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Offline mike c  
#1 Posted : 07 January 2025 18:48:48(UTC)
mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 8,216
Location: Montreal, QC
The Swiss Express began in 1972 as a test project and went into operation in 1975. To mark the 50th Anniversary of the launch of these trains, Maerklin is releasing a model of a Re 4/4II (first series) and two sets of EWIII coaches.
Alongside these coaches, Maerklin is also releasing a two car set of Sputnik cabooses. The Swiss Express ran from St. Gallen to Geneva via Zurich, Bern, Fribourg and Lausanne and back. Each train consisted of 14 coaches, made up of one AD (1st class with baggage), five A (1st class), a restaurant (WR) and seven B (2nd class) coaches. The AD coach did not have a gangway at the baggage end and instead had the new SBB Logo <+> stamped on the end.

For a decade, the Swiss Express was the flagship train of the SBB. first as reproduced by Maerklin, later as a push-pull train using pilot coaches constructed from rebuilt second class coaches.

I will provide more details in the coming days.

I wanted to make it clear to all that the pair of Sputnik cars would not normally have seen use with the locomotives in the Swiss Express colours. Those locomotives had special couplings for the consist. The Sputniks were chosen as adapter cars to enable them to couple on one side with the Swiss Express cars and on the other side with regular SBB tractive material. So, if a train arrived and needed to be shunted, a locomotive and one of the Sputniks would approach the train, the Sputnik would be coupled and the consist could then be shunted as required. This was necessary as there were only a few Re 4/4 outfitted to operate with these consists and none were available for shunting.

This colourful livery stood out compared to the green coaches normally found on Swiss rails and along with the already well known TEE trains (Rae II "Gottardo") became internationally famous.

Coming home from Switzerland in 1972, I remember seeing the photos of the train in the SBB Calendars and wanting so bad to see the train and have it in model. I got the chance to ride the Swiss Express in 1985, albeit already converted as a push-pull train. It had been replaced in the top level services by the newer EWIV consists and was now running on secondary lines (Zurich-Olten-Solothurn-Biel-Neuchatel-Geneva, Zurich Kloten - Zurich -Luzern, etc) rather than the prestige line from St. Gallen to Geneva.

I look forward to having this consist in my collection and hope that Maerklin's model will be all that I hope it will be.

Regards

Mike C
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Offline mvd71  
#2 Posted : 07 January 2025 19:22:42(UTC)
mvd71

New Zealand   
Joined: 09/08/2008(UTC)
Posts: 1,916
Location: Auckland,
Thanks for providing such an informative news post. The background info is great 👍

Cheers….

Mike
Offline 5HorizonsRR  
#3 Posted : 07 January 2025 20:09:09(UTC)
5HorizonsRR

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC)
Posts: 2,973
Location: CA, USA
This set is certainly a "must" for me. I have only two hesitations:

1- Not much I can do, but the chosen route labelling is not one I would prefer. If Marklin was confirming a second variant in sync with this one I'd be waiting on it. Interesting that the extra two car set has decal options for this, but the 4 car set seemingly does not.

2- Price. US feels very high, I just can't afford the nearly $100 per car price I'm seeing, despite really wanting to support a local source. DE (Modellbahn Kramm was the only place I saw any pricing at a glance) seemed considerably cheaper. Still expensive, but again this is a "must-have" set for me.
SBB Era 2-5
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Offline mike c  
#4 Posted : 07 January 2025 21:29:11(UTC)
mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 8,216
Location: Montreal, QC
Originally Posted by: 5HorizonsRR Go to Quoted Post
This set is certainly a "must" for me. I have only two hesitations:

1- Not much I can do, but the chosen route labelling is not one I would prefer. If Marklin was confirming a second variant in sync with this one I'd be waiting on it. Interesting that the extra two car set has decal options for this, but the 4 car set seemingly does not.

2- Price. US feels very high, I just can't afford the nearly $100 per car price I'm seeing, despite really wanting to support a local source. DE (Modellbahn Kramm was the only place I saw any pricing at a glance) seemed considerably cheaper. Still expensive, but again this is a "must-have" set for me.


I saw a few places offering early order pricing. At $100 per car, you have to take into account that the cars have current conducting couplers, LED lighting and other features.

The decal set with additional coach numbers allows you to extend the train to the prototypical length. There was only one AD and WR per train, so by adding A and B coaches, you can get to the prototypical
AD - A - A - A - A - A - WR - B - B - B - B - B - B - B consist. The base set (42190) contains the AD, WR and a pair of B, so 5 additional 42191 (5 A (1st) and 5 B (2nd)) brings you to the total of 5 A and 7 B .

