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Offline anthpao  
#1 Posted : 23 October 2019 11:40:09(UTC)
anthpao

Greece   
Joined: 20/01/2010(UTC)
Posts: 110
Location: Thessaloniki, Greece
I recently bought a Vectron from Marklin and I want to add "Long distance lights" and cab lights. Before I try to replace the decoder with a Loksound 5 that has all the required Aux outputs on the decoder's PCB, I tried to use the existing one. As you can see in the picture below there are some outputs on the main PCB.

IMG_3123.JPG

In RED circles you can see the outputs. AB6 and AB7 are intented to be high beam lights and the pads for the extra LEDs, D1, D2, D5, D6 through the resistors R1,R2,R5,R6 for Cab lights. As you can see on the PCB in blue circles there are some missing transistors.

I tried BC847 NPN and BC857 PNP transistors but I had no luck.
Is there someone that had made such a modification to help me?
Offline ktsolias  
#2 Posted : 23 October 2019 12:18:39(UTC)
ktsolias

Greece   
Joined: 01/05/2016(UTC)
Posts: 407
Location: Athens
This PCB is used for other locos as well...

With mSd3 decoders there are two more AUX available on a typical Vectron. (May be this is not your case)

All AUX on an mSD3 decoder are amplified. No need for transistors

The outputs need function mapping to work

If you can't do all these yourself give it to somebody who knows how to do this.

To put a new 100 Euro decoder for in a Vectron is too much

Costas
Offline H0  
#3 Posted : 23 October 2019 12:37:59(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 13,533
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: ktsolias Go to Quoted Post
All AUX on an mSD3 decoder are amplified. No need for transistors
Märklin uses transistors to turn lights off when F6 and/or F8 are on.
Those transistors are not normally needed when modifying locos.

Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by H0
Offline Bart  
#4 Posted : 23 October 2019 12:38:48(UTC)
Bart

Netherlands   
Joined: 13/05/2002(UTC)
Posts: 639
You may want to check which 21MTC connector pin leads to the transistor pads. As AUX3 and 4 decoder outputs usually are amplified with Mä decoders, I would be surprised if you would require amplifiers.
*Bart
Offline H0  
#5 Posted : 23 October 2019 12:42:58(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 13,533
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: Bart Go to Quoted Post
As AUX3 and 4 decoder outputs usually are amplified with Mä decoders, I would be surprised if you would require amplifiers.
Some Märklin decoders do not amplify AUX3/4.
Some loco boards include inverters or logic gates, not amplifiers.

Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
Offline Bart  
#6 Posted : 23 October 2019 15:11:06(UTC)
Bart

Netherlands   
Joined: 13/05/2002(UTC)
Posts: 639
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Some Märklin decoders do not amplify AUX3/4.
Some loco boards include inverters or logic gates, not amplifiers.

All true, but this board does not include either, as the pads are unused.
To add high beam lights, you would just want to identify unused AUX pins.
*Bart
Offline anthpao  
#7 Posted : 23 October 2019 20:37:22(UTC)
anthpao

Greece   
Joined: 20/01/2010(UTC)
Posts: 110
Location: Thessaloniki, Greece
You are all right. I forgot to mention that this loco has a decoder with six amplified outputs.
So LF=Front white lights, LR=Rear white lights, AUX1=rear red lights, AUX2=front red lights (or the other way I do not remeber). So I have two more (AUX3 and AUX4) for four outputs (High beams front/rear and cab lights front/rear). But if I use the transistors then I could save two outputs with combination with LF and LR.
Offline H0  
#8 Posted : 24 October 2019 07:48:01(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 13,533
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: anthpao Go to Quoted Post
But if I use the transistors then I could save two outputs with combination with LF and LR.
I don't see how this would free two decoder outputs without impairing functionality.
You can save one output for long-distance headlights.
You can save another output if you do not need the "red lights only" option or the "double A" option.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
Offline Bart  
#9 Posted : 24 October 2019 12:09:46(UTC)
Bart

Netherlands   
Joined: 13/05/2002(UTC)
Posts: 639
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: anthpao Go to Quoted Post
But if I use the transistors then I could save two outputs with combination with LF and LR.
I don't see how this would free two decoder outputs without impairing functionality.
You can save one output for long-distance headlights.
You can save another output if you do not need the "red lights only" option or the "double A" option.

My guess:
One output for high beam (both sides), and one output for cab lights (both sides). F0v and F0r each activate 2 transistors which pass the high beam and cab light output (if switched on) to the correct side.
*Bart
Offline river6109  
#10 Posted : 24 October 2019 12:35:04(UTC)
river6109

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 12,622
Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
As you highlighted the Aux functions, add the same led and resistor (same value) to the soldering pads, all you need than is find out which Aux function is which., you also may need 2 resistors in the middle of the PCB but it looks like they're just there to link the 2 soldering pads.
Of course you have to check whether these leds are meant for high beam and interior cab lights

John
https://www.youtube.com/river6109
https://www.youtube.com/6109river
5 years in Destruction mode
50 years in Repairing mode
Offline g-gekko  
#11 Posted : 05 November 2019 18:49:28(UTC)
g-gekko

Norway   
Joined: 05/08/2015(UTC)
Posts: 5
Location: Oppland
I do not have any locomotives with this PCB, so I can only tell you what I think based on the picture. I will recommend that you measure the connections with a voltmeter.

Since the gate connector on t3 seems to be connected directly to the AUX4 pin on the mtc21 contact and the source of T1 is connected to light direction rear. I suspect that you should try to add P channel mosfets to the transistor pads. T3 and T4 seems to be connected to AUX4 - D1,D2,D5 and D6. T1 and T2 possibly connected to AUX3 - AB6 and AB7. R7 might be a resistor for AUX3. R8 is difficult to say anything about, but it might be connected to AUX3.

If you configure aux3 and aux4 to logical outputs and apply the required components, you should get power at those ports on the side that have power in the grey cable (A6/A7).

R10 and R11 seems to be pads for 0 resistors if you need to change direction of the motor, so they should not be necessary for this convertion.
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