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Offline 5HorizonsRR  
#1 Posted : 01 February 2017 15:11:27(UTC)
5HorizonsRR

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC)
Posts: 2,985
Location: NY, NY
Hi all,

I'm rewriting this post! As we earlier determined the reverse unit to be fried, I'm now digitizing the locomotive. All started out quite well, but I've run into some circuitry (I think) hiccups, and could use some advice.

I gutted all old electrical, and wired in the chip. The 4 wires for motor control, track current and ground are all ok. On the test bench the locomotive runs well. But then I have two issues:

1- when I put the tender counterweight on, something goes crazy and the decoder doesn't short, but it stops responding.

2- I can't figure out the lighting wiring to save my life.

I think the two causes are related. There are three circuit/contact boards routing electrical. One under the boiler where the decoder wires in, and two in the rear which feed motor current, but also the rear taillight. I suspect the problem to have something to do with the tail light which appears on the same circuit as the motor power feed, but I'm not sure.

I've included images to aid with diagnostics...

Does anyone have any ideas, or experience with similar locomotives?

3.jpg2.jpg1.jpg4.jpg

Edited by user 14 May 2017 17:29:43(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

FS + SBB Era 2-5 and Vintage Marklin
Offline analogmike  
#2 Posted : 01 February 2017 15:30:15(UTC)
analogmike

United States   
Joined: 02/08/2014(UTC)
Posts: 652
Location: NEW JERSEY, USA
Hi john'
I have never seen one but;
Sounds to me like a dirty contact somewhere in the forward circuit from the reverser to the motor.
Remember; Just because it's brand new doesn't mean the're can't be a bit of dust creating intermittent contact.
Mikey
I love the smell of smoke fluid in the morning .
Offline mike c  
#3 Posted : 01 February 2017 21:07:06(UTC)
mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 6,708
Location: Montreal, QC
If the electronic reverser was not providing power in one direction, I would think that the lights would not work in that direction either, as the lights are not a separate function on analog models.
It sounds to me that there may be a weak connection somewhere on the PC board or a problem with a cable between the reverse unit and the PC board or from the PC board to the motor. The electronic reverse unit serves to convert the AC to DC and to invert the polarity to the motor when it detects the AC pulse.

Regards

Mike C
Offline jvuye  
#4 Posted : 01 February 2017 21:08:05(UTC)
jvuye

Belgium   
Joined: 01/03/2008(UTC)
Posts: 2,850
Location: South Western France
Hi John
Got the same one, lovely indeed.
Got it converted to digital with an ESU Lokpilot.
Have you tried to rotate the (tender) wheels by hand **with the motor and worm gear off** ?
Could very much be that the original (electronic) reversing unit did not like the high voltage pulse from you Märklin transformer. (Using still a blue one?)
Can you shoot a pic of the "rectifier thing" you mentioned?
As for the "loco" (un-powered) all the drivers participate in current pick up.
This is a proper 3 rail loco John! Wink
Cheers
Jacques
Jacques Vuye aka Dr.Eisenbahn
Once a vandal, learned to be better and had great success!
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by jvuye
Offline 5HorizonsRR  
#5 Posted : 01 February 2017 22:49:19(UTC)
5HorizonsRR

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC)
Posts: 2,985
Location: NY, NY
Originally Posted by: jvuye Go to Quoted Post
Hi John
Got the same one, lovely indeed.
Got it converted to digital with an ESU Lokpilot.
Have you tried to rotate the (tender) wheels by hand **with the motor and worm gear off** ?
Could very much be that the original (electronic) reversing unit did not like the high voltage pulse from you Märklin transformer. (Using still a blue one?)
Can you shoot a pic of the "rectifier thing" you mentioned?
As for the "loco" (un-powered) all the drivers participate in current pick up.
This is a proper 3 rail loco John! Wink
Cheers
Jacques


Thanks Jacques! I was planning on it remaining analogue, but if the reverse unit is fried a lokpilot is certainly the answer...

