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Offline Chris6382chris  
#1 Posted : 15 December 2021 00:56:33(UTC)
Chris6382chris

United States   
Joined: 27/11/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,215
Location: Middle of the US
I am about to add a 7A booster (ESU) to my layout. I understand how to isolate the rails. But how do I prevent the slider on the engine or wagon from bridging both parts of the layout that are isolated from each other. I recall seeing some type of plastic rocker type insert that would raise the slider and then drop the slider thus avoiding both isolated parts of the layout from coming into contact with each other.

I don't know what it was called or if it had a part number. For those using a booster can you please tell me how you prevent shorts (is a short the correct word? Is it a short?) when the slider moves from one section to the other.

Thank you.

Chris
Offline H0  
#2 Posted : 15 December 2021 07:44:25(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Hi!
Originally Posted by: Chris6382chris Go to Quoted Post
But how do I prevent the slider on the engine or wagon from bridging both parts of the layout that are isolated from each other. [...]
For those using a booster can you please tell me how you prevent shorts (is a short the correct word? Is it a short?) when the slider moves from one section to the other.
There is no short if both sections receive the same digital signal (with correct polarity and similar voltage levels).

The items are called "centre-rail rockers". There are different numbers for C track, K track, M track.
You don't need them if a single digital controller (e.g. an ECoS) creates the digital signal for all parts of the layout.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline Chris6382chris  
#3 Posted : 15 December 2021 13:06:40(UTC)
Chris6382chris

United States   
Joined: 27/11/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,215
Location: Middle of the US
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Hi!
Originally Posted by: Chris6382chris Go to Quoted Post
But how do I prevent the slider on the engine or wagon from bridging both parts of the layout that are isolated from each other. [...]
For those using a booster can you please tell me how you prevent shorts (is a short the correct word? Is it a short?) when the slider moves from one section to the other.
There is no short if both sections receive the same digital signal (with correct polarity and similar voltage levels).

The items are called "centre-rail rockers". There are different numbers for C track, K track, M track.
You don't need them if a single digital controller (e.g. an ECoS) creates the digital signal for all parts of the layout.


Thank you Tom. This makes sense. I have operated my ECOS for maybe 10 years without a booster so now that I’m adding the extra power I just want to make sure I’m not missing anything and I do it correctly. Have a good day.
Offline Kiko  
#4 Posted : 16 December 2021 19:31:55(UTC)
Kiko

Canada   
Joined: 13/02/2017(UTC)
Posts: 55
Location: Ottawa, ON
Hello Chris,

As Tom mentioned, there is no need for "rockers". For nearly 15 years, I had one digital control station with multiple boosters (only the centre studs isolated) and never had any problems.

Cheers,
Andry
// Marklin HO K track; ECoS; TrainController Gold; Marklin & ESU decoders; Arduino controlled Switches, Semaphores & Accessories (DCC); Win 11 //
Offline Chris6382chris  
#5 Posted : 17 December 2021 12:48:30(UTC)
Chris6382chris

United States   
Joined: 27/11/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,215
Location: Middle of the US
Originally Posted by: Kiko Go to Quoted Post
Hello Chris,

As Tom mentioned, there is no need for "rockers". For nearly 15 years, I had one digital control station with multiple boosters (only the centre studs isolated) and never had any problems.

Cheers,


Thanks Kiko. So I run me switchpilots power off of the bus wires that provide track power from the ecos. So the four wires of the switchpilot are reduced to two (Both “O” wires are connected and both “B” wires are connected). Then I connect one “O” and one “B” each to the track power wires labeled “O” and “B”. So when connected to the track power I’m getting digital signal and power to my switchpilots. Very simple and easy wiring.

I am assuming when I install my booster, that part of my layout powered by the booster can have those switchpilots being connected to the track power in the same manner. Reduce the four wires to two and connect the two wires to the track power coming from the booster.

Am I missing anything?

Offline Kiko  
#6 Posted : 17 December 2021 15:10:53(UTC)
Kiko

Canada   
Joined: 13/02/2017(UTC)
Posts: 55
Location: Ottawa, ON
Hello Chris,

Not missing anything, but make sure that the switchpilots are powered by the same booster that powers that part of the layout. This will re-distribute the loads away from the ECoS and will keep things isolated.
Andry
// Marklin HO K track; ECoS; TrainController Gold; Marklin & ESU decoders; Arduino controlled Switches, Semaphores & Accessories (DCC); Win 11 //
Offline Chris6382chris  
#7 Posted : 17 December 2021 18:46:40(UTC)
Chris6382chris

United States   
Joined: 27/11/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,215
Location: Middle of the US
Originally Posted by: Kiko Go to Quoted Post
Hello Chris,

Not missing anything, but make sure that the switchpilots are powered by the same booster that powers that part of the layout. This will re-distribute the loads away from the ECoS and will keep things isolated.


