both, but keeping the Faller cars running was always a lot of work (and cost for spare parts). The Märklin train always worked, so finally the Faller cars were put away and only the Märklin trains were used.
So, when I got my own children, what did I buy to them: LEGO instead of Meccano, of course, and I bought new items to the Märklin railroad. One of my brothers tried to revive the Faller cars for his children, but he failed and then went for Märklin model railroads instead. My children got a slot car system too, as a christmas present from some relatives. They also got a "LEGO robotics" system.
But the Märklin railroad "won". Why? Partly because I am a model railroad fan of course, but mainly because it is always possible to make it run without a lot of hazzle. Not even the LEGO robotics system lived up to that even though LEGO probably is the first company you think of if you say "quality toys". (Standard LEGO is still unbeatable though).
If Märklin give up the "it-will-work-next-time-too" quality they will be just another toy manufacturer, and that will erode their customer base and destroy the brand name in the long run. So they definitely should care. Even more with the "Hobby" products than with anything else.
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Joined: 03/01/2003(UTC) Posts: 5,193 Location: Southern New Jersey, USA
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Very poor. it is an open frame motor that is noisy and jerky. The couplers of the cars break off with just a little pressure and Marklin can't or won't tell me what the replacement parts are. |
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Joined: 22/04/2004(UTC) Posts: 12,139 Location: New York, NY
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So it is the very same junk as my Harry Potter Steamer. But your damage in $$$ is way less ... Whatever, send it back to Gomez. Together with some old fish [}:)] |
I hope no one visits a poor Southener's layout in Brooklyn. Intruders beware of Gators. AT&SF, D&RGW, T&P, SP, WP, UP, BN, NYC, ARR, epI-III - analog & digital Marklin Classics only. CU#6021 FX-MOTOROLA DIGITAL SYSTEM. Fast as lightning and no trouble. What else ... Outlaw Member of BIG JUHAN's OUTSIDER CLUB. With the most members, worldwide
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Joined: 03/01/2003(UTC) Posts: 5,193 Location: Southern New Jersey, USA
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True, and I learned a lesson. Knowing what I know now, I probably would still buy it for Nicholas, but I would know what I am getting beforehand and not be dissapointed. |
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