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steventrain		#1 Posted : 07 February 2006 12:37:26(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC) Posts: 31,722 Location: United Kingdom		Hi all, I have end three years member of marklin club because $85 is a lot of money,Dont have 46022.Worst service[xx(]. I am pleased to join Outsider member club[^]. Anyone joining Outsider member club?
		Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy.
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Frostie		#2 Posted : 07 February 2006 12:54:42(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 08/08/2003(UTC) Posts: 1,614 Location: Birmingham,Alabama		Not Me. If you want to play, you need to play. For my point of view the "Looney Tunes" set is worth my membership fees for several years. I really enjoy the magazines and the information.
		Train Collection Insured by "Croc's" with "Big Boys" as Backup" CS/MS Digital Era 1/2 Apple Man iPhone / Macbook Pro / iPad - the end of the windows PC occurred on April 4, 2010. Love those Era 1 Tank Locomotives - the more the merrier.
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RayF		#3 Posted : 07 February 2006 14:43:41(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC) Posts: 15,873 Location: Gibraltar, Europe		Hi Steven, Good Idea, I'll join the Outsider Club! I don't see why I need to spend that much money when you can get the "Insider Models" from ebay. As to the magazines, well they are a good read sometimes, but not that good!
		Ray Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
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mrmarklin		#4 Posted : 07 February 2006 20:36:58(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 27/10/2004(UTC) Posts: 948 Location: Burney, CA		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by steventrain <br />Hi all, I have end three years member of marklin club because $85 is a lot of money, If $85 is a lot of money to you, you are in the wrong hobby. Even a fairly decent freight car goes for upwards of $40 these days, and top of the line loks well over $300. Even a piece of C Track is well over $2. Over the years the Club has offered me a lot, be it in the USA original Club mode or the mode we have now. Information, special cars, loks and even the tschotskys that I get at the Treff and other venues from time to time. Now that Marklin Magazine is in English, it's even better. That's something we never had before, a real value added. And frankly I'm getting very tired of the Club bashing that obtains on this and other fora. If you people don't want to join, don't join. But I'm getting a little tired of your reverse snobbery.
		From the People's Republik of Kalifornia
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alonso231gery		#5 Posted : 07 February 2006 20:51:40(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 24/08/2002(UTC) Posts: 3,959 Location: Hellas (Athens)		I believe both clubs are very worthy I am not an insider member but i would like to be one day for many reasons mrmarklin(forvive me i do not know ur name) has a point most of us spend thousands of euros on trains so 65-75 euros per year is not that much. One positive thing about the magazine is that it is illustrated and accurate, on the other hand here we can have an immediate response on our MRR problem, so these clubs r not rivals,they work together for us.
		An outsider. I'm looking for the owner of that horse. He's tall, blonde, he smokes a cigar, and he's a pig!
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laalves		#6 Posted : 07 February 2006 21:32:07(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 2,162 Location: Portugal		Count me out, I'm in already! [}:)] Luis
		WWW
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David Dewar		#7 Posted : 07 February 2006 21:53:03(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 01/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 7,489 Location: Scotland		Dave. I for one rarely have a go at Marklin but I believe that in the case of the Insider Club the service really is very poor and for that reason I will not be joining. If in the future the Club improves then I will be happy to return and again pay my Subscription. David
		Take care I like Marklin and will defend the worlds greatest model rail manufacturer.
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alonso231gery		#8 Posted : 07 February 2006 21:53:58(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 24/08/2002(UTC) Posts: 3,959 Location: Hellas (Athens)		I remember he was the author of 37990 review. I am a little tired these days. [|)][|)][|)]
		An outsider. I'm looking for the owner of that horse. He's tall, blonde, he smokes a cigar, and he's a pig!
