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Offline Hendro  
#1 Posted : 29 December 2007 09:56:03(UTC)
Hendro


Joined: 05/06/2007(UTC)
Posts: 74
Location: Surabaya,
I am upgrading old locos with ESU decoders, some locos are analog some are deltas. A friend told me that their old bulbs are 19V, 0.8A, thus must be replaced with the digital kind.
He says the old bulbs will melt loco plastic casing and could destroy decoders.
On the contrary my dealer says it is SAFE for digital.
The old bulbs i read from the locos manual are : #610040 (2-pin); 610080 (2-pin); 60015 (bayonet); 600100 (screw).
1. Can someone clear up this confusion?
2. What are the marklin part number for digital bulbs for 2-pin, bayonet & screw type respectively?

Thanks.
I use C track, CS
Hendro
Offline perz  
#2 Posted : 29 December 2007 11:51:32(UTC)
perz

Sweden   
Joined: 12/01/2002(UTC)
Posts: 2,578
Location: Sweden
610040 is for 19 V
610080 is for 22 V
60015: do you mean 600150 ? 600150 is for 19 V
600100 is for 19 V

In digital operation, the lamps are supplied with constant full voltage. Therefore, it was previously recommended to replace 19 V lamps with 22 V lamps. However, modern decoders (probably also the ESU decoders you use) have built-in dimmer functionality to adjust light intensity, so you can still have 19 V bulbs.

However, the 610040 is not suitable for digital operation, at least not driven directly from a decoder, since it draws too much current. Replace it with a 600080 (19 V) or 610080 (22 V) . The light will be less bright but you will be on the safe side regarding decoder load and heat.

Except for the 610040, I think it is safe to use the 19 V bulbs also without dimmer, but the light may be a bit strong and the life time of the bulbs will be reduced.
Offline Lars Westerlind  
#3 Posted : 29 December 2007 12:38:23(UTC)
Lars Westerlind


Joined: 19/10/2001(UTC)
Posts: 2,379
Location: Lindome, Sweden
And,
it's better to use 2 pin lamps, grounded at the decoder, than to use screw/bayonnets that are grounded in the socket/loco chassis. The latter works, but the lamps will flicker.
/Lars
Offline Mikael  
#4 Posted : 29 December 2007 13:41:16(UTC)
Mikael

Denmark   
Joined: 10/09/2004(UTC)
Posts: 959
Location: Copenhagen, Denmark
I nearly had a meltdown once. I've upgraded a lok to digital, and forgot to replace the bulbs. The result was fine for a minute or two, and then the smoke started to come out of the lok. It was a black rubber-like piece of tube that was covering half of the bulb, that started to disintegrate.
A few of Märklins loks uses this tube to shield off the light from coming out the wrong places, and in these cases, be sure to change the bulbs, or use the dimming function in the decoder, if available.
Offline mmervine  
#5 Posted : 29 December 2007 18:21:33(UTC)
mmervine

United States   
Joined: 30/01/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,896
Location: Keene, NH
Do they also make these in red? I am planning to digitize my ICE and would need both red and white.

r/mark
Märklin C-track, Marklin Digital & ECoS, multi-era French & Swiss
http://www.ete-ene.org/m...mervines-layout-gallery/
Offline pa-pauls  
#6 Posted : 29 December 2007 22:43:34(UTC)
pa-pauls


Joined: 08/06/2002(UTC)
Posts: 1,843
Location: Norway
Hi Hendro Smile

I always change to the 2 pin lamp 610080 when I do conversion's. It is better to be on the safe side wink
Pål Paulsen
Märklin Spur 1 Digital, epoche 3
Offline intruder  
#7 Posted : 30 December 2007 02:13:59(UTC)
intruder

Norway   
Joined: 16/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 5,382
Location: Akershus, Norway
I sometimes even use a 28 Volt bulb, to reduce light intencity, heat and power consumption.

A perfect type/size is called T1. I buy the ones with long (approx 30 mm) wire ends.

I have some red bulbs, Mark, but they have the same size and shape as the old white 600080. They work perfect with a serial resistor. Maybe 270 Ohms. I do not find the spare part number right now.
What about LEDs?
Best regards Svein, Norway
grumpy old sod
Offline Hendro  
#8 Posted : 30 December 2007 09:08:05(UTC)
Hendro


Joined: 05/06/2007(UTC)
Posts: 74
Location: Surabaya,
Thank you guys for helping.
Seems like only the 610080 fit best to digital system.
1. What is the marklin part number for the 2-pin light socket?
2. Do i need to mill the original bayonet cavity on the locos?
3. Do you know any site who stocks these parts on hand?
Hendro
User is suspended until 24/11/2846 07:19:16(UTC) Bigdaddynz  
#9 Posted : 30 December 2007 11:47:59(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,778
Location: New Zealand
Hendro, I think the socket is part no 276770. The Lokshop, www.lokshop.de should have them. Closer to home, I know my dealer at www.toottoot.co.nz will also have them.

I've never used these sockets, but I believe they screw into the existing lamp holder.
Offline intruder  
#10 Posted : 30 December 2007 16:06:54(UTC)
intruder

Norway   
Joined: 16/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 5,382
Location: Akershus, Norway
The 276770 socket fits like this:

UserPostedImage

Unscrew the bulb and remoce the C-clip. Push the new socket down, like in the photo. Be careful with the two wires, one in each new bulb socket slot.
Install the C-clip again.
The bulb in the photo is a 28 Volt T1 bulb

They are a part of the 60903, 60904, 60923 and 60924 conversion sets from Märklin.
Best regards Svein, Norway
grumpy old sod
Offline al_pignolo  
#11 Posted : 30 December 2007 16:19:18(UTC)
al_pignolo


Joined: 30/09/2005(UTC)
Posts: 904
Location: bologna, BO
Someone told me that is always better to replace bulbs with 22V ones, even when you can dim the voltage, because of the bigger current required by analog bulbs, but I don't know it this is true.

