Welcome to the forum   
Welcome Guest! To enable all features please Login or Register.

Notification

Icon
Error

Share
Options
View
Go to last post in this topic Go to first unread post in this topic
Offline Hics  
#1 Posted : 15 February 2018 13:20:26(UTC)
Hics

United Kingdom   
Joined: 15/02/2018(UTC)
Posts: 158
Location: England, St Ives
Hello everybody.

I'm creating a layout based on Marklin M-rails. I have got around 8 semaphores and a few 5145, 5146 and 5147 tracks which I would like to install but actually don't where to position them? Can you suggest anything.

Many thanks

Seb



[img]http://[/img]Track layout.jpg
Offline Alsterstreek  
#2 Posted : 15 February 2018 14:33:22(UTC)
Alsterstreek

Portugal   
Joined: 16/11/2011(UTC)
Posts: 5,171
Location: Southwesternmost
Welcome to the forum.

What do you want to achieve? Control solenoids, as signals or turnouts? If the former, did you already consult a Maerklin manual on “old” analogue signals? Here is a link to an English language version (since my connection is dead slow I cannot check if it is still working):

https://www.marklin-user...l-Manual-0361-pdf-anyone

Alternatively, this Spanish website has an excellent archive (look for the buzzwords “bibliotheca” and then “libros de Märklin” as well as “señales”):

http://www.lctm.info/

Cheers
Offline Hics  
#3 Posted : 15 February 2018 15:33:28(UTC)
Hics

United Kingdom   
Joined: 15/02/2018(UTC)
Posts: 158
Location: England, St Ives
Hi, thx for the reply.
I would like to start one train if another one stops on a semaphore on train station. Also start another one as soon as one passes certain point on a layout. Connecting them is one think but I just don't know which place will be the best to put them on.
Offline Alsterstreek  
#4 Posted : 15 February 2018 16:57:09(UTC)
Alsterstreek

Portugal   
Joined: 16/11/2011(UTC)
Posts: 5,171
Location: Southwesternmost
(1a) Not prototypical, but the simplest way when running two separate trains that are meeting, using two signals and two contact tracks:
Place a contact track in front of the isolated stretch of track in front of signal that is supposed to stop approaching train (while other train is waiting in front of other red signal). Wire contact track in a way that “front” contact point is connected to own signal “red” and other signal of waiting train “green” positions. When approaching train hits the contact, it blocks its own passage by turning its own signal to red, while simultaneously releasing the waiting train by turning the signal of the latter to green. By having an identical set-up in front of both signals, one has a perpetual alternative movement of either train. When doing this for passing trains, the pointing turnout needs to be connected, too.
(1b) Prototypical operation required the use of two contact tracks, one in front of a signal switching the “competing” train’s signal green when approaching the own signal and one behind the own signal switching the latter to red after having passed it (while still green of course); and again the same set-up for the other signal etc.
(2a) Prototypical block operations for main line runs, requiring three contact tracks and three signals in each direction for running two trains, respectively: Place three signals in a chain behind each other, at least one train length apart and position one contact track behind each signal; wire contact track in such way that the signal just passed turns red while the signal “one train block back” is turned green; repeat for each signal. If you run one train it will just keep moving wile switching signals red and green during its course; two trains automatically control each other, ensuring that one train will never hit the rear of the other; three trains: disaster, don’t try...
(2b) Do the same for oncoming traffic on the opposite track of your dual track main line; have up to four trains running at the same time.
(3) Combine above...

Enjoy.
:o)
Offline Alsterstreek  
#5 Posted : 15 February 2018 20:09:09(UTC)
Alsterstreek

Portugal   
Joined: 16/11/2011(UTC)
Posts: 5,171
Location: Southwesternmost
Regarding the actual prototypical signal position:

(1) Synopsis by forum member Minok:
https://www.marklin-user...67-Signals-for-my-layout

(2) Prototype principles “translated” for MRR world:
http://www.der-moba.de/i...ungs-_und_-signaltechnik

(3) 1959 regulation of the prototype:
Eisenbahn-Signalordnung 1959 (ESO 1959), courtesy of the German Federal Railway Authority (German: Eisenbahn-Bundesamt, EBA):
11_eso.pdf;jsessionid=F529D2101BBACCDC3B6072D8BC1E1FAC.live21303.pdf (1,765kb) downloaded 101 time(s).
Offline Hics  
#6 Posted : 15 February 2018 23:37:36(UTC)
Hics

United Kingdom   
Joined: 15/02/2018(UTC)
Posts: 158
Location: England, St Ives
Thanks Alterstreek.
I have checked Spanish website. With all those manuals I will be busy reading them for a week at least. If kids allow me ;)
I might have more questions but they will probably come in about month time.
Cheers
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Hics
Offline Hics  
#7 Posted : 16 February 2018 10:23:45(UTC)
Hics

United Kingdom   
Joined: 15/02/2018(UTC)
Posts: 158
Location: England, St Ives
One more question again.
My boy will have this as his birthday present. Unfortunately it is digital loco. Can we run it on analogue M rail? In the future can I connect Marklin Mobile station to our M rail layout and change it to digital?
Many thanks

3331.jpg
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Hics
Offline Alsterstreek  
#8 Posted : 16 February 2018 11:38:39(UTC)
Alsterstreek

Portugal   
Joined: 16/11/2011(UTC)
Posts: 5,171
Location: Southwesternmost
That was a short month.
:o)

Yes, you can. Some M track feeder tracks have a condensator which - to put it simply - doesn’t work under a digital regime. Consequently, the powere emanating from the mobile station (MS) should be - to put it simply again - transferred directly to the M track. If you have a MS1 which is pluged directly into a piece of C track, you can use cables to connect C track spade connectors underneath the C track to the M track (“middle” to “middle” and outer rail to outer rail, respectively). If you have a MS2, the red cable emerging from the power box goes to the “middle” and the brown one to the M track outer rail.

