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Offline amfisher102  
#1 Posted : 18 August 2019 22:12:07(UTC)
amfisher102

United States   
Joined: 21/10/2017(UTC)
Posts: 16
Location: Ridgefield, Wa.
Hello all,

Background: I am preparing to install the Faller Crossing Gate 120171 System. Question: How does one secure the middle conducting wire to the C track Stud ? Plus the wire is short of the full length of the "double rail, double track" mid-track mounting plastic piece described in the instructions.

FWIW I have a single main line layout with 9 signal controlled blocks and the CS3+....what a system!....I have been able to run 7 trains with ease.

Thank you for any discussion and help with this small dilemma....alan
Offline TEEWolf  
#2 Posted : 19 August 2019 00:11:37(UTC)
TEEWolf

Germany   
Joined: 01/06/2016(UTC)
Posts: 1,866
Originally Posted by: amfisher102 Go to Quoted Post
Hello all,

Background: I am preparing to install the Faller Crossing Gate 120171 System. Question: How does one secure the middle conducting wire to the C track Stud ? Plus the wire is short of the full length of the "double rail, double track" mid-track mounting plastic piece described in the instructions.

FWIW I have a single main line layout with 9 signal controlled blocks and the CS3+....what a system!....I have been able to run 7 trains with ease.

Thank you for any discussion and help with this small dilemma....alan


I do not have this railroad crossing, but it looks very interesting. Faller writes at his homepage it useable for all types of tracks.

https://www.faller.de/gb...ay-crossing-sid4166.html

Here I found a manual (beside German also in English) which shows and describes the usage of C-tracks (see page 22/23 of this manual) for this railroad crossing very detailed.

https://www.libble.de/fa...gang/p/710659/?page=0024

But at a YouTube video in German it was recommended to work very, very precisely.
CS 3 is a controller system from Märklin - not a central station.
Offline amfisher102  
#3 Posted : 19 August 2019 00:59:43(UTC)
amfisher102

United States   
Joined: 21/10/2017(UTC)
Posts: 16
Location: Ridgefield, Wa.
Thank you for the URLs.....I have the instructions. ...but the main problem at this point is trying to "connect" the wire in the middle track plastic insert to the metal stud of the C track...which will not accept soldering. ...

Indeed...this is a kit requiring significant precision !

Offline TEEWolf  
#4 Posted : 19 August 2019 02:08:59(UTC)
TEEWolf

Germany   
Joined: 01/06/2016(UTC)
Posts: 1,866
Originally Posted by: amfisher102 Go to Quoted Post
Thank you for the URLs.....I have the instructions. ...but the main problem at this point is trying to "connect" the wire in the middle track plastic insert to the metal stud of the C track...which will not accept soldering. ...

Indeed...this is a kit requiring significant precision !



I assumed you have the Faller instructions, so I added this libble manual. But is the one from libble.de not more extensive? As I understand the drawings from libble, you have to glew into these plastic strips a middle conductor strip first and then glew this plastic strip onto the C-track with these spacers. Sorry that I do not have the kit in front of me, so I cannot see where this middle conductor wire is connected to the current.

I am confused by these roadway wires. Is this Faller description for installing this crossing for railroad tracks only and/or for the Faller car system too?

On the other hand Faller writes, if you are missing any part (what can happen) you should write them an e-mail. It could be an important part may be missing.
CS 3 is a controller system from Märklin - not a central station.
Offline Minok  
#5 Posted : 19 August 2019 21:21:47(UTC)
Minok

United States   
Joined: 15/10/2006(UTC)
Posts: 2,017
Location: Washington, Pacific Northwest
What I gather from the instruction PDF from Faller, you glue the wire for the center conductor into the groove running lengthwise down the track-center-pavement piece(s). [pdf pg 8/28, step d - and onward for the various variations depending on type of track and single or double track configuration]

But as you know it doesn't show how to connect it to the center conductors of the track. My "guess" (not having the kit), I assume one drills a small hole where the wires go straight down at the ends of the center grey plastic pavement, and thus run them down under the trackbed, and then solder a wire to those wires under the trackbed and attache them other end of the electrical wiring to a center conductor tab under the c-track. (ie not connecting to the center studs, but the center power signal under the c-track roadbed).


