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Offline mascagni  
#1 Posted : 30 September 2007 17:39:35(UTC)
mascagni


Joined: 25/07/2002(UTC)
Posts: 826
Location: Tallahassee, FL USA
Hi: A friend helped put a 66032 in an relatively unused 3088 (small diesel). The result was not completely satisfactory. The lights work, but the motor does not run, it makes a buzzing sound, but no movement. This occurs both on an AC layout as well as on a digital layout using decode address 80, which is the address that the decoder was set for. In addition, the lights change over with either the AC over voltage or the digital direction change. Also, in digital the lights dim as the velocity is increased.

I have come to the following conclusions:

1. The decoder seems to working fine.

2. The problem is either that the motor is is not appropriate for this type of conversion or that the decoder is correctly wired except to the motor.

Can you please comment on whether you think these conclusions are valid and what to try next? If you think that something else might be up, please tell me. In addition, if you want more specific information, ask me, and I will post it.

Thanks.--MM
Michael Mascagni, Tallahassee
If I weren't a Mathematician, I'd be a Violinist.--Albert Einstein
Offline Sander van Wijk  
#2 Posted : 30 September 2007 17:49:23(UTC)
Sander van Wijk

Netherlands   
Joined: 20/04/2003(UTC)
Posts: 2,248
Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands; Göteborg, Sverige,
Perhaps a rather simple (or even stupid) question but anyhow: did it run before the conversion? Or could it be the motor is stuck due to dried oil in the motor?

Did you check that both the short wires of the motor coil are still connected to the motor plate, the way they were before? (Note that the coil has four wires: two are connected to the decoder (and earlier the relay, blue and green on the decoder), I'm talking about the other two. Sometimes they break, resulting in similar kinds of behavior as you mentioned.

One thing is for sure: this type of motor is suitable to go with the 6603x types of decoders...

Good luck!
Sander
---
Era I(b): K.Bay.Sts.B. and K.W.St.E.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Sander van Wijk
Offline MärCo  
#3 Posted : 30 September 2007 17:59:58(UTC)
MärCo


Joined: 06/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 1,159
Location: The Netherlands
1) Before rebuilding, check if the motor is working correct.
2) Check, and check again, if all the wires are in the correct place. I also compare with a locomotive rebuilded by Märklin, just to be sure.
3) The decoder may not hit the metal frame.
4) Check all the soldering points.
5) Check with another address.
Absolutly AFB-NOHAB fan ;-)
Offline Lars Westerlind  
#4 Posted : 30 September 2007 18:10:43(UTC)
Lars Westerlind


Joined: 19/10/2001(UTC)
Posts: 2,379
Location: Lindome, Sweden
Can the motor be moved by forcing the wheels to move (not every model want this test, but I think it's alright with this one). Motor stuch seems the most likely problem as you describe it.

Another very normal mistake is that the brushes are not properly into place, but then you should have not humming.

Overoiling is also very likely; if there is oil on the commutator, you'll get a shortcut in the motor with exactly the symptoms you describe. Remove the motor and clean the commutoator, motor brush thoroughly, and perhaps replace the brushes.

/Lars
Offline mascagni  
#5 Posted : 30 September 2007 19:02:28(UTC)
mascagni


Joined: 25/07/2002(UTC)
Posts: 826
Location: Tallahassee, FL USA
FYI: The 3088 worked before, but I will play around, and see what more I can tell you.

Keep sending in suggestions.--MM
Michael Mascagni, Tallahassee
If I weren't a Mathematician, I'd be a Violinist.--Albert Einstein
Offline al_pignolo  
#6 Posted : 30 September 2007 23:29:06(UTC)
al_pignolo


Joined: 30/09/2005(UTC)
Posts: 904
Location: bologna, BO
Lars, I agree with you. I had the same problems with my 3315 after the conversion, and the motor was not working simply because the brushes had no contact. It happens sometimes that they seem to touch the collector but they really don't.
So if you have 3088.2 with DCM check the motor brushes very carefully. I hope you'll solve your problem soon.

About the 66032, I don't know if someone shared it again but I found this upgrading some times ago (but I never tried it... [:I] ) http://www.jus-kn.de/66032_e.htm

Regards
Pietro
Offline Sander van Wijk  
#7 Posted : 01 October 2007 00:11:58(UTC)
Sander van Wijk

Netherlands   
Joined: 20/04/2003(UTC)
Posts: 2,248
Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands; Göteborg, Sverige,
Hi Pietro,

The conversion you proposed is something I've done for numerous times already, and, I have to say, it works flawlessly. Good that you've pointed it out!
Sander
---
Era I(b): K.Bay.Sts.B. and K.W.St.E.
Offline mascagni  
#8 Posted : 01 October 2007 16:02:52(UTC)
mascagni


Joined: 25/07/2002(UTC)
Posts: 826
Location: Tallahassee, FL USA
More info: The wheels turn easily, so I will look at the other suggestions that are currently posted, and those that come in. One thing I may do is disconnect the motor and drive it directly with AC to confirm that nothing weird has happened. I assume that one SHOULD NOT do a quick check like this with the decoder still attached.--MM
Michael Mascagni, Tallahassee
If I weren't a Mathematician, I'd be a Violinist.--Albert Einstein
Offline mascagni  
#9 Posted : 08 October 2007 15:52:18(UTC)
mascagni


Joined: 25/07/2002(UTC)
Posts: 826
Location: Tallahassee, FL USA
Yet more information:

I have set up a small M-track layout with turnouts controlled by an IB and Viessmann solenoid decoders. When I put the partially converted 3088 onto the layout and try to control it via address 80, the lights turn on, and they switch over with direction, but no movement occurs (this was previously written about). The new observation is that the turnout lights dim considerably as I increase the power to the 3088. It's lights also dim. Thus a lot of current is being drawn when I do this, much more than I would expect to actually drive the 3088. So:

What does this indicate:

1. A short in the 3088 motor?
2. A fault/short in the 66032?
3. A clue in an erroneous installation?

Please post your ideas and I will have a look when I next find the time.

Thanks again to all for helping with this.--MM
Michael Mascagni, Tallahassee
If I weren't a Mathematician, I'd be a Violinist.--Albert Einstein
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