Anyhow, tender and motor are fine. Using test leads everything works well in both directions. I need to take some time and study where to test voltage on the electronic reverse unit. Images and further report to come late tonight or tomorrow!
FS + SBB Era 2-5 and Vintage Marklin
Offline franciscohg  
#6 Posted : 02 February 2017 00:46:00(UTC)
franciscohg

Chile   
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC)
Posts: 3,224
Location: Patagonia
Hi, i have also these wonderful set, bought it to use the coaches with my Marklin P10, so i had never run the engine, your post makes me wonder if it runs well, so i set up an analog oval and i must say that it is a very smooth runner, both ways!!! If you cant figure out the problem and need some info to compare, just let me now....
UserPostedImage German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by franciscohg
Offline 5HorizonsRR  
#7 Posted : 03 February 2017 15:31:07(UTC)
5HorizonsRR

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC)
Posts: 2,985
Location: NY, NY
Hi everyone,
I did a full disassembly last night, and sure enough it is looking like the reverse unit is the culprit. Everything else is in order, and there isn't much of anything else that could be causing this.

The only test left is to confirm its not putting out power to the motor with my voltmeter when in "forward" gear. The odd thing is when I give power to the locomotive (pre- reverse unit) in the circuit it gives a millisecond of it to the motor, then stops.

At least it looks like a very easy conversion to digital. Decoder, 2 wires to the motor, 2 for hot/ground, and then the lighting. 425 and I'll be back in business with improvements!
FS + SBB Era 2-5 and Vintage Marklin
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by 5HorizonsRR
Offline 5HorizonsRR  
#8 Posted : 14 May 2017 17:31:44(UTC)
5HorizonsRR

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC)
Posts: 2,985
Location: NY, NY
Bump for help with the digital conversion please!
FS + SBB Era 2-5 and Vintage Marklin
Offline franciscohg  
#9 Posted : 14 May 2017 21:14:41(UTC)
franciscohg

Chile   
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC)
Posts: 3,224
Location: Patagonia
Hello, you must cut the stripes in the tender circuit board in order to isolate the circuits for the motor, lights and ground, will check at mine (still analog) to help in showing the stripes needs to be cutted out.
Regards
UserPostedImage German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
Offline franciscohg  
#10 Posted : 14 May 2017 21:47:17(UTC)
franciscohg

Chile   
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC)
Posts: 3,224
Location: Patagonia
Ok, i have made some pictures, hope it helps, with this setup, lamps are grounded to the chassis, thus will be flickering, in order to avoid that you may replace the bulbs with leds and connect them to the U+ of the decoder.

UserPostedImage

UserPostedImage

regards
UserPostedImage German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
Offline 5HorizonsRR  
#11 Posted : 15 May 2017 00:01:28(UTC)
5HorizonsRR

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC)
Posts: 2,985
Location: NY, NY
Thanks so much! This confirms suspicions.

A question: do we need the tender ground? (I've already grounded via the front drive axles)

Also, by inductor do you mean the red coil spring piece?

I really appreciate it!
FS + SBB Era 2-5 and Vintage Marklin
Offline franciscohg  
#12 Posted : 15 May 2017 00:46:11(UTC)
franciscohg

Chile   
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC)
Posts: 3,224
Location: Patagonia
hi, yes i mean the coil, the more ground the better, it helps if tracks and/or wheels are not completely clean, but it is not absolutely needed.
UserPostedImage German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
Offline 5HorizonsRR  
#13 Posted : 16 May 2017 23:50:58(UTC)
5HorizonsRR

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC)
Posts: 2,985
Location: NY, NY
Thanks again! I got home from work a little early today. I added the second ground, zapped the taillight PCB with the dremel, and hooked up the lighting. All in business and running well!
FS + SBB Era 2-5 and Vintage Marklin
Offline franciscohg  
#14 Posted : 17 May 2017 01:34:41(UTC)
franciscohg

Chile   
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC)
Posts: 3,224
Location: Patagonia
Great!!!!
UserPostedImage German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by franciscohg
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