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Offline mb300e4m  
#1 Posted : 09 February 2014 00:56:40(UTC)
mb300e4m


Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC)
Posts: 424
Location: Florida
Hi all,

Today I acquired a 3356 croc in the original box. The box has quite a bit of wear, but the lok is almost mint and shows no sign of any wear on the slider pickup at all. I suspect that it has never been run, or at least very little and not for a long time.

The drive mechanism is extremely stiff and could do with being freed up and lubrication. I can remove the center cab body, but cannot see how to remove the two nose sections. I see there are two screws that pass through the couplers but removing the screws does not seem to do anything.

Any help with what should be an easy task would be appreciated.

Best regards, from a blustery and mostly wet part of Florida.

Peter B.
Peter B.
In Sunny Florida most of the time.
Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
Offline Markus Schild  
#2 Posted : 09 February 2014 01:17:51(UTC)
Markus Schild

Germany   
Joined: 14/01/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,802
Location: Wurttemberg
Hi Peter,

This is how Märklin explains it:

UserPostedImage

Sometimes old oil "glues" the hoods on the chassis.

Regards

Markus
thanks 3 users liked this useful post by Markus Schild
Offline mb300e4m  
#3 Posted : 09 February 2014 01:27:57(UTC)
mb300e4m


Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC)
Posts: 424
Location: Florida
Originally Posted by: Markus Schild Go to Quoted Post
Hi Peter,

This is how Märklin explains it:

UserPostedImage

Sometimes old oil "glues" the hoods on the chassis.

Regards

Markus


Thanks Markus, the picture says it all. The instructions with the lok did not show the methodology, it used a generic picture of body removal and one screw. There was no mention of or a picture showing hood removal.

I will give it a whirl tomorrow; it is getting to be time for a glass of wine, or better still a scotch and soda and another episode (on DVD) of Middlemarch, by George Eliot.

Cheers,

Peter B.
Peter B.
In Sunny Florida most of the time.
Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
Offline Bigdaddynz  
#4 Posted : 09 February 2014 04:32:37(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,663
Location: New Zealand
I had the same problem with my 39560 Crocodile. There's some lugs at positions #2 and #4 in the diagram which you have to push in, and then tilt the hood forwards to get it off. It takes a bit of practice to get it right (there are several previous threads in the forum dealing with this issue).

When you put the hood back on, make sure that the lugs properly engage again, as it is possible to think you've got them back on when they aren't.
thanks 2 users liked this useful post by Bigdaddynz
Offline Markus Schild  
#5 Posted : 09 February 2014 08:49:37(UTC)
Markus Schild

Germany   
Joined: 14/01/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,802
Location: Wurttemberg
Originally Posted by: Bigdaddynz Go to Quoted Post
I had the same problem with my 39560 Crocodile. There's some lugs at positions #2 and #4 in the diagram which you have to push in, and then tilt the hood forwards to get it off. It takes a bit of practice to get it right (there are several previous threads in the forum dealing with this issue).

When you put the hood back on, make sure that the lugs properly engage again, as it is possible to think you've got them back on when they aren't.


Hi,

Please note that 39560 has a die-cast hood, while the picture above is for a 3356 with plastic body. The covers of a plastic 3356 must be bend a little bit like shown on the picture.

Regards

Markus
thanks 3 users liked this useful post by Markus Schild
Offline RayF  
#6 Posted : 09 February 2014 12:50:00(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,839
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
It's a very tight fit. You need to use quite a bit of force....
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
Offline franciscohg  
#7 Posted : 09 February 2014 13:01:53(UTC)
franciscohg

Chile   
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC)
Posts: 3,268
Location: Patagonia
Yes, it was not so easy feeling to get with my 3556. The first times I always fear to brake something....
UserPostedImage German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
Offline mb300e4m  
#8 Posted : 09 February 2014 17:38:46(UTC)
mb300e4m


Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC)
Posts: 424
Location: Florida
Thanks everyone for the help, the hoods are now off and on the work bench. Now for the next step.

The powered drive wheels will rotate but are stiff. The non powered drive wheels will not as the Drive Crank wheel (Treibkurbel) will not rotate, the axle is gummed up. Can anyone tell me how to free up the all the axles without removing the wheels? On the non-powered chassis, I removed the screws for the coupler and the pickup but I could not remove the plastic piece that is below the chassis. I did not want to start pulling or levering it with a screwdriver for fear of breaking something.

Most loks I have worked on have been easy to dismantle, but this one has me stumped at least for now. Any advice will be most welcome.

Peter B.
Peter B.
In Sunny Florida most of the time.
Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
Offline mb300e4m  
#9 Posted : 09 February 2014 18:14:52(UTC)
mb300e4m


Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC)
Posts: 424
Location: Florida
Originally Posted by: mb300e4m Go to Quoted Post
Thanks everyone for the help, the hoods are now off and on the work bench. Now for the next step.