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john black		#9 Posted : 07 February 2006 21:58:37(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 22/04/2004(UTC) Posts: 12,139 Location: New York, NY		You need a new girlfriend - making you fully awake
		I hope no one visits a poor Southener's layout in Brooklyn. Intruders beware of Gators. AT&SF, D&RGW, T&P, SP, WP, UP, BN, NYC, ARR, epI-III - analog & digital Marklin Classics only. CU#6021 FX-MOTOROLA DIGITAL SYSTEM. Fast as lightning and no trouble. What else ... Outlaw Member of BIG JUHAN's OUTSIDER CLUB. With the most members, worldwide
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alonso231gery		#10 Posted : 07 February 2006 22:12:27(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 24/08/2002(UTC) Posts: 3,959 Location: Hellas (Athens)		I prefer less work and more time to sleep.
		An outsider. I'm looking for the owner of that horse. He's tall, blonde, he smokes a cigar, and he's a pig!
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Sam		#11 Posted : 07 February 2006 22:22:49(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/02/2002(UTC) Posts: 799 Location: Phoenix, AZ		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by mrmarklin <br /> Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by steventrain <br />Hi all, I have end three years member of marklin club because $85 is a lot of money, If $85 is a lot of money to you, you are in the wrong hobby.
		Era I-V / HO & 1 Gauge / C-Track & Mobil Station, with Central Station.
		WWW
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Sam		#12 Posted : 07 February 2006 22:24:09(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/02/2002(UTC) Posts: 799 Location: Phoenix, AZ		BTW... since I know you can be a bit sensitive steve.. that's not meant as a laugh at you.. but rather to the witty reply from Mr. Marklin! Cool?
		Era I-V / HO & 1 Gauge / C-Track & Mobil Station, with Central Station.
		WWW
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rschaffr		#13 Posted : 07 February 2006 22:27:48(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 03/01/2003(UTC) Posts: 5,193 Location: Southern New Jersey, USA		Dave: let me chime in here. I have been and still am a member of the insider club, but am re-evaluating my continued membership. True, in the grand scheme of things with what I invest in the hobby, the cost is not very much, BUT I expect for that cost an equivalent value. Three months to get a small package through the mail is unacceptable. Maybe one time when they were getting reorganized, but this is a recurring theme. Also, the content of the magazine could be improved, but to me that is not a fatal flaw. The principal reason for my disenchantment is the poor service. Added: As an addional thought, I would like to see Marklin take some control over the insider special editions. They are too prevalent on eBay, even before we see them ourselves. If I am an insider and decide I don't want it, that is one thing, but the stores that are "shopping" the forms from insiders who don't want it should be penalized somehow. These should be exclusive items that are unavailable to the general public.
		-Ron Digital, Epoch IV-V(K-track/CS3/6021Connect/60216051), Epoch III(C-track/6021/6036/6051) http://www.sem-co.com/~rschaffr/trains/trains.html
		WWW
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john black		#14 Posted : 07 February 2006 23:04:40(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 22/04/2004(UTC) Posts: 12,139 Location: New York, NY		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by mrmarklin <br /> Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by steventrain <br />Hi all, I have end three years member of marklin club because $85 is a lot of money, If $85 is a lot of money to you, you are in the wrong hobby Steven is right. And if you quote him - quote him correctly! Steven really said: "$85 is a lot of money, worst service [xx(]" - and that's what's Steven's point: "WORST SERVICE" Steven is not satisfied with M's service. So what ??? Should he invest another 85 bucks ??? for something he's not happy with ... (I, too, wouldn't give a dime for a thing I don't want) Steven - Welcome to The Outsider Club John
		I hope no one visits a poor Southener's layout in Brooklyn. Intruders beware of Gators. AT&SF, D&RGW, T&P, SP, WP, UP, BN, NYC, ARR, epI-III - analog & digital Marklin Classics only. CU#6021 FX-MOTOROLA DIGITAL SYSTEM. Fast as lightning and no trouble. What else ... Outlaw Member of BIG JUHAN's OUTSIDER CLUB. With the most members, worldwide
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hmsfix		#15 Posted : 07 February 2006 23:12:21(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 06/02/2005(UTC) Posts: 1,383 Location: Darmstadt,		Hi Ron, I completely agree with what you say. I have decided few years ago not to become insider for just that reason: recent insider models have been extremely nice, but as they are available on ebay (for even less money) they are not exclusive as is claimed. Problem is not that a few insider resell their items, but this seems to be a big style trade. Other point is that many insider models appear (in slightly modified livery, as e.g. the BB) as regular items. So what. Hans Martin
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Bill Marklin		#16 Posted : 07 February 2006 23:19:08(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 12/05/2005(UTC) Posts: 46 Location: ,		Hi to you All! I agree! I can buy for the same amount a lok on e-bay or marktplaats.nl. The real die-hards get their info anyway! greetings from Bill who wants to know what kind of propulsion Marklin comes up with now??