Regards

Mike C
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Offline mike c  
#5 Posted : 09 January 2025 18:34:36(UTC)
mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 8,216
Location: Montreal, QC
I pulled the trigger and ordered the 38420 Re 4/4II and the 42190 and a pair of 42191 Sets. I know that the original consist was 14 cars long, but I think that 8 coaches should be long enough for my needs.

Regards

Mike C
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Offline mmervine  
#6 Posted : 09 January 2025 19:50:21(UTC)
mmervine

United States   
Joined: 30/01/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,893
Location: Keene, NH
Mike-how and why were the sputniks used with this train?

Mark
Märklin C-track, Marklin Digital & ECoS, multi-era French & Swiss
http://www.ete-ene.org/m...mervines-layout-gallery/
Offline Unholz  
#7 Posted : 09 January 2025 20:11:33(UTC)
Unholz

Switzerland   
Joined: 29/07/2007(UTC)
Posts: 1,435
Location: Switzerland
Originally Posted by: mmervine Go to Quoted Post
Mike-how and why were the sputniks used with this train?


Not Mike, but the Sputniks were actually not used with "this train" (i.e. the entire train) but with single coaches of the EW III type, either during shunting or then in case of a transfer of one or a couple of Swiss Express coaches from A to B. Sometimes there was a Sputnik on each end of such a consist, but often one was enough. The Sputniks provided the necessary transition from the EW III coaches equipped with automatic couplers on one end and the standard Swiss/European hook and buffer couplers on the other end.
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Offline jvuye  
#8 Posted : 09 January 2025 22:02:19(UTC)
jvuye

Belgium   
Joined: 01/03/2008(UTC)
Posts: 2,883
Location: South Western France
Originally Posted by: mike c Go to Quoted Post
I pulled the trigger and ordered the 38420 Re 4/4II and the 42190 and a pair of 42191 Sets. I know that the original consist was 14 cars long, but I think that 8 coaches should be long enough for my needs.

Regards

Mike C




Yes , good move Mike(
This has always been a must have , those affectionately called "Rahmschnittewagen" ( "Ice cream Sandwich coaches") and the matching Re4/4 II locos!
A little piece of trivia: at the time,I learned from an SBB engineer that the coaches (EW III) where originally thought to incorporate a tilting mechanism and that trials were conducted in that direction.
Which is what explains the lightly upward curved cross section of the coaches, which was designed to provide enough clearance in tunnels for tilting coaches
But it seems the idea wasn't followed and the tilting mechanisms were never installed on the production vehicles .

Like you, when I saw these during a trip to Switzerland, I did fall in love and immediately got to the next Train store and bought the HAG loco (a bit oversized!BigGrin and a set of the Liliput coaches.
This release by Märklin is clearly an improvement and will all the added refinement Marklin will certainly sell a lot of these!
Jacques Vuye aka Dr.Eisenbahn
Once a vandal, learned to be better and had great success!
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Offline David Dewar  
#9 Posted : 09 January 2025 23:24:46(UTC)
David Dewar

Scotland   
Joined: 01/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 7,448
Location: Scotland
Are these coaches costing about 100 euros each. If so for a plastic toy with a strip iof leds that is ridiculous. However Marklin will sell some and if they are made in China at what will be low cost then they will do well. I don’t mind buying coaches for around 40 euros max and I will fit my own lighting. I t is not that I don’t have the cash but I don’t buy at rip off prices.
Take care I like Marklin and will defend the worlds greatest model rail manufacturer.
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Offline 5HorizonsRR  
#10 Posted : 10 January 2025 00:26:08(UTC)
5HorizonsRR

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC)
Posts: 2,973
Location: CA, USA
Originally Posted by: David Dewar Go to Quoted Post
Are these coaches costing about 100 euros each. If so for a plastic toy with a strip iof leds that is ridiculous. However Marklin will sell some and if they are made in China at what will be low cost then they will do well. I don’t mind buying coaches for around 40 euros max and I will fit my own lighting. I t is not that I don’t have the cash but I don’t buy at rip off prices.


I entirely agree they are too expensive, and I am of the consumer base that cannot easily afford it/don't have the cash lying around, but this is the state of the hobby in 2025. Just look at the Piko SBB EW1 coaches, which cost even more with lights. On the plus side, the only options for unique models like this used to be brass, at 5x the price or more.

The set will be my one new Marklin purchase for the year. (and 2nd new items purchase in 5 years, I just haven't bought new items since prices went through the roof) Where I will be picky is quality and accuracy. For the price they should be stellar models built to the prototype, and I am optimistic they will be.

