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Offline Thewolf  
#51 Posted : 06 March 2019 23:59:29(UTC)
Thewolf

Canada   
Joined: 08/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 2,035
Location: Saint Mathias dur Richelieu-Canada
- a single track with wiring ''B'' and ''O'' and a switch for the booster section 2

- a single track with wiring ''B'' and ''O'' and a switch for the booster section 3

- the''0'' between boosters 2 and 3 is connected together as well as with the''0'' of booster 1 and cs2

- the control leds of the boosters 2 and 3 shine.....

but the cs2 does not operate the 2 switches


I think it's no longer a wiring problem ....but a booster problem

Thewolf

Project The Richelieu Valley Railway-CS2-Track C- Itrain-Digital
Offline Thewolf  
#52 Posted : 07 March 2019 14:23:44(UTC)
Thewolf

Canada   
Joined: 08/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 2,035
Location: Saint Mathias dur Richelieu-Canada
Hi everybody Cool

This morning this will be my last test : the 60145 terminal 2

I will connect booster 2 and 3 to terminal 1 which works with booster 1.

if booster 2 and 3 work, it's a problem of 60145 terminal 2

Have a nice day

Serge
Project The Richelieu Valley Railway-CS2-Track C- Itrain-Digital
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Thewolf
Offline Thewolf  
#53 Posted : 07 March 2019 17:21:42(UTC)
Thewolf

Canada   
Joined: 08/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 2,035
Location: Saint Mathias dur Richelieu-Canada
After several days, I found the flaw.

Terminal 2 60145 is not working properly.

Booster 1, 2 and 3 work correctly with terminal 1

The cs2 operates the switches

I will change the location of the elements and place only one terminal.

I'm also going to change the separation of the layout.

Terminal 2 is going to be forgotten: it's going to be sent back to Mike. He'll do what he wants with it: feed if he wants.

Have a nice day

Thewolf
Project The Richelieu Valley Railway-CS2-Track C- Itrain-Digital
thanks 2 users liked this useful post by Thewolf
Offline Crazy Harry  
#54 Posted : 07 March 2019 18:09:35(UTC)
Crazy Harry

Canada   
Joined: 18/11/2008(UTC)
Posts: 477
Location: Oakville, Ontario
Glad you figured out your problem. Unfortunately, it did take a long time and caused some stress.

Harold.
Offline Thewolf  
#55 Posted : 07 March 2019 18:58:48(UTC)
Thewolf

Canada   
Joined: 08/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 2,035
Location: Saint Mathias dur Richelieu-Canada
Originally Posted by: Crazy Harry Go to Quoted Post
Glad you figured out your problem. Unfortunately, it did take a long time and caused some stress.

Harold.


Hi Harold Cool

Anyone who claims to find a problem in the digital railway in 5 minutes can only be a liar.

I know from experience that you have to consider all the possibilities of failure and it takes time, a lot of time and...especially calm.

The digital is complex and terribly delicate... especially with these osties de calisse de tabarnak of sockets and wire 0.14mm2.

At least it has the advantage of calming me down, although sometimes I want to throw everything out the window.

I continue the job under ....this grrrr table

Thewolf

Project The Richelieu Valley Railway-CS2-Track C- Itrain-Digital
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Thewolf
Offline TEEWolf  
#56 Posted : 07 March 2019 20:08:52(UTC)
TEEWolf


Joined: 01/06/2016(UTC)
Posts: 2,465
Originally Posted by: Thewolf Go to Quoted Post
However, I wonder: Confused

could the distance between the different boosters play a role?Bored

Boosters 2 and 3 are placed 250cm from the second terminal 60145 which itself is placed more than 360cm from the first 60145.

Booster 1 is placed 200 cm from terminal 1

Confused Confused

Serge


Yes, the distance will be a problem and has an effect on the operational reliability. Hence Märklin recommends a maximum of 100 m lenght by a minimum of 30 devices at the CAN bus main lines (there is a CAN bus high and CAN bus low. At the end both lines are connected and terminated by a 120 Ohm resistor). The length of the stub to a device shall have a maximum lenght of 2 meters. Dr. Stefan Krauß depicts it on his website and articles about the CAN bus as well. To achieve an operational reliability he recommends to follow Märklin's guidelines, even it may be possible these guidlines may be exceeded by facts sometimes.

Because of these guidelines Märklin offers all its various cables for CAN bus devcies with a maximum lenght of 2 meters. How did you achieve the lenghts of 3,6 m or 2,5 m?
Offline Thewolf  
#57 Posted : 07 March 2019 20:37:38(UTC)
Thewolf

Canada   
Joined: 08/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 2,035
Location: Saint Mathias dur Richelieu-Canada
Originally Posted by: TEEWolf Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Thewolf Go to Quoted Post
However, I wonder: Confused

could the distance between the different boosters play a role?Bored

Boosters 2 and 3 are placed 250cm from the second terminal 60145 which itself is placed more than 360cm from the first 60145.