Note:

- In order to not „grill“ your MS: Analogue and digital controls must never be connected to each other.

- Make sure that only respective locos are sitting on the track when connecting to power, i.e. analogue locos when connected to analogue control and digital locos when connected to digital control. AFAIK no harm done to digital locos, but analogue locos start running uncontrollably at full speed when connected to a digital power source.

Warning: Märklin 3331 can pick up power alternatively via pick-up shoe or from overhead catenary (there is a lever underneath the loco for switching between the two modes). So in principle one could run the electric loco with a MS via catenary and at the same time analogue locos fed by the M track. However, any (accidental) contact between overhead catenary and track in such analogue/digital constellation risks sudden MS death. This could already happen when tin plate cars make contact during a derailment or if the electric separation inside the electric loco is “unclean“.

P.S.: Forum member BrandonVA is having alternative analogue and digital sessions on his layout, using a toggle switch to switch between analogue and digital controls feeding power to the tracks.
Offline Alsterstreek  
#9 Posted : 16 February 2018 11:43:54(UTC)
Alsterstreek

Portugal   
Joined: 16/11/2011(UTC)
Posts: 5,171
Location: Southwesternmost
Accidental duplication.
Offline Hics  
#10 Posted : 16 February 2018 11:56:59(UTC)
Hics

United Kingdom   
Joined: 15/02/2018(UTC)
Posts: 158
Location: England, St Ives
yep, it was BigGrin

Due to this digital loco my plan is changing in my head all the time. Now to coop with the layout size looks like I'm gonna need a bigger house.
I have just printed all the marklin manuals (as I work in print industry BigGrin ) and start reading them over the weekend. Good knows what plans I will have on Monday?

Cheers
thanks 2 users liked this useful post by Hics
Offline Alsterstreek  
#11 Posted : 16 February 2018 12:09:28(UTC)
Alsterstreek

Portugal   
Joined: 16/11/2011(UTC)
Posts: 5,171
Location: Southwesternmost
An easier solution: Märklin 3331 is a Delta loco. Thus, when the “dip” switch - the famous mouse keyboard - inside the loco is set to “0”, the loco runs in analogue mode. The instructions inside the loco box explains how to achieve this.
Offline Hics  
#12 Posted : 16 February 2018 12:29:46(UTC)
Hics

United Kingdom   
Joined: 15/02/2018(UTC)
Posts: 158
Location: England, St Ives
Thanks Alterstreek again.

Due to this digital loco we will have, I have already started ebay hunting for MS and one more loco. Digital will be much more fun :)
Is MS1 going to be sufficient enough? Of what I can see it can run up to 8 locos. I probably wont have more than 4 but...

thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Hics
Offline Alsterstreek  
#13 Posted : 16 February 2018 15:10:32(UTC)
Alsterstreek

Portugal   
Joined: 16/11/2011(UTC)
Posts: 5,171
Location: Southwesternmost
My MS reached it limits with more than four digital locos on 30 m of C track. Note that M track might have different conductivity due to metal roadbed.
Offline Hics  
#14 Posted : 16 February 2018 15:27:38(UTC)
Hics

United Kingdom   
Joined: 15/02/2018(UTC)
Posts: 158
Location: England, St Ives
Good point.

My track is about 21 m long. I will have to speak to BrandonVA. Do you know anyone else using it on M track?
Offline Alsterstreek  
#15 Posted : 16 February 2018 16:09:29(UTC)
Alsterstreek

Portugal   
Joined: 16/11/2011(UTC)
Posts: 5,171
Location: Southwesternmost
Originally Posted by: Hics Go to Quoted Post
I will have to speak to BrandonVA.
He is switching between analogue and digital, but is layout is K track.

Originally Posted by: Hics Go to Quoted Post
Do you know anyone else using it on M track?
MS and M track? Unfortunately, no.
Online kiwiAlan  
#16 Posted : 16 February 2018 23:27:32(UTC)
kiwiAlan

United Kingdom   
Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC)
Posts: 6,284
Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
Originally Posted by: Hics Go to Quoted Post
Good point.

My track is about 21 m long. I will have to speak to BrandonVA. Do you know anyone else using it on M track?


If you are going to get an ms1 then get the 24088 connection track and transformer (I can't remember transformer catalogue number). Then also get a pair of M-C converter tracks. This will allow you to connect the C track to the M track, and thereby connect the ms1.

There is another trick, you will also need to get a 24172 straight track as the 24088 is 188mm long, so you need a 24172 to add to it to make a total of 360mm. The converter tracks are 180mm each, so the combination of the four tracks will be the equivalent of 4 full length M track straights. You will only need the 24172 if you are making a circle of track.

thanks 1 user liked this useful post by kiwiAlan
Offline Hics  
#17 Posted : 19 February 2018 10:28:33(UTC)
Hics

United Kingdom   
Joined: 15/02/2018(UTC)
Posts: 158
Location: England, St Ives
Hi again.

Over the weekend I got MS1 from someone who used it with M tracks as well. It comes without a track, just wires which I have to solder to the track and job done. As we have only 1 loco at the moment it wont be too much fun, but hopefully this will change soon.
Cant wait to connect it and start playing, I mean my son cant wait ;)
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Hics
Users browsing this topic
OceanSpiders 2.0
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

| Powered by YAF.NET | YAF.NET © 2003-2021, Yet Another Forum.NET
This page was generated in 0.563 seconds.