Kiko:

Thanks. Yes I plan on doing that. All switchpilots serving zone 1 will be powered by zone 1. All switchpilots serving zone 2 will be powered by a booster serving zone 2.

Chris
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Offline Chris6382chris  
#8 Posted : 21 December 2021 14:22:08(UTC)
Chris6382chris

United States   
Joined: 27/11/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,215
Location: Middle of the US
Just a quick update. New ESU 7A booster installed. Layout is divided into three sections. The main layout and staging in the basement is zone 1. The rural and mountain section in the spare bedroom is zone 2. Zone 3 includes the roundhouse and engine area. Zone 1 is on the ECOS and zones 2 and 3 are on the 7A booster. Switchpilots are powered by both the ECOS and 7A booster as appropriate.

It was a simple installation and all is working fine and my ECOS temp have dropped as the internal booster isn’t working as hard.

Appreciate all the comments.

Chris
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Offline Chris6382chris  
#9 Posted : 23 December 2021 05:07:39(UTC)
Chris6382chris

United States   
Joined: 27/11/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,215
Location: Middle of the US
Originally Posted by: Kiko Go to Quoted Post
Hello Chris,

Not missing anything, but make sure that the switchpilots are powered by the same booster that powers that part of the layout. This will re-distribute the loads away from the ECoS and will keep things isolated.


Kiko:

Quick follow up question. What does your available amperage read for your additional booster? When I look at the internal and external amperage use I see the Internal booster showing up to maybe 3700 MA. When I look at the 7A booster below the internal booster it reads maybe 700 MA. I have the new booster set for 5 A. Everything is working fine. It just seems odd to see such a low reading. Any insight?
Offline Bigdaddynz  
#10 Posted : 23 December 2021 06:40:18(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,661
Location: New Zealand
A 7 amp booster?? Even Marklin doesn't recommend you use a 5 amp booster on an H0 layout. Five amps is for 1 Gauge.

If you're using a 7 amp booster on a H0 layout you'd better be sure of a few things

- For 5 amps Marklin recommends all of your feeder wires have a minimum cross section of .75mm. For 7 amps I would think you'd need at least 1.0mm. The thicker cable is needed to handle the current and ensure that the booster and controller can properly detect a short. Otherwise the booster will not shut down when there's a short and will most likely weld whatever is causing the short to your track. Not good for expensive locos

- Make sure there's no voltage drop around your layout, you should have a solid 18v all around. Add extra feeder wires if you don't. If you have low voltage, the booster will attempt to compensate by pumping out more current which could cook something!
Offline Chris6382chris  
#11 Posted : 23 December 2021 13:35:15(UTC)
Chris6382chris

United States   
Joined: 27/11/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,215
Location: Middle of the US
Originally Posted by: Bigdaddynz Go to Quoted Post
A 7 amp booster?? Even Marklin doesn't recommend you use a 5 amp booster on an H0 layout. Five amps is for 1 Gauge.

If you're using a 7 amp booster on a H0 layout you'd better be sure of a few things

- For 5 amps Marklin recommends all of your feeder wires have a minimum cross section of .75mm. For 7 amps I would think you'd need at least 1.0mm. The thicker cable is needed to handle the current and ensure that the booster and controller can properly detect a short. Otherwise the booster will not shut down when there's a short and will most likely weld whatever is causing the short to your track. Not good for expensive locos

- Make sure there's no voltage drop around your layout, you should have a solid 18v all around. Add extra feeder wires if you don't. If you have low voltage, the booster will attempt to compensate by pumping out more current which could cook something!


While it’s a 7A booster the Ecos has the option of setting how much you make available to your layout. So I have it set for 5A ( was even thinking of dropping it down to 4A). The Ecos built in booster is 5A. I have both the the ECOs and booster set to provide 17.7 volts of track current. So all is good and safe and setup as recommended by ESU and Marklin. And everything is running well and nothing is melting and I am experiencing no voltage drop. To be clear both the ecos is indicating a track voltage of 17.7 for both internal and external booster.

My question refers to the ecos display which shows what your track voltage is set at ( again shows 17.7 volts for both internal and external booster) and the amperage available and in use for each booster. While my internal booster (the ecos) shows about 3.5 amps available and about 2.7A in use, my external booster shows about .7 amps available with about .5 amps in use. I’d be curious to hear from those with an ecos if their display shows the same thing.

The external booster is providing power to my engine area and mountain portion of the layout. So while it has maybe 20 locomotives on it only a couple engines are in shuttle mode, an engine might be running in the engine area, and the train on the mainline will run through it as the train goes around the layout.

Again I’ve experienced no issues but the reading on the ecos display panel seem odd by not reflecting the total 5A available.

I’ll ask the EsU forum also but thought I’d mention it on here since we have been chatting about this topic.

Thanks and thanks fir all the engagement on this topic. I appreciate everyone’s knowledge on this topic.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Chris6382chris
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