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Offline river6109  
#1 Posted : 17 March 2017 09:59:26(UTC)
river6109

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 14,727
Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
Hi,

over the years I have done little maintenance on my locos or carriages and when I do, its minimal.

after many years I've made the decision to add 2 ball bearings to all my motors except DC motors and this really helped me a.) reducing cleaning the motor from grime and other foreign objects, I'm lucky I don't have cats or dogs around the layout, b.) oiling is something I hardly do and only if there is excessive noise coming from the gears as the ball bearings prevent the armature to squeal which Märklin tried to resolve but without success over many years (2 different compound of metal and metal to plastic)

this has saved me a lot of time and unnecessary hassles over the years as all my locos have now a 5 pole high efficiency motor.

In the past I have had many repairs done and found the main culprit has been over oiling and therefore creating a negative result, rotor smothered with graphite, brush plate covered with graphite and the brushes were hardly recognizable both with 5 and 3 pole motors.

whatever dirt is on your track with excessive oil it will pick up all the nasties and collect it around the brushes and collector and sometimes the gears as well and this is usually more visible on your freight or passenger cars wheels where the wheel surface is no longer visible and this again gives you a good indication what is going on around your layout.
I've found a fine compound, apparently only available in Australia used around the household to clean things but I've cleaned brass, showers, bath, sinks, any dirt marks and started using on the carriage wheels with an astonishing result from a dull dark gray to a shiny new aluminum looking colour, you could say I've just bought new axles.

In my opinion, although oil is necessary the amount train model enthusiast use is 90% too much and as mentioned above does more harm than good .

to ascertain how good your loco is performing and how well it runs may not due to the lack of oil (always first thought) but the reason may be somewhere else.

look at your rolling stock and if the wheels are black or covered with grime you need to clean your tracks and also sometimes vacuum clean the tracks, excessive oil will finish up on the track and also will ruin your adhesive tyres which than become useless as they have expanded due to the oil.

some modelers feeding this habit (over oiling/grease) creating a merry go round maintenance port folio without realizing they are not getting on top of the cleaning process.

many manufacturers have improved the gears over the years from metal to plastic or have used metals which are compatible and don't have a chemical reaction, for instance steel and stainless steel or different grades of stainless steel.

I would suggest to think twice before going down a path with very little performance gain but rather a continuous battle of wishful thinking and hope to retain the motor in an excellent condition.

regards.,

John


BR 188 Ron 10000.JPG

BR 188 Ron 10002.JPG

BR 188 Ron 10003.JPG


BR 188 Ron 10001.JPG

BR 188 Ron 10004.JPG

Edited by user 18 March 2017 00:28:23(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

https://www.youtube.com/river6109
https://www.youtube.com/6109river
5 years in Destruction mode
50 years in Repairing mode
thanks 7 users liked this useful post by river6109
Offline baggio  
#2 Posted : 18 March 2017 14:46:53(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
Originally Posted by: river6109 Go to Quoted Post
I would suggest to think twice before going down a path with very little performance gain but rather a continuous battle of wishful thinking and hope to retain the motor in an excellent condition.


Sorry, what do you mean here? Blushing
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by baggio
Offline river6109  
#3 Posted : 19 March 2017 03:52:34(UTC)
river6109

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 14,727
Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: river6109 Go to Quoted Post
I would suggest to think twice before going down a path with very little performance gain but rather a continuous battle of wishful thinking and hope to retain the motor in an excellent condition.


Sorry, what do you mean here? Blushing


the pictures show it all, going down the path with oiling your locomotor can finish up with a mess like this and believing your loco is going to run smoother or better and this motor doesn't look anything but healthy.you have to ask yourself the question what actually has been achieved and as far the pictures show: nothing, it shows the opposite, a motor almost non recognizable and this was done in the name of: oiling the motor for whatever reason, it can become an obsession for no apparent reason or logic.


going down the path with very little performance gain: oiling the motor isn't going to help the motor retain its performance strength and by oiling it, all you will do is have a continuous battle keeping it clean: wishful thinking: how many time do we have inquiries about the loco isn't running properly and in principle 99% it is related to the motor: and why ? 99 % of model train enthusiasts oil their locos and 99% don't actually look at the motor itself.
Oiling the motor back in the days when each locomotor had a reservoir with a sponge and it retained the oil within the sponge, these days there are no provisions but oiling is done in the same fashion.

Some of you may have noticed Märklin had tried to overcome the ceasing of the armature and the cause was 2 different types of metal had been used and the attempt to eradicate this problem, Märklin had failed miserable over the years. Märklin had tried to insert a brass washer (failed) and the latest is a plastic washer, whereas before this the armature and motor block had been made from 2 different compound metals which, as I've mentioned before had a chemical reaction over years and eventually the metals bonded enough for the motor to cease unless you've cleaned it all and oiled it. the cause however was never corrected, and with most model train enthusiasts not identified as a problem.t
Märklin had eventually come to the conclusion keeping these 3 pole or 5 pole motors in production isn't going to solve the problem and hence have switched to centrally located motors and with steam locos had the opportunity to add more details to the cabin.

all they had to do is add ball bearings and they would have solved the problems years ago but spending 1 Euro extra wasn't in their budget estimate.

John

https://www.youtube.com/river6109
https://www.youtube.com/6109river
5 years in Destruction mode
50 years in Repairing mode
Offline baggio  
#4 Posted : 19 March 2017 04:00:11(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
Originally Posted by: river6109 Go to Quoted Post
the pictures show it all, going down the path with oiling your locomotor can finish up with a mess like this and believing your loco is going to run smoother or better and this motor doesn't look anything but healthy.


Thank you for the explanation, Zig Zag, I am guilty of this, too.

My beloved locomotor was taken once to the local Marklin shop because it was not running well (before I had it digitized) and Mike' father scolded me for having put far too much oil. Scared Sad Woot.

I now hardly do any maintenance. I either live with any problems or I take it to Mike's shop to clean. Usually the former. Wink
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by baggio
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