		K-Rail layout wth DC, Delta Control and C-rail layout with Mobile Station
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Diggum		#17 Posted : 07 February 2006 23:28:05(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/02/2006(UTC) Posts: 89 Location: Tulia, TX		I decided to pay up and join the club, but it's been 5 weeks and still no charge to my Visa. I'm beginning to think I made a mistake in applying! The general gripe I read is that service is so extraordinarily poor as to just be a hassle, I'm wondering if the benefit I thought I'd get in the form of support or articles on what's "new" is worth it. So, I do believe if my card is ever charged, I will file a decline and let Marklin know they dropped the ball. As for "shopping" stores: I don't blame them one bit.... That's how I got my Insider from last year. I regret it - $700 is a lot to pay for a metal engine with plastic cars that derail as much as they do - but that's a different story. I would think that in this day and age, when Marklin is dabbling in embedded Linux (CS), they'd have the in-house expertise to set up a member database and handle orders, or refunds, or *something* centrally so that loyal Insiders actually get a return on their memberships. On the whole, it seems Marklin has changed from good price/high value to high price/low value.... a very sad thing, indeed. (My Proto 2000, converted by Martin, runs better than any recent Marklin acquisition, sadly.) I'm not trying to post flame bait, just feeling a little disillusioned with the way things are being run by my favourite 3-rail co.
		Old Marklin: tough enough to take 3 generations of enthusiastic play.
		WWW
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steventrain		#18 Posted : 08 February 2006 00:12:17(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC) Posts: 31,722 Location: United Kingdom		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by john black <br /> Steven - Welcome to The Outsider Club John Thanks John.
		Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy.
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steventrain		#19 Posted : 08 February 2006 00:14:12(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC) Posts: 31,722 Location: United Kingdom		Welcome to the forum Diggum.
		Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy.
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Purellum		#20 Posted : 08 February 2006 00:19:12(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 08/11/2005(UTC) Posts: 3,530 Location: Mullerup, 4200 Slagelse		Hello friends. Are there 2 different Outsider clubs now? I thought that this is the Outsider club, but if there is a Outsider members club, count me in there as well! Per.
		If you can dream it, you can do it! I, the copyright holder of this work, hereby release it into the public domain. This applies worldwide. In case this is not legally possible: I grant anyone the right to use this work for any purpose, without any conditions, unless such conditions are required by law.
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john black		#21 Posted : 08 February 2006 00:35:22(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 22/04/2004(UTC) Posts: 12,139 Location: New York, NY		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by Diggum <br />seems Marklin has changed from good price/high value to high price/low value Hi John: Not in the whole - but some of M's items surely wouldn't mind trying ... FE, M framed me heavily with that junky Harry Potter plastic set, last year. €300 down the drain ... [xx(] On the other hand, all of my latest digital U.S. models are of excellent quality [:p]: 3 PA-1s, 1 F7, 2 Mikados, 1 BigBoy, 1 GG-1. But you surely have to select & test <u>very</u> carefully, today ... Welcome to The Forum Per: Juhan's is the top of the top - so there's only one John
		I hope no one visits a poor Southener's layout in Brooklyn. Intruders beware of Gators. AT&SF, D&RGW, T&P, SP, WP, UP, BN, NYC, ARR, epI-III - analog & digital Marklin Classics only. CU#6021 FX-MOTOROLA DIGITAL SYSTEM. Fast as lightning and no trouble. What else ... Outlaw Member of BIG JUHAN's OUTSIDER CLUB. With the most members, worldwide
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Sam		#22 Posted : 08 February 2006 02:17:48(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/02/2002(UTC) Posts: 799 Location: Phoenix, AZ		I have to admit Marklin CS sucks... (Customer Service that is..).. But then I've noticed that ALL German firms I've dealt with via email have bad CS... their turn around time for response is unacceptable. I actually sent an email a while back to Marklin about the CS, and so much time went buy between when I sent it and my response from them, that I completely forgot what I asked.. and since their response didn't have my original question, I honestly had no clue. With 12% unemployment over there you would think they could hire a few more bodies to answer questions and emails...