This is unrelated, but I do wish Marklin offered locos without sound, or even without decoder fitted. (Like Roco, or the US Manufacturers) That would shave a lot of money off the retail price for functions we don't all want or need, but I understand from a Marketing and product planning perspective why they don't.

SBB Era 2-5
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Offline kiwiAlan  
#11 Posted : 10 January 2025 01:11:22(UTC)
kiwiAlan

United Kingdom   
Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC)
Posts: 8,455
Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
Originally Posted by: 5HorizonsRR Go to Quoted Post
[
This is unrelated, but I do wish Marklin offered locos without sound, or even without decoder fitted.


The problem there is that if they sell a loco without a decoder then they have to fit a field coil and reverse unit, and that pair have a combined cost that is higher than a magnet and decoder.

Roco et al can only provide models without decoders because they are 2-rail DC models and you can connect the motor directly to the wheel pickups. Change the polarity of the DC and the loco runs in the opposite direction - doesn't happen with Marklin locos. You will find their AC models will always have a decoder as that is used to convert the AC to DC for the motor.

It is all a case of economics with AC models.
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Offline GlennM  
#12 Posted : 10 January 2025 02:46:13(UTC)
GlennM

United Kingdom   
Joined: 09/05/2011(UTC)
Posts: 2,967
Location: Somewhere, But Nowhere Near Manchester, England
Originally Posted by: jvuye Go to Quoted Post


Like you, when I saw these during a trip to Switzerland, I did fall in love and immediately got to the next Train store and bought the HAG loco (a bit oversized!BigGrin and a set of the Liliput coaches.
This release by Märklin is clearly an improvement and will all the added refinement Marklin will certainly sell a lot of these!


Jacques,

I also have the oversized HAG loco (AC analogue) and Liliput set, but must confess I was very disappointed with the quality of the Liliput set. I agree with you that the Marklin set will be a huge improvement.

I also bought the Roco model Re 4/4 II (ROCO 7520002) last year and I have ordered the matching coaches from LSModels / ModelsWorld (coach set MW2109AC), but with this release from Marklin I am now in two minds whether or not to cancel the LS Model coach set and buy this????
Don't look back, your not heading that way.
Offline GlennM  
#13 Posted : 10 January 2025 03:03:02(UTC)
GlennM

United Kingdom   
Joined: 09/05/2011(UTC)
Posts: 2,967
Location: Somewhere, But Nowhere Near Manchester, England
Originally Posted by: David Dewar Go to Quoted Post
Are these coaches costing about 100 euros each. If so for a plastic toy with a strip iof leds that is ridiculous. However Marklin will sell some and if they are made in China at what will be low cost then they will do well. I don’t mind buying coaches for around 40 euros max and I will fit my own lighting. I t is not that I don’t have the cash but I don’t buy at rip off prices.


I would agree 100% and I believe that some MRR items are clearly overpriced, but it seems to be becoming the industry standard for coaches that have new tooling and come with lights, couplings and decoders.

The new Roco Nightjet set announced last year, when the price was finally announced Modelbahn Lippe wrote to everyone who had ordered giving them an option to cancel without penalty, and the black edition of the set is over Euros 1699 for 7 coach set.

I would note that LS Models and ACME have been charging over Euros 100 per coach for some time, and even second hand some of the special sets by these manufacturers still bring over Euros 100 per coach second hand.

The production of special items or special editions seems the way all MRR manufacturers are going which allows them to have a standard income stream and higher income stream from the special or limited edition models.

Whether or not the price is worth it (for a bit of plastic with a lighting strip) is a personal choice, but then I am amazed at the cost of Ipads, Iphones and Iwatches, and I know a lot of people who have all three and after three years these items are largely worthless, at least my Marklin coaches still have some residual value BigGrin BigGrin BigGrin
Don't look back, your not heading that way.
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Offline 5HorizonsRR  
#14 Posted : 10 January 2025 05:27:24(UTC)
5HorizonsRR

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC)
Posts: 2,973
Location: CA, USA
Originally Posted by: kiwiAlan Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: 5HorizonsRR Go to Quoted Post
[
This is unrelated, but I do wish Marklin offered locos without sound, or even without decoder fitted.


The problem there is that if they sell a loco without a decoder then they have to fit a field coil and reverse unit, and that pair have a combined cost that is higher than a magnet and decoder.

Roco et al can only provide models without decoders because they are 2-rail DC models and you can connect the motor directly to the wheel pickups. Change the polarity of the DC and the loco runs in the opposite direction - doesn't happen with Marklin locos. You will find their AC models will always have a decoder as that is used to convert the AC to DC for the motor.

It is all a case of economics with AC models.