The powered drive wheels will rotate but are stiff. The non powered drive wheels will not as the Drive Crank wheel (Treibkurbel) will not rotate, the axle is gummed up. Can anyone tell me how to free up the all the axles without removing the wheels? On the non-powered chassis, I removed the screws for the coupler and the pickup but I could not remove the plastic piece that is below the chassis. I did not want to start pulling or levering it with a screwdriver for fear of breaking something.

Most loks I have worked on have been easy to dismantle, but this one has me stumped at least for now. Any advice will be most welcome.

Peter B.


As a follow-up to my previous posting, a close inspection revealed that the plastic piece is held in place by 6 tabs. I carefully released the tabs but could not remove the piece completely as it was still attached by a wire. However I did notice a tiny hole that passes through the plastic piece and metal chassis directly in line with the stuck axle. It seems to reach all the way to the axle, so I assume it is for applying lubricant. I will apply some isopropyl alcohol to the axle by way of the hole and see what happens.

Stand by for further bulletins; "Mother and baby" are making progress.

Peter B.
mb300e4m attached the following image(s):
P2094083.JPG
Peter B.
In Sunny Florida most of the time.
Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
thanks 2 users liked this useful post by mb300e4m
Offline BrandonVA  
#10 Posted : 10 February 2014 17:05:17(UTC)
BrandonVA

United States   
Joined: 09/12/2011(UTC)
Posts: 2,533
Location: VA
Peter,

Electric connection cleaner from the car parts store and then lighter fluid also work well for this. My method is normally 1.) alcohol 2.) electrical contact cleaner 3.) lighter fluid, escalating depending on how frozen things are. You may also be able to use a Q-tip to drip some alcohol down between the wheels at the frames where the axle shaft protrudes, at little bit goes a long way in penetrating the hardened oil.

-Brandon
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Offline mb300e4m  
#11 Posted : 10 February 2014 17:20:06(UTC)
mb300e4m


Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC)
Posts: 424
Location: Florida
Originally Posted by: mb300e4m Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: mb300e4m Go to Quoted Post
Thanks everyone for the help, the hoods are now off and on the work bench. Now for the next step.

The powered drive wheels will rotate but are stiff. The non powered drive wheels will not as the Drive Crank wheel (Treibkurbel) will not rotate, the axle is gummed up. Can anyone tell me how to free up the all the axles without removing the wheels? On the non-powered chassis, I removed the screws for the coupler and the pickup but I could not remove the plastic piece that is below the chassis. I did not want to start pulling or levering it with a screwdriver for fear of breaking something.

Most loks I have worked on have been easy to dismantle, but this one has me stumped at least for now. Any advice will be most welcome.

Peter B.


As a follow-up to my previous posting, a close inspection revealed that the plastic piece is held in place by 6 tabs. I carefully released the tabs but could not remove the piece completely as it was still attached by a wire. However I did notice a tiny hole that passes through the plastic piece and metal chassis directly in line with the stuck axle. It seems to reach all the way to the axle, so I assume it is for applying lubricant. I will apply some isopropyl alcohol to the axle by way of the hole and see what happens.

Stand by for further bulletins; "Mother and baby" are making progress.

Peter B.


It seems that I was wrong, the hole in the plastic piece next to the brass plate does not go through the metal chassis to an axle. I have removed the plastic piece and coupling rods from both sides of the non-powered chassis and find that the Treibkurbel appears to be held in place on each side by a Lagerbolzen which translates to "bolt · bearing journal · bearing pin · bearing stud · cap bearing bolt · cap bolt". This leads me to believe that there is no axle installed on the non-powered chassis. The exploded view diagram that I found only shows three axles, with four on the powered chassis.

Using a pair of small needle-nose pliers I find that the Treibkurbels will rotate, albeit stiffly, and the Lagerbolzen do not. Hmmm... the plot thickens.

Any opinions would be most appreciated. Don't you just love model trains; there is more to them than meets the eye. LOL.

Peter B.
Peter B.
In Sunny Florida most of the time.
Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
Offline Markus Schild  
#12 Posted : 10 February 2014 20:17:54(UTC)
Markus Schild

Germany   
Joined: 14/01/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,802
Location: Wurttemberg
Hi Peter,

in such cases I give the parts a full bath in "SR24". SR24 is a detergent which is specially sold for model-railways here in Germany. It dissolves the hardened oil but usually does not harm colour or plastic parts. I don't know where to buy it in the US or whether it can be imported legally.
On the Nuremberg - toy fair the detergent is usually demonstrated with a loco running in an aquarium filled with the liquid.
I only once had some problems with the silver roof colour of HAG express-coach models +30 years old.


