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Issue Brand New AE 610 508-4 locomotive not working - StarterSet 29484 - AE 610 508-4 MFX locomotive
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Offline Asif  
#1 Posted : 17 March 2018 08:07:03(UTC)
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Asif

India   
Joined: 17/03/2018(UTC)
Posts: 8
Location: Maharashtra, Mumbai
Bought a brand new starter set 29484, Unfortunately it worked only for one round or so and suddenly the locomotive stopped on the Mobile station 2, i see a msg which appears briefly as " Warning Message" Missing Confirmation from the MFX loco" that's its - it does move , no sound , no lights .... I checked the voltage on the track everything seems to be fine ... Has any one faced this ... ? What could be the problem.

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Offline RayF  
#2 Posted : 17 March 2018 09:58:49(UTC)
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RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,839
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
This means that the MS2 is not receiving the return signals from the loco. When it happens to me it is because the loco is on a dead section of track. Do all your other locos run OK on the track?
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
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Offline Asif  
#3 Posted : 17 March 2018 10:54:44(UTC)
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Asif

India   
Joined: 17/03/2018(UTC)
Posts: 8
Location: Maharashtra, Mumbai
Originally Posted by: RayF Go to Quoted Post
This means that the MS2 is not receiving the return signals from the loco. When it happens to me it is because the loco is on a dead section of track. Do all your other locos run OK on the track?


Thanks for your prompt response RayF - this is my first Model Train set ... hence i only have this locomotive.
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Offline Goofy  
#4 Posted : 17 March 2018 11:24:05(UTC)
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Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 9,013
Originally Posted by: RayF Go to Quoted Post
This means that the MS2 is not receiving the return signals from the loco. When it happens to me it is because the loco is on a dead section of track. Do all your other locos run OK on the track?


It´s also possible default with the decoder in the locomotive.
TS did wrote track power is okey and the locomotive does move...but no sounds...no lights. Confused
H0
DCC = Digital Command Control
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Offline RayF  
#5 Posted : 17 March 2018 13:46:26(UTC)
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RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,839
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
Can you clarify whether the loco moves or not? Your original post is not clear on this point.
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
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Offline Asif  
#6 Posted : 17 March 2018 14:35:28(UTC)
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Asif

India   
Joined: 17/03/2018(UTC)
Posts: 8
Location: Maharashtra, Mumbai
Originally Posted by: RayF Go to Quoted Post
Can you clarify whether the loco moves or not? Your original post is not clear on this point.


No guys the Loco does not move at all - there was a Typo in my original msg ... Sorry for that ... i also took a small section of the track to try but same results ...The loco does not move , nor sound or Lights ... its just dead ....
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Offline QQQ1970  
#7 Posted : 17 March 2018 14:39:15(UTC)
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QQQ1970

Canada   
Joined: 06/02/2018(UTC)
Posts: 378
Location: Ontario, Toronto
You probably have a dead loco. You are supposed to turn off power before removing or placing loco on track. Otherwise it could toast the decoder.
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Offline David Dewar  
#8 Posted : 17 March 2018 14:40:09(UTC)
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David Dewar

Scotland   
Joined: 01/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 7,341
Location: Scotland
I don't have a mobile station but can you reset the decoder and try again. If the MS has a list of locos can you delete your one and then let it register again.
Take care I like Marklin and will defend the worlds greatest model rail manufacturer.
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Offline Asif  
#9 Posted : 17 March 2018 14:46:59(UTC)
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Asif

India   
Joined: 17/03/2018(UTC)
Posts: 8
Location: Maharashtra, Mumbai
Originally Posted by: David Dewar Go to Quoted Post
I don't have a mobile station but can you reset the decoder and try again. If the MS has a list of locos can you delete your one and then let it register again.


No the MS does not have this loco and the only way detect the loco is automatic ... you cannot self register ... if i reset the mobile station - i wont have control till it registers automatically. ..

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Offline H0  
#10 Posted : 17 March 2018 14:53:10(UTC)
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H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,265
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: QQQ1970 Go to Quoted Post
You are supposed to turn off power before removing or placing loco on track. Otherwise it could toast the decoder.
Says who?

Originally Posted by: QQQ1970 Go to Quoted Post
You probably have a dead loco.
Most likely.
But as I understand it it died while driving, not while being put on the track.

Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline dickinsonj  
#11 Posted : 17 March 2018 15:33:56(UTC)
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dickinsonj

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Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC)
Posts: 1,683
Location: Crozet, Virginia
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: QQQ1970 Go to Quoted Post
You are supposed to turn off power before removing or placing loco on track. Otherwise it could toast the decoder.
Says who?


Well, I do for one. Although I have not seen this requirement stated in any literature I do believe that depowering your track when placing things on it is a best practice. If the new loco is carefully placed on the powered track it should not cause a problem. But if a bogie turns and shorts the slider between the rail and the pukos then you can blow a decoder, which I unfortunately know from personal experience. I would rather turn off the track power while adding things to my track than replace decoders.