		Era I-V / HO & 1 Gauge / C-Track & Mobil Station, with Central Station.
		WWW
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verheyen		#23 Posted : 08 February 2006 02:31:44(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 25/01/2004(UTC) Posts: 639 Location: ,		I've actually had some REALLY GOOD experiences. Crashed a Sachsenmodelle coach and busted the coupler pocket/mechanism. Sent an email, got a response saying that I should be patient and that they'd get to it when they could... 5 days later two of the parts were in the mail, gratis. Had a wreck with my Gützold Taigatrommel when it collapsed an unsupported bridge and crashed onto the concrete floor. Needed some new buffers and coupler pockets (everything else was a-ok). Emailed, but didn't get a response. Called, told them what I needed, had it in the mail a week later, no charge. Fried a PCB/reverser in my Kato VT18, tried to get the parts via a dealer in the US, no can do... Emailed Noch (the distributor for that model) got a response within hours and the parts in a few short weeks. Had to pay for those but it was all quite reasonable. ... Good experiences can be had. p. Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by Sam <br /> But then I've noticed that ALL German firms I've dealt with via email have bad CS... their turn around time for response is unacceptable. I actually sent an email a while back to Marklin about the CS, and so much time went buy between when I sent it and my response from them, that I completely forgot what I asked.. and since their response didn't have my original question, I honestly had no clue. With 12% unemployment over there you would think they could hire a few more bodies to answer questions and emails...
		Peter D. Verheyen http://www.philobiblon.com/eisenbahn http://papphausen.blogspot.com/ https://www.youtube.com/user/papphausen2
		WWW
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HueyCE		#24 Posted : 08 February 2006 04:13:29(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 12/01/2003(UTC) Posts: 2,528 Location: Groton, Connecticut		Welcome to the forum John(Mes). I think we are all a little disappointed(Insiders and Outsiders alike) in the way Märklin is handling it's Insider Club. There is always hope for improvement, but we shall see. Ira
		Building German Era I-II layout(Mk IIIc).
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grnwtrs		#25 Posted : 08 February 2006 06:23:46(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 18/06/2005(UTC) Posts: 669 Location: El Sobrante, California		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by HueyCE <br />Welcome to the forum John(Mes). I think we are all a little disappointed(Insiders and Outsiders alike) in the way Märklin is handling it's Insider Club. There is always hope for improvement, but we shall see. Ira I will second your comments. All of them!! I still have some hope the Insider Mag will improve, but after about 13 years, I am begining to wonder if my hope is miss-placed. I guess it is still a waiting game. Maybe when MARKLIN finishes its reorganization the magazine will come in on time. This is 2005 after all. I received 5/2005 on the 15th of October 2005, and 6/2005 on January 26th 2006. So much for the vaunted precision. But hope and spring is eternal. Gene
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bmcrae		#26 Posted : 08 February 2006 07:00:15(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 17/12/2004(UTC) Posts: 970 Location: Okanagan Valley, BC		I can see where Dave is coming from. Maybe we have become too quick to jump at/on M for their shortcomings. In my case I try not to bash M on the site so much, but return items that are not to my satisfaction with a letter stating why. My club certificate tells me I joined in 97. I could not have dreamed then of the joy my subscription would bring when my first child was born in Feb of 2000. The fun and good times that my son and I share together today in reading the new books when they arrive at our door are MORE than worth the price. The downside is that M sent me a DVD that I could not play at home, at work, or on any computer that I have access to. I sent it back and told them I would have to reconsider my membership. Since that time I have had a mind to stay on as a member while M works out the kinks and continues to IMPROVE THE QUALITY OF THE MAGAZINE. (Thanks for listening M........ I know you're out there. )
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Troy Yang		#27 Posted : 08 February 2006 07:35:29(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/12/2003(UTC) Posts: 356 Location: San Francisco, California USA		I think $85 is very good value. You get 12 magazines, Insider car, a Marklin year video/CD (play it on your computer - no problem there) and a year book/catalog. Any Marklin passenger car cost around $40 these days. My gripe, as well as yours, is that they arrive in random. Why is it so difficult to ship some bloody magazines in timley manner?