Booster 1 is placed 200 cm from terminal 1

Confused Confused

Serge


Yes, the distance will be a problem and has an effect on the operational reliability. Hence Märklin recommends a maximum of 100 m lenght by a minimum of 30 devices at the CAN bus main lines (there is a CAN bus high and CAN bus low. At the end both lines are connected and terminated by a 120 Ohm resistor). The length of the stub to a device shall have a maximum lenght of 2 meters. Dr. Stefan Krauß depicts it on his website and articles about the CAN bus as well. To achieve an operational reliability he recommends to follow Märklin's guidelines, even it may be possible these guidlines may be exceeded by facts sometimes.

Because of these guidelines Märklin offers all its various cables for CAN bus devcies with a maximum lenght of 2 meters. How did you achieve the lenghts of 3,6 m or 2,5 m?


Wolfgang hi Cool

Have you read that the problem of the boosters2 and 3 is solved?

Have you read that I'm repositioning the elements?

So the distances for which I was wondering are no longer a source of questioning Cool

Have a nice evening Cool

Thewolf
Project The Richelieu Valley Railway-CS2-Track C- Itrain-Digital
Offline Minok  
#58 Posted : 07 March 2019 20:40:23(UTC)
Minok

United States   
Joined: 15/10/2006(UTC)
Posts: 2,311
Location: Washington, Pacific Northwest
Just a clarifying comment on a very early post in this thread on voltage measurements taken with a MAS830B (a digital multimeter to measure voltages).
These devices by themselves don't give you an accurate reading of the voltage levels on the track because of the square wave digital signal data.
If taking a DC measurement, you will likely get an average voltage (and as the digital signal has the voltage moving up and down to encode the digital data on top of the total amplitude actual voltage level, your will get a much lower voltage reading than it really is).
The AC measurement setting is generally configured to give you AC voltages in the 50-60Hz range of frequencies and of sinusoidal waveform. Again the digital square wave signal nature will not give you a proper voltage reading. You either need to put a circuit between the track and your multi-meter terminals to filter out the digital data so you read the DC level, or use an oscilloscope to see the waveform and view the voltage.
Toys of tin and wood rule!
---
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thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Minok
Offline Thewolf  
#59 Posted : 07 March 2019 20:48:36(UTC)
Thewolf

Canada   
Joined: 08/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 2,035
Location: Saint Mathias dur Richelieu-Canada
Originally Posted by: Minok Go to Quoted Post
Just a clarifying comment on a very early post in this thread on voltage measurements taken with a MAS830B (a digital multimeter to measure voltages).
These devices by themselves don't give you an accurate reading of the voltage levels on the track because of the square wave digital signal data.
If taking a DC measurement, you will likely get an average voltage (and as the digital signal has the voltage moving up and down to encode the digital data on top of the total amplitude actual voltage level, your will get a much lower voltage reading than it really is).
The AC measurement setting is generally configured to give you AC voltages in the 50-60Hz range of frequencies and of sinusoidal waveform. Again the digital square wave signal nature will not give you a proper voltage reading. You either need to put a circuit between the track and your multi-meter terminals to filter out the digital data so you read the DC level, or use an oscilloscope to see the waveform and view the voltage.


Thank you Mino Cool

I didn't know that.

In other words, I should change my multimeter

Thewolf
Project The Richelieu Valley Railway-CS2-Track C- Itrain-Digital
Offline TEEWolf  
#60 Posted : 07 March 2019 20:59:32(UTC)
TEEWolf


Joined: 01/06/2016(UTC)
Posts: 2,465
Originally Posted by: Thewolf Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Minok Go to Quoted Post
Just a clarifying comment on a very early post in this thread on voltage measurements taken with a MAS830B (a digital multimeter to measure voltages).
These devices by themselves don't give you an accurate reading of the voltage levels on the track because of the square wave digital signal data.
If taking a DC measurement, you will likely get an average voltage (and as the digital signal has the voltage moving up and down to encode the digital data on top of the total amplitude actual voltage level, your will get a much lower voltage reading than it really is).
The AC measurement setting is generally configured to give you AC voltages in the 50-60Hz range of frequencies and of sinusoidal waveform. Again the digital square wave signal nature will not give you a proper voltage reading. You either need to put a circuit between the track and your multi-meter terminals to filter out the digital data so you read the DC level, or use an oscilloscope to see the waveform and view the voltage.


Thank you Mino Cool

I didn't know that.

In other words, I should change my multimeter

Thewolf


Not only changing buying an oscilloscope. But as you wrote, you are not Croesus .......Laugh
Offline Purellum  
#61 Posted : 07 March 2019 22:27:05(UTC)
Purellum

Denmark   
Joined: 08/11/2005(UTC)
Posts: 3,505
Location: Mullerup, 4200 Slagelse
Cool

Originally Posted by: Thewolf Go to Quoted Post
In other words, I should change my multimeter


I don't think you need it, as long as you remember that you readings are not accurate. BigGrin

Compare the readings on your CS ( 18,xxV ) with the readings on your multi-meter ( 12,xxV ) and just remember this factor.

If you want a better multi-meter, it doesn't have to be expensive, it just have to be able to measure "true RMS".

It should be in the specifications.

These should all fulfill your needs: https://www.ebay.com/sch...om=R40&_nkw=true+rms

Some of them are probably cheap sh**; but OK for low voltage BigGrin

Per.

Cool
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