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Offline Eddie7979  
#1 Posted : 12 July 2023 18:13:54(UTC)
Eddie7979

Australia   
Joined: 01/07/2022(UTC)
Posts: 109
Location: Western Australia, Bassendean
Hi everyone,

I am currently working on a layout, using the CS3 Plus and working to automate it with Rocrail.

I noticed that there are 2’settings on the CS3, odometer speed and the max speed of a locomotive.

I’m just wondering, if a locomotive has a prototypical speed of 80km/h and we set the speedometer accordingly, should the max speed in the locomotive settings be set the same?

I’m also figuring out how to set the max speed with Rocrail as well.

Not sure if I’m making much sense, hopefully I am.

Be great to know the settings you use.

Eddie
Eddie
Perth 🇦🇺
Marklin | Roco | Piko
CS3+ & Rocrail
Offline ocram63_uk  
#2 Posted : 12 July 2023 18:23:58(UTC)
ocram63_uk

United Kingdom   
Joined: 07/01/2015(UTC)
Posts: 704
Location: England, Suffolk
ideally, if you set the max speed of a loco to match its 'real' speed, then you should tune the relative CVs to achieve that speed. I have an Ecos, so I bought the very old speedometer car by Marklin and check with that. Alternatively I use a stopwatch to measure the speed on a given length of track and convert accordingly
Offline JohnjeanB  
#3 Posted : 12 July 2023 19:45:57(UTC)
JohnjeanB

France   
Joined: 04/02/2011(UTC)
Posts: 3,130
Location: Paris, France
Hi Eddie
Originally Posted by: Eddie7979 Go to Quoted Post
Hi everyone,

I am currently working on a layout, using the CS3 Plus and working to automate it with Rocrail.

I noticed that there are 2’settings on the CS3, odometer speed and the max speed of a locomotive.

I’m just wondering, if a locomotive has a prototypical speed of 80km/h and we set the speedometer accordingly, should the max speed in the locomotive settings be set the same?

I’m also figuring out how to set the max speed with Rocrail as well.

Not sure if I’m making much sense, hopefully I am.

Be great to know the settings you use.

Eddie

Here a big fan of Rocrail with a CS3 (and a CS2 before that).
- the odometer maximum speed is only cosmetic (no influence on anything) and I set it to the maximum permitted speed of the prototype.
- the maximum speed on the CS3 (or CS2) is important because it sets a range for all Rocrail speeds for that loco (V_min, V_mid, V_cruise, V_max.
- I set the CS3 maximum speed to a realistic line speed when signals are green and no line restrictions
- I set the CS3 acceleration and deceleration to a realistic value associated with a full complete train (high value for a heavy goods train and a shorter value for an express train
- the distance of the stop (IN) detection zones are the same in all my layout: 20 cm, the rest is used by the ENTER detection (150cm typically)
- the V_mid speed for each loco is set so that I get a realistic circulation in a station

Your questions make perfect sense and all the speed adjustments allow to have a realistic motion of trains, a precise stop of trains where you want

With Rocrail, the mostly used settings are:
- V_cruise: the speed when on a line without restrictions (no station, no special zone)
- V_mid: the speed when ENTER is detected and when the next signal is red
- V_min: less used, it applies on a turntable and when PR2IN is detected.

Here is a flavour of speed control by Rocrail


So, in short, on a CS3, adjust only the maximum speed, the inertia curve (I use standard exponential) and the accel / brake delays. All the rest is to be set by Rocrail.
You may set a speed command from a block, using an ACTION, indicating the speed in percentage of the V_max and valid for ANY loco in the block (simply leave the LokID field blank and RR will do the rest.
Cheers
Jean
Cheers
Jean
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by JohnjeanB
Offline Eddie7979  
#4 Posted : 14 July 2023 01:13:05(UTC)
Eddie7979

Australia   
Joined: 01/07/2022(UTC)
Posts: 109
Location: Western Australia, Bassendean
Originally Posted by: ocram63_uk Go to Quoted Post
ideally, if you set the max speed of a loco to match its 'real' speed, then you should tune the relative CVs to achieve that speed. I have an Ecos, so I bought the very old speedometer car by Marklin and check with that. Alternatively I use a stopwatch to measure the speed on a given length of track and convert accordingly


Hi,
Interesting, I didn’t know Marklin made a speedometer. I haven’t used the Ecos system, though I almost bought it instead of the CS3.

Thanks for sharing your method.
Eddie
Perth 🇦🇺
Marklin | Roco | Piko
CS3+ & Rocrail
Offline Eddie7979  
#5 Posted : 14 July 2023 01:18:21(UTC)
Eddie7979

Australia   
Joined: 01/07/2022(UTC)
Posts: 109
Location: Western Australia, Bassendean
Originally Posted by: JohnjeanB Go to Quoted Post
Hi Eddie
Originally Posted by: Eddie7979 Go to Quoted Post
Hi everyone,

I am currently working on a layout, using the CS3 Plus and working to automate it with Rocrail.

I noticed that there are 2’settings on the CS3, odometer speed and the max speed of a locomotive.

I’m just wondering, if a locomotive has a prototypical speed of 80km/h and we set the speedometer accordingly, should the max speed in the locomotive settings be set the same?

I’m also figuring out how to set the max speed with Rocrail as well.

Not sure if I’m making much sense, hopefully I am.

Be great to know the settings you use.

Eddie

Here a big fan of Rocrail with a CS3 (and a CS2 before that).
- the odometer maximum speed is only cosmetic (no influence on anything) and I set it to the maximum permitted speed of the prototype.
- the maximum speed on the CS3 (or CS2) is important because it sets a range for all Rocrail speeds for that loco (V_min, V_mid, V_cruise, V_max.
- I set the CS3 maximum speed to a realistic line speed when signals are green and no line restrictions
- I set the CS3 acceleration and deceleration to a realistic value associated with a full complete train (high value for a heavy goods train and a shorter value for an express train
- the distance of the stop (IN) detection zones are the same in all my layout: 20 cm, the rest is used by the ENTER detection (150cm typically)
- the V_mid speed for each loco is set so that I get a realistic circulation in a station

Your questions make perfect sense and all the speed adjustments allow to have a realistic motion of trains, a precise stop of trains where you want

With Rocrail, the mostly used settings are:
- V_cruise: the speed when on a line without restrictions (no station, no special zone)
- V_mid: the speed when ENTER is detected and when the next signal is red
- V_min: less used, it applies on a turntable and when PR2IN is detected.

Here is a flavour of speed control by Rocrail


So, in short, on a CS3, adjust only the maximum speed, the inertia curve (I use standard exponential) and the accel / brake delays. All the rest is to be set by Rocrail.
You may set a speed command from a block, using an ACTION, indicating the speed in percentage of the V_max and valid for ANY loco in the block (simply leave the LokID field blank and RR will do the rest.
Cheers
Jean
Cheers
Jean


Hi Jean,

As always, your explanation is very helpful!

I did some experiments last night and it all works well. My layout consists of the enter and in, the test locomotive stops where it should. I have 1 or 2 that only have 1 sensor, this one I need to make a little longer.

The change of speed setting makes the locomotive a lot more prototypical, really looks awesome.

Many thanks from down under!

Regards,

Eddie
Eddie
Perth 🇦🇺
Marklin | Roco | Piko
CS3+ & Rocrail
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