		Marklin HO - all eras and everything.
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foumaro		#28 Posted : 08 February 2006 08:48:46(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 08/12/2004(UTC) Posts: 4,431 Location: Attiki Athens Greece		I think that 72,90 euros for all these is a fair price.But Marklin must send us the magazines and all the rest soon and not with the "TURTLE COURIER".
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Diggum		#29 Posted : 08 February 2006 16:36:25(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 07/02/2006(UTC) Posts: 89 Location: Tulia, TX		Thanks for the greets, Gene, John & Ira! I think bmcrae hit the nail on the head for me - maybe more: getting a Marklin publication (I love their catalogs) is like Christmas all over again. More than any other manufacturer, they make MRR look beautiful and accessible (IMHO). For that reason alone the club is worth it. It was after reading Sean's review/blurb about his 10-yr Insider model that I sprung for one on eBay; I couldn't be happier with it. Obviously the quality is there (like the Insider DigiCroc)- it's just seemingly random which models get the 'extra.' I'd bet licensing fees on the HP set are what killed the quality - got to make a profit somehow... <soapbox> Anyway, back on topic, I hope the Marklin management figures something out soon. Hardly a month goes by there are not two or three estate sales of locs and such listed on eBay, and the cost-conscious here in the states are much more likely to go to 2-rail DC, especially when you consider how REALLY patient you have to be to get anything new! </soapbox> Bottom line, I'm in the "Outsider" club, hoping: - the Insider club gets 21st century efficiencies so I can join - for mid-20th century quality/durability
		Old Marklin: tough enough to take 3 generations of enthusiastic play.
		WWW
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jonquinn		#30 Posted : 08 February 2006 20:18:41(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 15/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 1,591 Location: Pennsylvania		$85 IS a lot of money, especially for a crappy magazine - and if you think what they offer in the international edition is good, then your standards a pretty low. And I find nowhere that you have to pay the $85 to run your model trains or go to a train shop and buy more trains. I find offensive the elitist snobbery of those who see criticism towards the Insider group and Marklin's marketing efforts as some sort of blasphemy, and assuming that just because $85 isn't in your budget for an uniformative and erraticly arriving magazine, that you shouldn't be taking part in this hobby.
