Märklin electronic direction unit

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Märklin electronic direction unit - Frog leap Bocksprung

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Ivan		#1 Posted : 06 March 2023 17:08:24(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 08/08/2018(UTC) Posts: 103 Location: Potsdam		Märklin electronic direction reverse unit Locomotives 33xx series have electronic direction switch, obviously invented, built in and meant to prevent well known ``Bocksprung`` or ``Frog leap`` seen in mechanical direction switches with spring. My question is in regard of a phenomenon I observed with several 33xx electronic switches, which, sometimes, not always, show the same leap as seen in mechanical reverse units. I find this a flaw in electronic components which are composed of: Rectifier to power the circuit Relay and switching transistor Surge Pulse Detector Protection diodes Switching transistors for the locomotive light There are claims that leap malfunction is a warning sign of sooner or later complete electronic failure. The question: Have you observed this phenomenon and what may be the reason for it ? Anyway, it is not supposed to be expected in electronic reverse units; there is no spring to adjust it, designed to be an improvement, and I suppose there must be a flaw somewhere within electronic components. But what and why ? What`s your opinion and experience. Thanks.


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kiwiAlan		#2 Posted : 06 March 2023 18:05:50(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC) Posts: 8,114 Location: ENGLAND, Didcot		Originally Posted by: Ivan Märklin electronic direction reverse unit ... There are claims that leap malfunction is a warning sign of sooner or later complete electronic failure. The question: Have you observed this phenomenon and what may be the reason for it ? Anyway, it is not supposed to be expected in electronic reverse units; there is no spring to adjust it, designed to be an improvement, and I suppose there must be a flaw somewhere within electronic components. But what and why ? What`s your opinion and experience. Thanks. I don't have any of these, as all my stuff is digital. However my diagnosis is dependant on the following observation: - Does the loco reverse when it jumps? If not I would suspect that the circuitry driving the relay is faulty, or the mechanical latch that drives the relay contact one way or the other is sticky and not driving the contacts over. the fix for the second option is to replace the relay, the fix for the first option is more complex and involves having the device in my hands and working through it.


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Ivan		#3 Posted : 06 March 2023 18:33:07(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 08/08/2018(UTC) Posts: 103 Location: Potsdam		Quote: I don't have any of these, as all my stuff is digital. However my diagnosis is dependant on the following observation: - Does the loco reverse when it jumps? If not I would suspect that the circuitry driving the relay is faulty, or the mechanical latch that drives the relay contact one way or the other is sticky and not driving the contacts over. the fix for the second option is to replace the relay, the fix for the first option is more complex and involves having the device in my hands and working through it. 1. The loco always reverses when it jumps. 2. There are no mechanical components whatsoever; only electonic components depicted above. 3. Another phenomenon; it does not reverse with every impulse, sometimes two impulses are needed. On the other hand, it was probably not meant for what I do reversing dozens of times. Regards


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Michael4		#4 Posted : 06 March 2023 23:19:16(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 02/02/2017(UTC) Posts: 643 Location: England, South Coast		My 3352 which has some sort of electronic reversing gizmo also has a mechanical reversing unit, looks like a traditional one with spring etc. It works well. Pictures in this thread. https://www.marklin-user...dile--Digital-Conversion


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cintrans		#5 Posted : 06 March 2023 23:20:20(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 11/07/2018(UTC) Posts: 173 Location: Aruba (general), Oranjestad		Ivan The Siemens box on the left rear corner in your pic is a mechanical relay.... Regards Jean-Pierre


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Ivan		#6 Posted : 06 March 2023 23:36:29(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 08/08/2018(UTC) Posts: 103 Location: Potsdam		Originally Posted by: cintrans Ivan The Siemens box on the left rear corner in your pic is a mechanical relay.... Regards Jean-Pierre Thanks. Did not know what Siemens box was; if that`s mechanical relay, it means it has mechanical moving parts and therefore susceptible to the same actions as pure mechanical reverse unit, i.e. it can fail sometimes to reverse flawlessly. Is that the point of your information ?


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cintrans		#7 Posted : 07 March 2023 02:22:26(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 11/07/2018(UTC) Posts: 173 Location: Aruba (general), Oranjestad		Ivan You stated that sometimes you have to switch more then once to get the lok to reverse, it could be that the contact points in the relay are making a bad connection. This is not uncommon in relays. Yes, the relay is probably the most "unreliable" or prone to wear part off the whole board... similar to the micro switches found in the switch motors..... Regards Jean-Pierre


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