Toys of tin and wood rule!
---
My Layout Thread on marklin-users.net: InterCity 1-3-4
My YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/Minok1217/
Offline amfisher102  
#6 Posted : 19 August 2019 23:32:50(UTC)
amfisher102

United States   
Joined: 21/10/2017(UTC)
Posts: 16
Location: Ridgefield, Wa.
Originally Posted by: Minok Go to Quoted Post
What I gather from the instruction PDF from Faller, you glue the wire for the center conductor into the groove running lengthwise down the track-center-pavement piece(s). [pdf pg 8/28, step d - and onward for the various variations depending on type of track and single or double track configuration]

But as you know it doesn't show how to connect it to the center conductors of the track. My "guess" (not having the kit), I assume one drills a small hole where the wires go straight down at the ends of the center grey plastic pavement, and thus run them down under the trackbed, and then solder a wire to those wires under the trackbed and attache them other end of the electrical wiring to a center conductor tab under the c-track. (ie not connecting to the center studs, but the center power signal under the c-track roadbed).




Thank you for your suggestion. I tried to solder the wire to the under carriage of the C track ---to the middle current carrying "blade" which runs the entire length of the track piece. ...but it would not accept solder either. ...I may have to try to solder the wire to a small piece of 26G conducting wire used throughout the layout and solder the other end of it to the "hot" spade at the bottom of the track.

The other piece of the problem is that the wires provided which are glued into the groove in the middle section of the C track do not extend the entire length of the plastic piece. I am now searching for solid core wire ...prob. a 28G wire as a substitute.....Hard to believe that Faller hasn't solved this issue before..their kits are really beautiful...I have dozens!

Thanks again for your help.....alan
Offline Minok  
#7 Posted : 19 August 2019 23:48:33(UTC)
Minok

United States   
Joined: 15/10/2006(UTC)
Posts: 2,017
Location: Washington, Pacific Northwest
Yeah, you will have to solder a normal small gauge stranded insulated wire to the end of the kit center conductor wire under the c-track, then run it to the spade connector at one or the other end that is the center conductor. No attaching it to the center conductor black stuff... those are not designed to be attached to.

For the length of the center part - did you trim it as the instructions indicate? The center part is supposed to have a section of its length cut out (not used) for C-Track (PDF pg 7/28). If you don't cut out the section, then the length of the center stuff will be longer than Faller intended.

Capture.PNG
Toys of tin and wood rule!
---
My Layout Thread on marklin-users.net: InterCity 1-3-4
My YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/Minok1217/
Offline amfisher102  
#8 Posted : 19 August 2019 23:59:25(UTC)
amfisher102

United States   
Joined: 21/10/2017(UTC)
Posts: 16
Location: Ridgefield, Wa.
Originally Posted by: Minok Go to Quoted Post
Yeah, you will have to solder a normal small gauge stranded insulated wire to the end of the kit center conductor wire under the c-track, then run it to the spade connector at one or the other end that is the center conductor. No attaching it to the center conductor black stuff... those are not designed to be attached to.

For the length of the center part - did you trim it as the instructions indicate? The center part is supposed to have a section of its length cut out (not used) for C-Track (PDF pg 7/28). If you don't cut out the section, then the length of the center stuff will be longer than Faller intended.

Capture.PNG


Reducing the size of the middle piece is supposed to accommodate a "single track" width of the entry and exit ramps, not the "double wide" or "two track" variant. ...as indicated on pages 6 & 7....On page 8 the middle piece runs the entire length of the "two track" variant .....

I'll experiment some more to make certain that my statement is accurate, but that is the way I read the instructions....

Thanks again for your input...alan
Offline Minok  
#9 Posted : 20 August 2019 00:11:58(UTC)
Minok

United States   
Joined: 15/10/2006(UTC)
Posts: 2,017
Location: Washington, Pacific Northwest
Your right; page 6 has it for the two lands of road traffic, where its the full length. So then I'd assume the wire they provide as the center conductor is long enough that you can insert it and bend it down at a 90 degree angle at the ends into the small notch, and it extend down into the track.

Or is the design such that one wraps the ends UNDER and back around the bottom of the center section and then the wire there, by pressure, is held to a center stud on either end of the center studs? Not having the kit that might also be an option. How is the grey plastic 'concrete' middle section attached to the top of the C-track in the kit? Does it just clip in? That is a mystery.

Capture.PNG
Toys of tin and wood rule!
---
My Layout Thread on marklin-users.net: InterCity 1-3-4
My YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/Minok1217/
Offline TEEWolf  
#10 Posted : 20 August 2019 01:34:28(UTC)
TEEWolf

Germany   
Joined: 01/06/2016(UTC)
Posts: 1,866
Originally Posted by: amfisher102 Go to Quoted Post

The other piece of the problem is that the wires provided which are glued into the groove in the middle section of the C track do not extend the entire length of the plastic piece. I am now searching for solid core wire ...prob. a 28G wire as a substitute.....Hard to believe that Faller hasn't solved this issue before..their kits are really beautiful...I have dozens!