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Seetal		#31 Posted : 08 February 2006 23:11:51(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 12/11/2004(UTC) Posts: 548 Location: Maryland, USA		While the benefits of Club membership like many things bring different levels of value to different people, this thread did make one thing clear..... Don't run your trains on Peter's layout [:0)] Quote "Crashed a Sachsenmodelle coach ...", "Had a wreck with my Gützold Taigatrommel..." and the most painful of the bunch "Fried a PCB/reverser in my Kato..." [:I] now that's got to hurt....right in your Kato [:0] sorry Peter, couldn't resist. John (no problems with my Kato yet)
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verheyen		#32 Posted : 09 February 2006 00:36:44(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 25/01/2004(UTC) Posts: 639 Location: ,		Funny [:p], but hey. What these accidents taught me, they should seen as teachable moments, is that other products can be robust too. That and always check everything to make sure it's secured when you're building on the layout. Very easy to miss something, and if you're at the other end... Cheers, p. Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by Seetal <br /> Don't run your trains on Peter's layout [:0)] Quote "Crashed a Sachsenmodelle coach ...", "Had a wreck with my Gützold Taigatrommel..." and the most painful of the bunch "Fried a PCB/reverser in my Kato..." [:I] now that's got to hurt....right in your Kato [:0] sorry Peter, couldn't resist. John (no problems with my Kato yet) [:p]
		Peter D. Verheyen http://www.philobiblon.com/eisenbahn http://papphausen.blogspot.com/ https://www.youtube.com/user/papphausen2
		WWW
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prc		#33 Posted : 09 February 2006 02:39:21(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 05/01/2005(UTC) Posts: 283 Location: Granby, Ct		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote: I find offensive the elitist snobbery of those who see criticism towards the Insider group and Marklin's marketing efforts as some sort of blasphemy, and assuming that just because $85 isn't in your budget for an uniformative and erraticly arriving magazine, that you shouldn't be taking part in this hobby. Wow! I wonder if others are offended and feel that you are portraying elitist snobbery since you are critical towards those that speak up for the Insider group!
		Paul Granby, Ct. USA
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jonquinn		#34 Posted : 09 February 2006 03:33:14(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 15/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 1,591 Location: Pennsylvania		maybe you should go back and read the post by the guy who says if $85 for the insider club is too much to spend, then you ought not to be playing with marklin trains. bunch of lemmings around here
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stephenbb		#35 Posted : 09 February 2006 03:37:40(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 22/11/2004(UTC) Posts: 1,836 Location: Trumbull, CT		In the whole scheme of things 85 is just a drop in the bucket. I'll give it another year. Stephen(USA)
		Stephen(USA) ETE,NMRA,MEA
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HueyCE		#36 Posted : 09 February 2006 03:50:05(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 12/01/2003(UTC) Posts: 2,528 Location: Groton, Connecticut		Gentlemen no need for snobbery, or lemming like behavior. Makes us seem like American Senators or British Members of Parliment and as model railroaders I am sure we rise above such mediocre company. Ira
		Building German Era I-II layout(Mk IIIc).
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mrmarklin		#37 Posted : 09 February 2006 05:05:48(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 27/10/2004(UTC) Posts: 948 Location: Burney, CA		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by rschaffr <br /> Added: As an addional thought, I would like to see Marklin take some control over the insider special editions. They are too prevalent on eBay, even before we see them ourselves. If I am an insider and decide I don't want it, that is one thing, but the stores that are "shopping" the forms from insiders who don't want it should be penalized somehow. These should be exclusive items that are unavailable to the general public. I agree that this is a major marketing flaw in the Insider program. But if there are over 100,000 Insiders, and not all of them want their model, it's hard to see how it can be controlled. If Marklin disciplines its dealers, then it not only pisses the dealers off, but also reduces sales...........and that would be bad. I also noted that Peter's operating crashes and problems seem to be with NON-MARKLIN rolling stock. Is there a problem that could be rectified with the correct equipment whose name starts with M????? I admit I'm hard-core Marklinista. $85 is not much for me, because I'll buy any cars and loks I want regardless of the cost of a Club membership. I'm sorry if I offended anyone's sensibilities. And to show I'm, a good sport, I'll even admit that today, Feb 8 2006 I just now received my 6/2005 Insider package from of all places Sweden! I've had my German Insider 6/2005 package since.......well I've had it for a long time. But I've been a member of the original US Club since its inception, and frankly the delivery has always been erratic. Especially in the early eighties when even issues were skipped and mis numbered Dave Pryor
		From the People's Republik of Kalifornia
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rschaffr		#38 Posted : 09 February 2006 06:00:31(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 03/01/2003(UTC) Posts: 5,193 Location: Southern New Jersey, USA		Dave: From a production point of view, I see your point. If Marklin makes 100,000 units for insider distribution and only 20,000 insiders want it, they would have a major problem if they are somehow restricted to insiders only. I think this would be somewhat self annealing, in that if the item was TRULY exclusive, more insiders would want it, even if it didn't fit their era/operating philosophy/taste. But it would be a risk with the possibility of getting stuck with a lot of product. They do have some control, though. Since the molds are used again for "non exclusive" items basically the saem (different running numbers, different paint, etc) they would have an outlet for the leftover stock. They could also gauge their production by the number of forms returned. Just a few thoughts. It is, however, a sticky problem.