Very true, although almost everything Marklin makes has a DC motor these days, so at least for those items it would be easy (technically). From an SKU, inventory, and product management perspective a lot trickier.
SBB Era 2-5
Offline mike c  
#15 Posted : 10 January 2025 06:46:09(UTC)
mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 8,216
Location: Montreal, QC
Originally Posted by: GlennM Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: jvuye Go to Quoted Post


Like you, when I saw these during a trip to Switzerland, I did fall in love and immediately got to the next Train store and bought the HAG loco (a bit oversized!BigGrin and a set of the Liliput coaches.
This release by Märklin is clearly an improvement and will all the added refinement Marklin will certainly sell a lot of these!


Jacques,

I also have the oversized HAG loco (AC analogue) and Liliput set, but must confess I was very disappointed with the quality of the Liliput set. I agree with you that the Marklin set will be a huge improvement.

I also bought the Roco model Re 4/4 II (ROCO 7520002) last year and I have ordered the matching coaches from LSModels / ModelsWorld (coach set MW2109AC), but with this release from Marklin I am now in two minds whether or not to cancel the LS Model coach set and buy this????


I had the original Hag model (1984) with the Liliput tilting coaches. That mechanism was cool on the layout. I sold that consist to my brother. Since then, I have acquired all three of the Roco Re 4/4IIs in that livery. I must confess that the most recent one was really frustrating with the incorrect rendition of details. I also have a consist of the newer Liliput Bachmann coaches with pilot coach. The models no longer have the tilting mechanism of the Liliput Vienna models, but do have close couplers and improved appearance. I had been considering the LSM original "Swiss Express" coach set, but AFAIR it was only available in a 14 coach set and the Maerklin set with 4 + 2 + Optional add ons seemed like a good deal to me.

As far as the cost of the Maerklin coaches, if you look at the description closely, you will see that the coaches have multicoloured interior details, LED lightings, tail lights and a whole bunch of other features. I don't recall whether it included a decoder to control the lights and taillights. It would be cool to have taillights at each end that would reverse with the train. Based on the photos, it looks like that coach bogies will be centre pivoting and not offset like many other models, but I am not taking this for granted.

I have not seen any prices (official) for the LS Models MW2108 set, which is supposed to be an 8 coach set. So far, the only model on the lsmodels.eu website is the Kambly BLS consist in versions with and without lighting. There is no mention of the original version on the website at this moment.

I think that the Maerklin Swiss Express should be worth it. If the LSM models are really nice, I may decide to go for the version with pilot coach and replace my Liliput Bachmann ones. In any case, that remains something for the future. The BLS Nina trains, the Rae Gottardo and the EWIV Pendelzug should be the next projects from LSM. I don't know what's happening with the RBe 4/4 (540) and RABDe 12/12 at the moment.

Regards

Mike C
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Offline Unholz  
#16 Posted : 10 January 2025 08:13:07(UTC)
Unholz

Switzerland   
Joined: 29/07/2007(UTC)
Posts: 1,435
Location: Switzerland
Originally Posted by: jvuye Go to Quoted Post

A little piece of trivia: at the time,I learned from an SBB engineer that the coaches (EW III) where originally thought to incorporate a tilting mechanism and that trials were conducted in that direction.

Indeed such tests happened - and of course, this forum's Swiss correspondent was present: BigGrin

querneigung_b.jpgquerneigung_c.jpg
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Offline GlennM  
#17 Posted : 10 January 2025 10:52:25(UTC)
GlennM

United Kingdom   
Joined: 09/05/2011(UTC)
Posts: 2,967
Location: Somewhere, But Nowhere Near Manchester, England
Originally Posted by: mike c Go to Quoted Post


I don't know what's happening with the RBe 4/4 (540) and RABDe 12/12 at the moment.

Regards

Mike C


My last enquiry (September 2024ish) I was told RBe 4/4 late 2025 at the earliest and the RABDe 12/12 2026 or later.

We shall see, and I am not in a rush as I have a lot to keep me busy BigGrin BigGrin
Don't look back, your not heading that way.
Offline David Dewar  
#18 Posted : 10 January 2025 13:27:57(UTC)
David Dewar

Scotland   
Joined: 01/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 7,448
Location: Scotland
Originally Posted by: GlennM Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: David Dewar Go to Quoted Post
Are these coaches costing about 100 euros each. If so for a plastic toy with a strip iof leds that is ridiculous. However Marklin will sell some and if they are made in China at what will be low cost then they will do well. I don’t mind buying coaches for around 40 euros max and I will fit my own lighting. I t is not that I don’t have the cash but I don’t buy at rip off prices.