I also agree that if this loco died while running it is most likely a failed decoder and will need to be replaced, hopefully under warranty.

Good luck!
Regards,
Jim
I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains!
So many trains and so little time.
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Offline mike c  
#12 Posted : 17 March 2018 17:42:53(UTC)
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mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 7,892
Location: Montreal, QC
My first thought would be to check to see if the locomotive still works in analog function. As I understand it, this is your first train, so you likely do not have an analog transformer.
You can perhaps test it by connecting the leads from a 9V battery to the slider + and to the wheels - to see whether the lights and motor work.

The MS2 is designed to work with MFX as well as with MM (Motorola) format. In MFX, the MS2 recognizes the MFX address automatically. In classic Motorola mode, the locomotive responds to a selected address between 00 and 80. The number pre-selected for your model should be listed in the instruction manual, in the same paragraph as the MFX address.

Once you have located the MM address, you can check to see whether the locomotive responds to commands in MM mode.

If the locomotive responds to the 9V test, it indicates that it is working in analog mode. If it responds to MM mode, the problem may be with the MS2 or decoder in MFX mode. You can test this by seeing if a second locomotive works in MFX or has the same issue. If the locomotive does not respond at all, there is likely a decoder or wiring problem inside the locomotive.

Regards

Mike C
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Offline RayF  
#13 Posted : 17 March 2018 17:54:55(UTC)
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RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,839
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
I would reset the MS2 from the menu. That will delete any registrations there may be on it.

Then place the loco on the track again and see if it registers... If it does but still does not work try doing a loco reset from the MS2.

Decoders do fail occasionally at random, but this is very rare, and is usually associated with short circuits or too much current being drawn due to a stuck mechanism. There will be other clues that this is the case, such as smoke and heat.
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
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Offline H0  
#14 Posted : 17 March 2018 18:04:18(UTC)
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H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,265
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: mike c Go to Quoted Post
You can perhaps test it by connecting the leads from a 9V battery to the slider + and to the wheels - to see whether the lights and motor work.
Analogue Märklin locos can be tested with a 9 V battery, but many digital Märklin locos will not move with DC as DC is used for braking modules. But the lights might show.

Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
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Offline Asif  
#15 Posted : 24 March 2018 20:25:59(UTC)
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Asif

India   
Joined: 17/03/2018(UTC)
Posts: 8
Location: Maharashtra, Mumbai
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: mike c Go to Quoted Post
You can perhaps test it by connecting the leads from a 9V battery to the slider + and to the wheels - to see whether the lights and motor work.
Analogue Märklin locos can be tested with a 9 V battery, but many digital Märklin locos will not move with DC as DC is used for braking modules. But the lights might show.



Thanks for all the response so far, Today i did spend time trying to understand the issues - however no Luck at all ... Can someone please tell me the latest Version on MS2 -- mine says V 2.5 ... and HW V 2.1,, does the Software version on the MS2 matter in this case ?

Regards
Asif
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Offline H0  
#16 Posted : 24 March 2018 21:10:15(UTC)
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H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,265
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: Asif Go to Quoted Post
Can someone please tell me the latest Version on MS2
The latest version is 2.7, but version 1.83 or newer should work without issues.

Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
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Offline David Dewar  
#17 Posted : 24 March 2018 23:49:13(UTC)
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David Dewar

Scotland   
Joined: 01/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 7,341
Location: Scotland
I think you really need to try to borrow another loco and see if it works and if so the MS is OK.. Change over the decoder (if possible) and if the borrowed loco does not work then it is a faulty decoder. Not sure if this is helpful bit its what I would do but of course I have more than one loco.
Take care I like Marklin and will defend the worlds greatest model rail manufacturer.
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Offline mike c  
#18 Posted : 25 March 2018 01:04:10(UTC)
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mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 7,892
Location: Montreal, QC
Asif,

please test the locomotive with a 9V battery. It is important for us to know whether the locomotive is responding.
The lok should respond to address 66 in the classic Motorola MM format.

Quote:
Address set at the factory: 66

Mfx technology for the Mobile Station / Central Station.
Name set at the factory:
Ae 610 508-4


These tests would allow us to determine if the locomotive works in analog mode and whether there may be a problem with the Mfx protocols (either the decoder or the MS2).

Using the MS2, add a new locomotive to the list, with MM address 66. This will enable you to find out whether the locomotive is responding to the MM protocol.
If you get the locomotive to react to the MM format, I would recommend that you try to reset the decoder to see whether it then responds to mfx after the reset.

Regards

Mike C
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Offline eduard71  
#19 Posted : 25 March 2018 01:40:30(UTC)
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eduard71

Chile   
Joined: 27/02/2008(UTC)
Posts: 294
Location: Santiago
I have had dead locos like that in the past and the first thing I do in this cases is to review if the decoder is well connected to the 21 pin holder, in two cases due transportation the I have found disconnected decoders, I just push in again al problem solved.