		-Ron Digital, Epoch IV-V(K-track/CS3/6021Connect/60216051), Epoch III(C-track/6021/6036/6051) http://www.sem-co.com/~rschaffr/trains/trains.html
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usbeauty		#39 Posted : 09 February 2006 06:30:18(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 16/02/2003(UTC) Posts: 214 Location: San Francisco Bay area, California		I am also sorry to see them end the 50th Birthday special loks.
		Modeling the Bruxelles - Nord to Knokke - Heist line on my layout, complete with pommes frites stand (frituur). (Epoch IV, digital and analog)
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xxup		#40 Posted : 09 February 2006 11:14:43(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 15/03/2003(UTC) Posts: 9,628 Location: Australia		Oh no... I was hanging out to get one of those... Not happy...
		Adrian Australia flag by abFlags.com
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john black		#41 Posted : 09 February 2006 12:05:57(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 22/04/2004(UTC) Posts: 12,139 Location: New York, NY		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by HueyCE <br />American Senators or British Members of Parliment ... as model railroaders I am sure we rise above such mediocre company Well said, Ira - WE are skies above them Always thought a snob wears Needlestripe and drives Bentley ... [xx(] John
		I hope no one visits a poor Southener's layout in Brooklyn. Intruders beware of Gators. AT&SF, D&RGW, T&P, SP, WP, UP, BN, NYC, ARR, epI-III - analog & digital Marklin Classics only. CU#6021 FX-MOTOROLA DIGITAL SYSTEM. Fast as lightning and no trouble. What else ... Outlaw Member of BIG JUHAN's OUTSIDER CLUB. With the most members, worldwide
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kgsjoqvist		#42 Posted : 09 February 2006 12:15:02(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/06/2002(UTC) Posts: 754 Location: Täby		I have considered leaving Insider Club since I realized the price would increase from about 40€ to over 70€. At least in Sweden we used to pay the lower annual fee but on the other hand did not receive all benefits. This year I have still paid less, but received everything. But lately I have changed my mind and now I am more than willing to pay the full price. It's not cheap, but I think it's worth it: * The Insider Wagon is worth at least 10-15€. * The Märklin Magazin is worth 30€ (I dont't remember the exact price for a subscription) * A DVD with highlights, let's say 20€. * The yearbook is worth 10€. All together I think I get enough value for money. The magazin is improving and it's not "just Märklin". You get hints about products from other manufacturers as well (in areas where Märklin doesn't have anything to offer).
