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Offline David Dewar  
#1 Posted : 17 April 2023 21:21:22(UTC)
David Dewar

Scotland   
Joined: 01/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 7,340
Location: Scotland
Hi I have several events using the CS3 PLus and all work bar one. On one line the loco picks up from a circuit track and does as required but the following two coaches which have sliders for lighting also receive the same command as the loco thus when leaving a station the loco starts then stops for the defined seconds when each coach passes the circuit track.
Clearly I am missing something as all other lines do not have a problem with the same set up.
I have checked the event and deleted it and started another with the same result. I have also changed locos and coaches but same happens.
I know I am missing something and grateful for any help.
Take care I like Marklin and will defend the worlds greatest model rail manufacturer.
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Offline JohnjeanB  
#2 Posted : 17 April 2023 22:12:18(UTC)
JohnjeanB

France   
Joined: 04/02/2011(UTC)
Posts: 3,114
Location: Paris, France
Hi David
You seem to be using slider-activated rails to trigger events. M track perhaps?

Using the full potential of a CS3 (occupation detection) you wouldn't have this problem unless M track.
With my first M-track train I liked these slider-activated rails but soon I discovered that with multiple sliders trains this was becoming a mess.

With a CS3 I don't know exactly how it is processed:
- start multiple execution of the same event after each detected slider
- start one event and interrupt it / restart it when the next slider triggers the event.

Not sure what the CS3 does here.

So - not sure here - but you may end with contradicting orders sent to your layout.

Conclusion:
- either you operate trains with one slider
- or you modify your layout to have occupation zones, the event being triggered EITHER when occupation starts OR when it stops. Your choice but alas not easy to do with M-track.
- an alternate solution is to inhibit the slider-operated rail when the first slider is detected (more wiring, more contact rails, additional relays). Of course in this case you need to add a contact rail elsewhere to stop the inhibition. Feasible, but a bit tricky.

Cheers
Jean
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Offline marklinist5999  
#3 Posted : 17 April 2023 22:16:25(UTC)
marklinist5999

United States   
Joined: 10/02/2021(UTC)
Posts: 3,117
Location: Michigan, Troy
Jean, so are the sliders not only repeating the events, but confusing the S-88 feedback as well? I think I'm going to add another contact track for double or triple events rather than try nesting two or three off of one with conditions and or delays. It does become complex. That way the delay is already in place in that the travel from one contact block to the next is more distance??
Offline David Dewar  
#4 Posted : 17 April 2023 23:22:30(UTC)
David Dewar

Scotland   
Joined: 01/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 7,340
Location: Scotland
Jean. C track with circuit tracks. Three other events with locos and coaches with sliders work fine it is just this one event that causes the problem.
I have run events for years and this is first time I have found sliders on coaches to also control the loco.
Take care I like Marklin and will defend the worlds greatest model rail manufacturer.
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Offline rhfil  
#5 Posted : 17 April 2023 23:55:07(UTC)
rhfil

United States   
Joined: 05/09/2014(UTC)
Posts: 425
Location: NEW HAMPSHIRE, Somersworth
You did not identify how your event is being activated. Unless you use the event record feature you have to remember that if you are using a sensor regardless of whether it is a contact track, circuit track or reed switch they are all merely dumb switches which will send the same signal to the S88 every time they are activated. For example, a circuit track will send the signal each time a slider crosses it in the proper direction and the CS3 will be triggered to act each time. One way to get around that is to set a delay for example which will prevent the signal from being sent until all possible activators have crossed the trigger. The other way is to use reed switches, a pain to use, and avoid the problem with the extra sliders.
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Offline JohnjeanB  
#6 Posted : 18 April 2023 00:02:42(UTC)
JohnjeanB

France   
Joined: 04/02/2011(UTC)
Posts: 3,114
Location: Paris, France
David I don't know what this special event does.
Some examples:
If such a track (24994, 24194, 24294) triggers a signal S1 to green by a train TA with multiple sliders.
If train TA stops at another signal but only the loco has crossed the contact track and starts much later, then the other sliders will trigger S1 again to green much after initially intended. This may be unwanted and make collisions.
On the other hand, if such a track is not near a signal (the train does not stop), then the problems are less likely to happen (you order signal S1 3 times to green within 2 seconds so no big deal)

If instead, such a track orders a light to be on (using a relay) then the light being on again will have no concsequences.


What I am trying to say is depending on the content of the event and the location of the contact track (near/before a signal or far away) the adverse effect of multi sliders will have consequences or not

On the other hand, using occupation zones, you don't have this issue ever.

Jean
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Offline rhfil  
#7 Posted : 18 April 2023 00:28:44(UTC)
rhfil

United States   
Joined: 05/09/2014(UTC)
Posts: 425
Location: NEW HAMPSHIRE, Somersworth
Possibly the events that do work have a delay which allows the the coach sliders to pass without the circuit track being activated.
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Offline David Dewar  
#8 Posted : 18 April 2023 12:45:50(UTC)
David Dewar

Scotland   
Joined: 01/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 7,340
Location: Scotland
Originally Posted by: rhfil Go to Quoted Post
Possibly the events that do work have a delay which allows the the coach sliders to pass without the circuit track being activated.


Hi. All you say in your two posts are correct and is how the event was set up. However I deleted the event replaced the circuit track and reset the loco. None of these alterations should have made any difference but when setting up the event again everything now works as it should. No idea what happened with this other than a Presierling came off the platform and made changes.
Many thanks for the comments.
All best
David
Take care I like Marklin and will defend the worlds greatest model rail manufacturer.
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Offline river6109  
#9 Posted : 18 April 2023 13:24:13(UTC)
river6109

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 14,712
Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
David, you better report him to the Preiser office or contact other family members, to see who's done it.

if you get no positive results you could engage Hercule Poirot, he should be able to get to the bottom of this.

John
https://www.youtube.com/river6109
https://www.youtube.com/6109river
5 years in Destruction mode
50 years in Repairing mode
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Offline rhfil  
#10 Posted : 18 April 2023 14:29:54(UTC)
rhfil

United States   
Joined: 05/09/2014(UTC)
Posts: 425
Location: NEW HAMPSHIRE, Somersworth
An event is sequential and if it is not sequencing as desired it is possible to observe it sequencing by activating it while seeing it on the CS3 screen. That allows you to see the actual "Event" in real time. That usually can indicate what the problem is. There is an adjustable time delay that the CS3 queries the S88 inputs. It is usually very small, fractions of a second, but can be increased.
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Offline David Dewar  
#11 Posted : 18 April 2023 14:42:47(UTC)
David Dewar

Scotland   
Joined: 01/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 7,340
Location: Scotland
Originally Posted by: rhfil Go to Quoted Post
An event is sequential and if it is not sequencing as desired it is possible to observe it sequencing by activating it while seeing it on the CS3 screen. That allows you to see the actual "Event" in real time. That usually can indicate what the problem is. There is an adjustable time delay that the CS3 queries the S88 inputs. It is usually very small, fractions of a second, but can be increased.


Thanks for that. Was not aware that that would have helped.
Take care I like Marklin and will defend the worlds greatest model rail manufacturer.
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