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Offline trainbuff  
#1 Posted : 13 May 2009 07:36:16(UTC)
trainbuff


Joined: 26/11/2006(UTC)
Posts: 502
Location: Atlanta, Georgia
Hi,

(edit: June 20 - added final pictures and link to video)

(edit: June 13 - pictures of decoder install added to end of this post)

(edit: June 11 - pictures of adding slider and decoder mount added to end of this post)

(edit: combined posts on this conversion to one post and added more pictures.)

I want to convert my 30+ year old Fleischmann E44 to Marklin 3-rail and generally fix this lok up. I think it is a 4330 based on the decade (earlier 70s) I bought it. It has not been used in over 30 years. So I started this thread to document the process, ask for help, get suggestions, and because this earlier thread, https://www.marklin-user...ult.aspx?g=posts&t=12943 on converting couplers was going off topic.

UserPostedImage

Here is the motor with the cover that needs to be replaced. Thanks to Lutz for this link http://www.modellbahn-on...?rubrik=digitalsteuerung where I determined I need the 504750 motor cover.
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The plan is to put an eight pin plug in the body so I can switch out decoders when I get a loksound (right now I'm using a left over soundless decoder from 29533). The four pin plug will allow removing the wheels and motor from the body. Two wires go to motor, and other two go to rails and slider. I put the speaker in there to show how much room there is.
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Here are the wheels under the motor where the slider should probably go. I think a little bit longer slider would allow the end piece to miss the axles and go up where the red arrow is. This slider is left over from a Marklin BR86.
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I will post more pictures and details later, such as putting in Marklin couplers, etc. I appreciate any suggestions or pointers, as I'm kinda new to this.

I've taken it all apart. There really isn't much to this lok, in terms of number of parts.

Here is the motor. Notice the 3 pole anchor. I have already ordered a new motor cover (top left in picture), but will look at the re-motor kit with 5-pole (thanks Brakepad).
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And just to give you an idea of how few parts there are, here is the rest of it. Sorry for fuzzy picture. The electrical parts on the left is the manual switch to run off catenary or rail (I'm tossing that). The big chunk top left is a lead weight screwed to motor. And on top of photo is the new Marklin slider. The only parts not shown are the couplers, buffers, light fixtures and screws to mount bogies to body.
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Slight change in plan, I will have to mount the slider on the un-motoriezed bogie, and the bogie is hollow, so I can fill it with weight to improve electrical contact if needed.

I'm crusing the internet looking at prototypes to get ideas for painting. It would be nice to add a touch of red around the bogies.

I would like to add a cabin light in each end, but it may be too much work blocking the light from comming out of the frameless bottom and various holes in the bodywork. The three yellow arrows show holes in body. Top hole can't be seen in this photo, but is a rather largish square on both ends I've never noticed before. Also one cabin may be fully blocked by motor.
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If someone can point me to what type of marker lights this lok had, that may be something else to try to add.

While I'm waiting for parts to arrive I am building light boxes to fit behind the cabin windows. The box keeps the light from shining out of the frame except at the windows. An LED is mounted under the front hood and shines into the box, so all the light is indirect. I'm happy how this turned out. The cabin light looks much better than it does in the picture (I covered the flash on the camera with my finger to get this picture!). I know the window is out of position, everything is temporary until I finish the running all the lights. I'm also going to sand the LED with coarse sandpaper to diffuse the light.
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Here is the light box made of white plastic. The pcb holds the LED. All the wires poking into the body from hand rails, pantographs and other details makes the box a difficult fit. The red wires are yet to be removed, they brought power down from pantograph and are not used anymore. The light box for the other end of the lok will have to be shaped differently to allow room for the motor.
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Here I modified the front bogie to clear the ends of the Marklin long slider.
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Here I started soldering a 652 plug to a decoder out of a BR86. I cut the plug off the loksound I put in the BR86.
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<s>Still waiting on parts to finish....</s>

Yeah, the parts came in..., installed the new motor cover, the old one is to the right. I removed one of the gears and hooked the motor to a the decoder which is plugged into a breadboard. The motor spun nicely after a 30+ year rest.
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June 11 2009 - New stuff: Used epoxy to add screws to make a decoder mount.

Filled the hollow bogie with epoxy and held screws there till epoxy hardened. I also put epoxy around the screws before putting them in place.
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Filed the epoxy flat. I kept the epoxy away from the axles using plastic.
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Here is the yet to be wired nem plug. There is a spacer under the pcb to hold it above the wheels.
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I added a slider by first drilling an oversized hole and then forming threads in epoxy. I filed the bottom of the bogie for added slider clearance, but I don't think I really needed to. The ends of the bogie did need filing and you can see some plastic that kept the epoxy from running out. The red wire is soldered to the slider and goes through the bogie.
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Now I'm going to wire the two bogies to the nem plug. There will be a another plug between the nem plug and the body for the lights. That way I can remove the body completely from the bogies. The blue wire on the left is current pickup from the wheels and is grounded to the body on top of the motor housing.
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There is no way I could have done this without all the reading I've done on this group. Thanks!

Edit - June 13 2009, added following pictures on installing the decoder.

Packed all the wiring under the pcb with resistors for the led lighting. Wires on left go to motor and to lights.
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Plugged in the decoder and tested motor directly. Motor ran a little choppy at low speeds, may be combination of 3 pole motor and a decoder designed for 5 pole motor?
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Installed the decoder. Too many long fat wires and too much work to resolder things to be neater. Besides one day there will be and ESU sound decoder plugged in here.
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Next is cleaning the body and starting on the lights. I want to make the lights switch from white to red based on direction by pointing two leds (red & white) into one light collector. Also will add cabin lights.

