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Offline Rocca  
#1 Posted : 23 January 2024 16:21:44(UTC)
Rocca

Italy   
Joined: 28/01/2004(UTC)
Posts: 617
Dear Märklin friends,
I do need some suggestions for my RSM 800, because, when I do use the overhead, in some parts of the layout the pantographs are lowered too much and the current does not pass and the locomotive stops. The pantographs are perfectly installed and the problem is therefore with the installed power line. I have the 7009 pole system and all the rest of the armament. How can I make the space between the wires and the pantographs a little wider? How have others of you solved this problem?
Best regards
Stefano Rocca
Offline JohnjeanB  
#2 Posted : 23 January 2024 19:43:55(UTC)
JohnjeanB

France   
Joined: 04/02/2011(UTC)
Posts: 3,140
Location: Paris, France
Hi Stefano
Not sure to answer your question.
RSM were fitted with type 5 (larger P with a copper sleeve) or type 6 (smaller all nickeled aspect) which both are very good pantographs.
Normally, with these pantagraph, the pressure increases when the pantograph slide goes down (unless it gets near the locking position)
Note that on both pantograph types, tongues are ensuring that both sides have a similar angle (see the round red circles below)
Sans titre.png

When those tongues are bent, the pantograph does not deploy symetrically nor with ease. It may even remain stuck in the low position. Is it your case?

Notice that the tongue position holding the springs. When bent a little inwards, it reduces the spring force but increases the spring influence on the pantograph when it is almost fully lowered.

Now, which catenary are you using? You don't say.
The "new" catenary of around 1951-1952 (7000 series) or the one before (407M with horizontal arm and a simple steel tape as caténary)?
There is no reason for the Märklin catenary to change in height (against the rail top). Is there something special in your case?
Look at this video about the various types of Märklin catenary from 1938 onwards:


Current pick-up by catenary works better when both pantographs are raised as you know.

Cheers
Jean
Offline Rocca  
#3 Posted : 23 January 2024 23:23:33(UTC)
Rocca

Italy   
Joined: 28/01/2004(UTC)
Posts: 617
dear John, thank you for the quick answer, I've the old overhead version with the 7009 and I can assure you that it works perfectly with my other 800 Serie. Where am i wrong in your opinion, please? Best regards
Prof. Stefano Rocca

quote=JohnjeanB;669321]Hi Stefano
Not sure to answer your question.
RSM were fitted with type 5 (larger P with a copper sleeve) or type 6 (smaller all nickeled aspect) which both are very good pantographs.
Normally, with these pantagraph, the pressure increases when the pantograph slide goes down (unless it gets near the locking position)
Note that on both pantograph types, tongues are ensuring that both sides have a similar angle (see the round red circles below)
Sans titre.png

When those tongues are bent, the pantograph does not deploy symetrically nor with ease. It may even remain stuck in the low position. Is it your case?

Notice that the tongue position holding the springs. When bent a little inwards, it reduces the spring force but increases the spring influence on the pantograph when it is almost fully lowered.

Now, which catenary are you using? You don't say.
The "new" catenary of around 1951-1952 (7000 series) or the one before (407M with horizontal arm and a simple steel tape as caténary)?
There is no reason for the Märklin catenary to change in height (against the rail top). Is there something special in your case?
Look at this video about the various types of Märklin catenary from 1938 onwards:


Current pick-up by catenary works better when both pantographs are raised as you know.

Cheers
Jean
Offline JohnjeanB  
#4 Posted : 24 January 2024 10:16:10(UTC)
JohnjeanB

France   
Joined: 04/02/2011(UTC)
Posts: 3,140
Location: Paris, France
Hi Stefano
If you have other 800 electrics, then the top of the roof is at the same height as the RSM and probably with the type 5 pantographs (like my picture above).

So it means the RSM pantographs are defective / bents / with bad springs.
Just my opinion.
Cheers
Jean
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by JohnjeanB
Offline Rocca  
#5 Posted : 24 January 2024 18:47:16(UTC)
Rocca

Italy   
Joined: 28/01/2004(UTC)
Posts: 617
Hello dear Jean,


yesss, I've other 800 electric Locos and they work great, but in the RSM800 I've repalced with new ones the pantographs, purchased from Ritter and put on correctly. I've most of 7009 and part with the old 407M for the overhead in the entire layout with 3600 series 3 rails.
1
Best regards
Stefano Rocca

Originally Posted by: JohnjeanB Go to Quoted Post
Hi Stefano
If you have other 800 electrics, then the top of the roof is at the same height as the RSM and probably with the type 5 pantographs (like my picture above).

So it means the RSM pantographs are defective / bents / with bad springs.
Just my opinion.
Cheers
Jean


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