Anyhow, I often replace lightbulbs with LEDs when digitalizing a model. This is very easy for locos with 610080 bulbs because I simply insert a 3mm LED in the socket, only adding 1Kohm resistor.
The only problem is on colours, because warmwhite LEDs are not easy to find, but I don't dislike yellow ones.

Pietro
Offline Hendro  
#12 Posted : 30 December 2007 18:55:37(UTC)
Hendro


Joined: 05/06/2007(UTC)
Posts: 74
Location: Surabaya,
bigdaddy: my quest is over, thank you.
intruder: thank you as well for the nice picture.
Hendro
Offline DaleSchultz  
#13 Posted : 30 December 2007 19:27:33(UTC)
DaleSchultz

United States   
Joined: 10/02/2006(UTC)
Posts: 4,027
Location: In the process of moving to the UK
nice picture Svein
I will probably use such an adpator plus LED plus a dab of paint for the right colour
Dale
Intellibox + own software, K-Track
My current layout: https://cabin-layout.mixmox.com
Arrival and Departure signs: https://remotesign.mixmox.com
Offline intruder  
#14 Posted : 30 December 2007 19:45:00(UTC)
intruder

Norway   
Joined: 16/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 5,382
Location: Akershus, Norway
When using LEDs, please keep in mind that the orange wire (ESU = blue) is positive, the function output is negative.
Best regards Svein, Norway
grumpy old sod
Offline al_pignolo  
#15 Posted : 30 December 2007 20:16:56(UTC)
al_pignolo


Joined: 30/09/2005(UTC)
Posts: 904
Location: bologna, BO
Quote:
[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by DaleSchultz
<br />nice picture Svein
I will probably use such an adpator plus LED plus a dab of paint for the right colour


Dale, this is a good idea Smile. But wich kind of paint you suggest?
Offline Hendro  
#16 Posted : 31 December 2007 08:28:53(UTC)
Hendro


Joined: 05/06/2007(UTC)
Posts: 74
Location: Surabaya,
Bigdaddy,
Sorry to ask again, whats the part number to convert the bayonet socket to 2-pin?
Thanks.
Hendro
Offline foumaro  
#17 Posted : 31 December 2007 08:35:39(UTC)
foumaro

Greece   
Joined: 08/12/2004(UTC)
Posts: 4,431
Location: Attiki Athens Greece
The great knowledge that some members have with all these seems
unbelievable to me.Anyway congratulations to the members whom with
their great knowledge help all the others.biggrin
Offline widianto  
#18 Posted : 24 January 2008 15:09:57(UTC)
widianto

Indonesia   
Joined: 03/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 174
Location: Indonesia
Halo cak Hendro..apa kabar???

Kenapa lampunya ga pakai LED saja, selain lebih murah juga lebih terang khan??? Saya basudah sering tuh ganti lampu pake LED di Loco.

Best Regards
Widianto
One Of Indonesian MARKLINIST
M&C-Track/Mobile Station-Analog Controller/Diesel Engine Lovers, Multi Era-Multi Country
Offline sudibarba  
#19 Posted : 25 January 2008 01:10:38(UTC)
sudibarba

United States   
Joined: 28/07/2006(UTC)
Posts: 880
Location: Augusta, GA USA
As I recently purchased several LokPilot V 3.0 decoders and have magnents on order this issue of light bulbs concerned me. Especially from protecting the decoder point of view. I did a little research and found Kenneth Pallund's web page www.pallund.dk. He had done a review of the LokPilot V 1.0 and expressed concerns about the max output for each light of mA 140. When I looked at the documentation that came with my V 3.0's I found the included docs were for V 2.0 - they have not published the English version yet. The V 2.0 is now rated at mA 180. I contacted Kenneth and he felt that this dismissed any concern about the lighting as he feels the old light draw somewhere between 50 to 100 mA. He later contacted me after looking at the German documentation for the V 3.0 and told me that the max is now at 250mA which I confirmed by looking myself.With this decoder there doesn't seem to be an issue.I am not an electrical engineer but Kenneth is. I hope I got this right so its my fault if I did not, not his.
Eric
Offline sudibarba  
#20 Posted : 25 January 2008 02:49:10(UTC)
sudibarba

United States   
Joined: 28/07/2006(UTC)
Posts: 880
Location: Augusta, GA USA
Quote:
[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by Hendro
<br />I am upgrading old locos with ESU decoders, some locos are analog some are deltas. A friend told me that their old bulbs are 19V, 0.8A, thus must be replaced with the digital kind.
He says the old bulbs will melt loco plastic casing and could destroy decoders.
On the contrary my dealer says it is SAFE for digital.
The old bulbs i read from the locos manual are : #610040 (2-pin); 610080 (2-pin); 60015 (bayonet); 600100 (screw).
1. Can someone clear up this confusion?
2. What are the marklin part number for digital bulbs for 2-pin, bayonet & screw type respectively?

Thanks.
I use C track, CS

Actually, the rating in the Marklin catalogue is .8 va which is watts. Not the same thing as amps.
Eric
Offline DaleSchultz  
#21 Posted : 25 January 2008 03:33:50(UTC)
DaleSchultz

United States   
Joined: 10/02/2006(UTC)
Posts: 4,027
Location: In the process of moving to the UK
Quote:
[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Dale, this is a good idea Smile. But wich kind of paint you suggest?

I use cheap acrylic paint.
Example: http://layout.mixmox.com/1/LED_module
Dale
Intellibox + own software, K-Track
My current layout: https://cabin-layout.mixmox.com
Arrival and Departure signs: https://remotesign.mixmox.com
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