Regards

Markus
thanks 4 users liked this useful post by Markus Schild
Offline mb300e4m  
#13 Posted : 10 February 2014 20:34:44(UTC)
mb300e4m


Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC)
Posts: 424
Location: Florida
Originally Posted by: Markus Schild Go to Quoted Post
Hi Peter,

in such cases I give the parts a full bath in "SR24". SR24 is a detergent which is specially sold for model-railways here in Germany. It dissolves the hardened oil but usually does not harm colour or plastic parts. I don't know where to buy it in the US or whether it can be imported legally.
On the Nuremberg - toy fair the detergent is usually demonstrated with a loco running in an aquarium filled with the liquid.
I only once had some problems with the silver roof colour of HAG express-coach models +30 years old.


Regards

Markus


Hi Markus, SR24 may be the same stuff that LGB used to sell as smoke oil / cleaner. I will do some investigating here and see what I can come up with. I did find a link on eBay in Germany. http://www.ebay.com/itm/...&hash=item2ec8c18a9e It is 200ml and costs $25 USD with free shipping. Sounds like a good deal to me.

I am now re-assembling my 3356 as all the wheels are now rotating freely, thank goodness. I have to resolder the pickup wire, I disconnected it to give me better access to the underside of the chassis/frame.

Best regards from a lovely sunny day in Florida.

Peter B.

PS. I have added a couple of pictures showing the underneath with and without the plastic piece. It can be seen that there is no hole through the metal chassis as there is no axle at that location.
mb300e4m attached the following image(s):
P2094083.JPG
P2104085.JPG
Peter B.
In Sunny Florida most of the time.
Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
thanks 3 users liked this useful post by mb300e4m
Offline Janne75  
#14 Posted : 10 February 2014 20:36:39(UTC)
Janne75

Finland   
Joined: 23/03/2012(UTC)
Posts: 2,550
Location: Finland
Good advice and product Markus. I usually use very light oil to get things rotating again if they are jammed. I have an experience with one CRC electric cleaner and it took paint off from red locomotive frame.

Janne
Märklin H0 digital layout. I have analog and digital H0 Collection. Rolling stock mostly from era I, II, III and IV. Märklin 1 gauge beginner.
thanks 2 users liked this useful post by Janne75
Offline mb300e4m  
#15 Posted : 11 February 2014 02:11:15(UTC)
mb300e4m


Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC)
Posts: 424
Location: Florida
Well here she is sitting on a section of my home made (modified) three rail flex track. She is all better but still needs a good long run.

Peter B.
mb300e4m attached the following image(s):
P2104090.JPG
Peter B.
In Sunny Florida most of the time.
Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
thanks 3 users liked this useful post by mb300e4m
Offline biedmatt  
#16 Posted : 27 May 2014 14:22:08(UTC)
biedmatt

United States   
Joined: 09/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,343
Location: Southwest Ohio
Interesting that Marklin show you pulling the nose sections apart to release the catch. I'd be affraid of breaking the zinc casting using this method. I prefer to push in on the plastic part of the catch. I believes the instructions for 3300 show it that way. Perhaps the instructions Markus posted are for the plastic nosed Croc and not the metal Croc.
Matt
Era 3
DB lokos, coaches and freight cars from across Europe
But I do have the obligatory (six) SBB Krocs
ECoS 50200, all FX and MFX decoders replaced with ESU V4s, operated in DCC-RailCom+ with ABC brake control.
With the exception of the passenger wagens with Marklin current conducting couplers, all close couplers have been replaced with Roco 40397.
Offline mb300e4m  
#17 Posted : 27 May 2014 14:45:06(UTC)
mb300e4m


Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC)
Posts: 424
Location: Florida
Originally Posted by: biedmatt Go to Quoted Post
Interesting that Marklin show you pulling the nose sections apart to release the catch. I'd be affraid of breaking the zinc casting using this method. I prefer to push in on the plastic part of the catch. I believes the instructions for 3300 show it that way. Perhaps the instructions Markus posted are for the plastic nosed Croc and not the metal Croc.


The Croc that I have is the plastic bodied 3356, so the hoods are removed as shown in the diagram.

Best regards,

Peter B.
Peter B.
In Sunny Florida most of the time.
Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by mb300e4m
Offline madhu.gn.71  
#18 Posted : 31 May 2022 08:59:31(UTC)
madhu.gn.71

India   
Joined: 16/04/2014(UTC)
Posts: 738
Location: Bangalore, India
It was very tricky indeed. I just had to open my newly purchased 3356's body to set the digital address. Now when I look at the diagram printed on the manual, it makes sense:)
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