		K-G / H0 and Z model train user
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PeFu		#43 Posted : 09 February 2006 13:33:24(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 30/08/2002(UTC) Posts: 1,294		IMHO, currently it's 85 for receiving more or less marketing material only. I'm impressed that M* has managed to get this status. However, this year I will subscribe to the Swiss Loki.ch magazine instead, so I guess that qualifies me for the outsider club! /Funck
		Andreasburg-Mattiasberg Bahn is inspired by Swiss railways |Forum Thread |Track Plan |Youtube Channel | C and K track | CS2 | TrainController Gold
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verheyen		#44 Posted : 09 February 2006 13:51:27(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 25/01/2004(UTC) Posts: 639 Location: ,		Dave, I can assure you that in both cases it had nothing to do with not being M* products, but rather human (mine) error, and perhaps stupidity if you will. Both were easy to fix, and both are super reliable. This has NOTHING to do with Märklin being superior, or not. When I look at some of the new constructions... I think they're fairly disasterous. Metal isn't everything, nor are over engineered or not ready for prime time and experimental propulsion systems. The point I was trying to make is that not all customer service (cs) is bad, and that there is indeed even excellent cs. p. ps. My Mehano G2000 is first rate. Don't think you meant that M though. Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by mrmarklin <br />I also noted that Peter's operating crashes and problems seem to be with NON-MARKLIN rolling stock. Is there a problem that could be rectified with the correct equipment whose name starts with M????? Dave Pryor
		Peter D. Verheyen http://www.philobiblon.com/eisenbahn http://papphausen.blogspot.com/ https://www.youtube.com/user/papphausen2
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stephenbb		#45 Posted : 09 February 2006 17:41:51(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 22/11/2004(UTC) Posts: 1,836 Location: Trumbull, CT		When your so far in their is no getting out! I have invested in Marklin since the very eary 60's and have some engines and rolling stock that is much older. With this major investment, the only thing that will take me away, is when I don't know what i'm doing or can't play anymore.I certainly hope that its a long way off. Stephen(USA)
		Stephen(USA) ETE,NMRA,MEA
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bmcrae		#46 Posted : 09 February 2006 19:48:50(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 17/12/2004(UTC) Posts: 970 Location: Okanagan Valley, BC		I hate to ask this here because I know I'll find the answer if I take the time to search past topics but since I'm home alone with the kids today I'll save myself the time....... How do you subscribe to the German Edition of the Insider? And for Peter Funck..... is there a link for subscribing to the Swiss Loki.ch magazine? Thanks in advance. Brian
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verheyen		#47 Posted : 09 February 2006 20:06:35(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 25/01/2004(UTC) Posts: 639 Location: ,		If you're looking for the German edition of Märklin Magazin, that's easy. Simply contact Märklin USA. They handle the subscriptions. If you want the German edition of the Newsletter, you can access that easily online, and all members are entitled to access the online site regardless of location. You'll need to contact either Märklin USA or the Club in Germany for access information. The Newsletter issued online in PDF format. No waiting... p. Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by bmcrae <br />I hate to ask this here because I know I'll find the answer if I take the time to search past topics but since I'm home alone with the kids today I'll save myself the time....... How do you subscribe to the German Edition of the Insider? And for Peter Funck..... is there a link for subscribing to the Swiss Loki.ch magazine? Thanks in advance. Brian
		Peter D. Verheyen http://www.philobiblon.com/eisenbahn http://papphausen.blogspot.com/ https://www.youtube.com/user/papphausen2
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PeFu		#48 Posted : 11 February 2006 19:30:26(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 30/08/2002(UTC) Posts: 1,294		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by bmcrae <br />And for Peter Funck..... is there a link for subscribing to the Swiss Loki.ch magazine? Thanks in advance. Brian Here it is: http://www.loki.ch/ Funck
		Andreasburg-Mattiasberg Bahn is inspired by Swiss railways |Forum Thread |Track Plan |Youtube Channel | C and K track | CS2 | TrainController Gold
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DaleSchultz		#49 Posted : 11 February 2006 22:07:52(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/02/2006(UTC) Posts: 4,018		I never fell for it and I doubt I ever will. I see no benefit.
		Dale Intellibox + own software, K-Track My current layout: https://cabin-layout.mixmox.com Arrival and Departure signs: https://remotesign.mixmox.com
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stenscience		#50 Posted : 12 February 2006 02:23:15(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 18/09/2004(UTC) Posts: 789 Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico		I am now an Outsider as well. The increased cost was only part of the decision-2 month delays and poor, untimely, and arrogant responses were the rest. What I never really figured out was why M* used the club to charge HIGHER prices for gear to their members rather than give discounts on locos/cars etc. Whatever-I can buy another loco on Ebay for the price of membership in their crappy club
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