There is lots of room in this lok, so I put in red and while LEDs side by side.
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Here is final product. Going forward:
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Cabin lights on:
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Change direction and lights turn red:
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Link to video of E44 at full speed, runs good and lights are steady:


Link to video of E44 at slow speed, notice the couplers bouncing as the lok runs poorly at low speed and lights are flickering:



Are we allowed to plug dealers? I got the Fleischmann parts from Reynaulds.com and Marklin parts and nem plug from helmutshobbies.com. Parts needed where: couplers, coupler springs, motor cover, carbon brushes, nem plug, and slider. The rest of the parts I had on hand.

Thanks for looking!

Edited by moderator 11 January 2011 22:13:29(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Offline Brakepad  
#2 Posted : 13 May 2009 09:41:06(UTC)
Brakepad

France, Metropolitan   
Joined: 25/08/2008(UTC)
Posts: 633
Location: Montlouis sur Loire, France
Maybe our "conversion" topic was going slightly offtopic when writing in a Fleischmann couplers thread.

In any case, here you can find how to manufacture a motor cover yourself:

http://www.iguadix.es/ar...5%20de%20Fleischmann.pdf

Regarding model, if you purchased it in the seventies it should not be a 4330 as this one was launched in 1992. But the issue with the motor cover remains the same.

Very nice pictures, keep us informed.
check out http://maerklin-back-on-track.blogspot.com if you like to see how old Märklin locos are brought back into life! (in spanish by the moment)
Offline trainbuff  
#3 Posted : 13 May 2009 16:46:06(UTC)
trainbuff


Joined: 26/11/2006(UTC)
Posts: 502
Location: Atlanta, Georgia
Thanks for model number correction, I was basing model number on Kern's web page: http://hfkern.hf.funpic....Fleischmann/Dt_E144.html

I hope the part numbers between 1336 and 4330 are the same, because Fleischmann's web page has parts for 4330, not 1336. I will need some minor parts, like tracktion tires, coupler springs, etc.

Offline Brakepad  
#4 Posted : 17 May 2009 11:58:58(UTC)
Brakepad

France, Metropolitan   
Joined: 25/08/2008(UTC)
Posts: 633
Location: Montlouis sur Loire, France
While searching for the proper motor cover for my 4280 loco, I came across this:

http://www.adeboer.de/lang1/for_fleischmann.html

It seems that ModelTorque manufactures a complete re-motor kit for these Fleischmann locomotives. I think that Fleischmann motor covers are about 12/14€ each. According to the manufacturers's website, price for these complete kits are 24,1€, with 5-pole anchor & 12-year warranty. I'm thinking about purchasing some of these, but would like to get some opinions from people who has used them.

I think that if feedback is good, I'll take the easy way. Maybe these kits are suitable for your E44 as well.

Best regards.


check out http://maerklin-back-on-track.blogspot.com if you like to see how old Märklin locos are brought back into life! (in spanish by the moment)
Offline trainbuff  
#5 Posted : 23 May 2009 10:43:08(UTC)
trainbuff


Joined: 26/11/2006(UTC)
Posts: 502
Location: Atlanta, Georgia
Brakepad, it looks like the replacement motors are 3-pole anchors. I wonder if its a brushless motor. That would be an advantage.

My lok is pretty old, but I think it was in good shape when I parked it years ago. I'm going to stick with the motor its got for now.

Thanks for the interesting site.
Offline steventrain  
#6 Posted : 21 June 2009 13:02:22(UTC)
steventrain

United Kingdom   
Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC)
Posts: 32,846
Great work, I am impressive.
Thnaks for sharing the video, trainbuff.
Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy.
Offline kimballthurlow  
#7 Posted : 21 June 2009 13:15:31(UTC)
kimballthurlow

Australia   
Joined: 18/03/2007(UTC)
Posts: 5,835
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Thanks Chris for the interesting progressive work on the old Fleischmann. And the videos.
regards
Kimball
HO Scale - Märklin (ep III and VI, C Track, digital) - 2 rail (USA and Australia) - 3 rail (English Hornby Dublo) - a few old O gauge.
Offline Caplin  
#8 Posted : 21 June 2009 13:57:02(UTC)
Caplin


Joined: 23/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 2,497
Location: Denmark
Hi trainbuff,

Thank for the updates, very well done. Very interesting to follow it along and very good pictures. I'll keep this topic as ref. for any future Fleischmann conversions.

One thing, how do you remove the wheels from their axles and how do you make them stick in position once they are inserted again?
Regards,
Benny - Outsider and MFDWPL

UserPostedImage
Offline trainbuff  
#9 Posted : 21 June 2009 16:42:21(UTC)
trainbuff


Joined: 26/11/2006(UTC)
Posts: 502
Location: Atlanta, Georgia
Hi Caplin,

To remove the wheels I gently pryed between the wheel and the boogie. I put a small screwdriver as close to the axle and I turned the wheel after each tiny pry. I pryed by twisting rather than lifting the screwdriver so as not to put and bending force on the axle. I asked the same question here a long time ago and someone mentioned that there are wheel pullers, like this one: https://www.micromark.co...archPhrase=wheel+puller. I would have used something like that had the wheels not come off easily enough. One wheel on each axle was on a plastic insulating bushing, which is where it came apart.

When I put the wheels back on they luckily fit very tight. I was prepared to use locktite or glue if they didn't. I used a caliper to measure the gauge before removing and I just gently pushed the wheel on until the gauge was meet.

To everyone else: thanks for the positive comments. I would not have known how to do any of this had I not been asking questions here for years.

Quote:
[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by Caplin
<br />Hi trainbuff,

Thank for the updates, very well done. Very interesting to follow it along and very good pictures. I'll keep this topic as ref. for any future Fleischmann conversions.

One thing, how do you remove the wheels from their axles and how do you make them stick in position once they are inserted again?
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