Thanks again for your help.....alan


But this is the point. Faller wrote sending them an e-mail, if you miss any material, which is possible. Obviously the contact wire is not long enough. Faller offers such a special contact wire for its car system. Why shoudn't this not be usable for this crossing section as well?

https://www.faller.de/gb...ontact-wire-sid9058.html
CS 3 is a controller system from Märklin - not a central station.
Offline amfisher102  
#11 Posted : 20 August 2019 02:02:15(UTC)
amfisher102

United States   
Joined: 21/10/2017(UTC)
Posts: 16
Location: Ridgefield, Wa.
Originally Posted by: Minok Go to Quoted Post
Your right; page 6 has it for the two lands of road traffic, where its the full length. So then I'd assume the wire they provide as the center conductor is long enough that you can insert it and bend it down at a 90 degree angle at the ends into the small notch, and it extend down into the track.

Or is the design such that one wraps the ends UNDER and back around the bottom of the center section and then the wire there, by pressure, is held to a center stud on either end of the center studs? Not having the kit that might also be an option. How is the grey plastic 'concrete' middle section attached to the top of the C-track in the kit? Does it just clip in? That is a mystery.

Capture.PNG


Each mid-track plastic piece is 14.4 cm long, and is glued to the C track. Each wire, one per plastic mid-track piece, is 9.1 cm long! ...so to cross two lanes of traffic......doh...not long enough for the wire to conduct along with plastic mid-track inserts.

Forgot to mention that I could not make the wire insert accept a solder bead either! ....what a dilemma!

I think the answer at this point it to buy wire ..approx 28-29 G and see if can solder it to the underside of the C track and run a loco over the track to see if it conducts. Otherwise, I am out of ideas....still can't believe that Faller would make it this complicated, ....or I am really missing a vital piece of info...

I'lll keep trying...and if I have an answer, I'll post it. Somewhere, someone has solved this problem...thank you, once again...alan
Offline TEEWolf  
#12 Posted : 20 August 2019 02:22:22(UTC)
TEEWolf

Germany   
Joined: 01/06/2016(UTC)
Posts: 1,866
Originally Posted by: amfisher102 Go to Quoted Post

Otherwise, I am out of ideas....still can't believe that Faller would make it this complicated, ....or I am really missing a vital piece of info...


Confused Confused Confused And why don't you want to send Faller an e-mail as Faller requests you, his customer, if running into trouble??? I think Faller is well aware about this complex and filigree construction.


Originally Posted by: amfisher102 Go to Quoted Post
I'lll keep trying...and if I have an answer, I'll post it. Somewhere, someone has solved this problem...thank you, once again...alan


Again:
https://www.faller.de/gb...ontact-wire-sid9058.html
CS 3 is a controller system from Märklin - not a central station.
Offline Minok  
#13 Posted : 20 August 2019 04:37:54(UTC)
Minok

United States   
Joined: 15/10/2006(UTC)
Posts: 2,017
Location: Washington, Pacific Northwest
Likely because it will take weeks to get a reply from the company if they are anything like Märklin or ESU or Roco, while a query here may reveal a solution in a day. No harm on checking here first to see if one missed something on the instructions or to verify a missing or wrong part before formulating a question to the manufacturer.

Plus if he posts the discussion here more folks than him will benefit from the discussion.
Toys of tin and wood rule!
---
My Layout Thread on marklin-users.net: InterCity 1-3-4
My YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/Minok1217/
Offline PeFu  
#14 Posted : 20 August 2019 06:45:44(UTC)
PeFu

Sweden   
Joined: 30/08/2002(UTC)
Posts: 638
I’m using (only) the track inserts from this kit, and the Faller Car System contact wire for powering the trains. This can be seen here (in the initial and final scene):



The wire is pretty ”stiff” (almost like a piano wire), and I have a 90 degree bend on both ends, which goes under the layout where I connect it to a powering cable.

I added a little Plastic Padding on both sides of the train powering wire and on top of the car contact wires. Everything carefully grinded and finally painted. Some grinding of the train powering wire is required...

I’m using K tracks, but I would have used a similar solution for C tracks (on which drilling small holes maybe would be required).

The Great Krok!
Inspired by Swiss railways (SBB/BLS/SOB), C and K track, CS2, TrainController Gold V9
thanks 6 users liked this useful post by PeFu
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