I would agree 100% and I believe that some MRR items are clearly overpriced, but it seems to be becoming the industry standard for coaches that have new tooling and come with lights, couplings and decoders.

The new Roco Nightjet set announced last year, when the price was finally announced Modelbahn Lippe wrote to everyone who had ordered giving them an option to cancel without penalty, and the black edition of the set is over Euros 1699 for 7 coach set.

I would note that LS Models and ACME have been charging over Euros 100 per coach for some time, and even second hand some of the special sets by these manufacturers still bring over Euros 100 per coach second hand.

The production of special items or special editions seems the way all MRR manufacturers are going which allows them to have a standard income stream and higher income stream from the special or limited edition models.

Whether or not the price is worth it (for a bit of plastic with a lighting strip) is a personal choice, but then I am amazed at the cost of Ipads, Iphones and Iwatches, and I know a lot of people who have all three and after three years these items are largely worthless, at least my Marklin coaches still have some residual value BigGrin BigGrin BigGrin




I have an Ipad and Iphone. Both are well made and have lasted well and will continue to do so hopefully. Either cost less than some Locos and coach sets and do hold a value.
The way coaches are made is obvious when you try to open them and the interior is cheap plastic of one colour. When a new washing machine or TV set etc costs less than a rake of toy coaches then somebody is making a lot of cash from the few left in the hobby prepared to pay up. Thankfully my layout is more than forty years old and was built and locos etc added when they were at a reasonable price. However I am happy to see that items are selling as it keeps Marklin in business and I can buy a few items when needed.

Take care I like Marklin and will defend the worlds greatest model rail manufacturer.
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Offline mrmarklin  
#19 Posted : 10 January 2025 18:46:56(UTC)
mrmarklin

United States   
Joined: 27/10/2004(UTC)
Posts: 936
Location: Burney, CA
"I have an Ipad and Iphone. Both are well made and have lasted well and will continue to do so hopefully. Either cost less than some Locos and coach sets and do hold a value.
The way coaches are made is obvious when you try to open them and the interior is cheap plastic of one colour. When a new washing machine or TV set etc costs less than a rake of toy coaches then somebody is making a lot of cash from the few left in the hobby prepared to pay up. Thankfully my layout is more than forty years old and was built and locos etc added when they were at a reasonable price. However I am happy to see that items are selling as it keeps Marklin in business and I can buy a few items when needed."


You are correct in that these relatively low production specialty items are expensive. I hope you are not into firearms. I paid USD289 for a hinge to go with my Accuracy International (British made) rifle. It was a specialty part. BTW the rifles are not cheap either.

Low production items still have to cover the costs of tooling and having a manufacturing plant to make them. I've often wondered about the relative cost of rolling stock to loks. Example: mfx Lok #36505 costs EUR119. Less than rolling stock #47473 @ EUR149. The Lok has a motor, gears, a sophisticated electronic system as well as add on parts such as windows, couplers etc. Go figure.

So much for thread-jacking.

I have ordered the Swiss Express set (Lok and wagon sets). The only decision left is whether to get four more sets of 42191 for a 14 wagon consist.Cool
Life's tough in the first world...Crying
From the People's Republik of Kalifornia
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Offline GlennM  
#20 Posted : 11 January 2025 06:31:27(UTC)
GlennM

United Kingdom   
Joined: 09/05/2011(UTC)
Posts: 2,967
Location: Somewhere, But Nowhere Near Manchester, England
Originally Posted by: David Dewar Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: GlennM Go to Quoted Post

I have an Ipad and Iphone. Both are well made and have lasted well and will continue to do so hopefully. Either cost less than some Locos and coach sets and do hold a value.



I would not agree, recently tried to offload less than five year old Iphone, Ipad and MacBook Pro and found that there was no real value in any of the products.

The Ipad was considered so out of date we put a hammer through it removed the hard disk and put it in the bin. Sad end.

Notwithstanding this I agree that cost of coaches and in fact MRR items in general are too expensive (increased considerably in recent years) and now cost more than the items are likely worth worth. Currently the future of our hobby is sadly unclear.
Don't look back, your not heading that way.
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Offline mike c  
#21 Posted : 11 January 2025 17:38:10(UTC)
mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 8,216
Location: Montreal, QC
Originally Posted by: Unholz Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: jvuye Go to Quoted Post

A little piece of trivia: at the time,I learned from an SBB engineer that the coaches (EW III) where originally thought to incorporate a tilting mechanism and that trials were conducted in that direction.

Indeed such tests happened - and of course, this forum's Swiss correspondent was present: BigGrin

querneigung_b.jpgquerneigung_c.jpg


Was tipping mandatory? ;)

Mike C
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