Please review

Best regards

Eduardo
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Offline Crazy Harry  
#20 Posted : 25 March 2018 01:53:18(UTC)
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Crazy Harry

Canada   
Joined: 18/11/2008(UTC)
Posts: 477
Location: Oakville, Ontario
Here is the manual for the locomotive from Marklin's website:

https://static.maerklin....bdd45a69321434541964.pdf

This is just a stab in the dark, but has the switch that selects overhead feed or slider feed been bumped and is in the wrong position (see page 24 of the linked manual)?

Harold.
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Offline Asif  
#21 Posted : 25 March 2018 04:03:43(UTC)
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Asif

India   
Joined: 17/03/2018(UTC)
Posts: 8
Location: Maharashtra, Mumbai
Originally Posted by: Crazy Harry Go to Quoted Post
Here is the manual for the locomotive from Marklin's website:

https://static.maerklin....bdd45a69321434541964.pdf

This is just a stab in the dark, but has the switch that selects overhead feed or slider feed been bumped and is in the wrong position (see page 24 of the linked manual)?

Harold.



Thanks , I checked the feed is in the right position to take power from the tracks and not from the Catenary.
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Offline Asif  
#22 Posted : 25 March 2018 04:31:07(UTC)
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Asif

India   
Joined: 17/03/2018(UTC)
Posts: 8
Location: Maharashtra, Mumbai
Originally Posted by: mike c Go to Quoted Post
Asif,

please test the locomotive with a 9V battery. It is important for us to know whether the locomotive is responding.
The lok should respond to address 66 in the classic Motorola MM format.

Quote:
Address set at the factory: 66

Mfx technology for the Mobile Station / Central Station.
Name set at the factory:
Ae 610 508-4


These tests would allow us to determine if the locomotive works in analog mode and whether there may be a problem with the Mfx protocols (either the decoder or the MS2).

Using the MS2, add a new locomotive to the list, with MM address 66. This will enable you to find out whether the locomotive is responding to the MM protocol.
If you get the locomotive to react to the MM format, I would recommend that you try to reset the decoder to see whether it then responds to mfx after the reset.

Regards

Mike C


Sure Mike, will do the test - just want to clarify a few points as to how the setup should be for the test...Please pardon my ignorance and I am very new to all this, appreciate your assistance here. What I understand you are asking me to perform 2 Tests.

Test 1 - I will take 2 straight tracks - place the loco on it and feed the tracks with 9v battery power - No connecting MS2, or connector box or the power pack.
Test 2 - will take 2 straight tracks - feed power from the power pack connected to Wall socket , connect Connector box and the MS2, On the MS2 will select the loco from the database manually in MM format - to check what all functions works ?

Please confirm and will test and share the findings ..

Regards
Asif Sheikh

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Offline Asif  
#23 Posted : 25 March 2018 04:34:54(UTC)
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Asif

India   
Joined: 17/03/2018(UTC)
Posts: 8
Location: Maharashtra, Mumbai
Originally Posted by: David Dewar Go to Quoted Post
I think you really need to try to borrow another loco and see if it works and if so the MS is OK.. Change over the decoder (if possible) and if the borrowed loco does not work then it is a faulty decoder. Not sure if this is helpful bit its what I would do but of course I have more than one loco.


Thanks David, unfortunately i don't have any easy access to other Loco - I live in India - I will have to return this to my dealer in Amsterdam to check all this ..
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Offline H0  
#24 Posted : 25 March 2018 08:40:50(UTC)
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H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,265
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: mike c Go to Quoted Post
please test the locomotive with a 9V battery.
Have you made this test with a recent digital Märklin loco?
I haven't - but I wouldn't be surprised to see no reaction.


Originally Posted by: mike c Go to Quoted Post
The lok should respond to address 66 in the classic Motorola MM format. [...]
Using the MS2, add a new locomotive to the list, with MM address 66. This will enable you to find out whether the locomotive is responding to the MM protocol.
If you get the locomotive to react to the MM format [...]
To work around a well-known bug of the MS2, I'd recommend to make a factory reset of the MS2 first. Then unplug the wallwart for at least 10 seconds. Then disable the mfx and DCC protocol in the MS2, then register the MM loco.

An mfx loco will never respond to the MM address while mfx is enabled in the MS2 and in the loco.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
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Offline chrisisrang  
#25 Posted : 26 March 2018 12:48:09(UTC)
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chrisisrang


Joined: 24/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 173
Location: Hong Kong
Hi!

I am pretty certain that the decoder is damaged for whatever reason. It is best to send the loco back to the dealer in Holland and seek a replacement or having it fixed. The other option would be to send it to Marklin factory with your official receipt so that they can get it fixed. I doubt if resetting the MS will help in this case.

It is for this reason I buy locally in the region so that my dealer is close by, should something happen when I just bought a model. You may want to try your Marklin dealer in India and see if they can help you. Alternatively, I suggest reaching out to Marklin dealer in Singapore - Thrilling Toyz. He is quite a helpful guy and provides excellent customer support.

Good luck and hope your loco is fixed soon.

Cheers,

Chris
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