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Offline Darren W  
#1 Posted : 04 March 2012 17:50:43(UTC)
Darren W

Canada   
Joined: 01/01/2007(UTC)
Posts: 630
Location: Alberta
Hi everyone,
I just came across this link from the eurorailhobbies.com website. It looks like a new controller from Roco that will also do Marklin Digital. Has anyone seen anything else about it or have any other information on it? It looks like an interesting system I wondered why no one else has made something like this.

http://z21.eu/

Darren
Offline H0  
#2 Posted : 04 March 2012 18:00:53(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 13,497
Location: DE-NW
Already discussed here:
https://www.marklin-user...-neither.aspx#post322865

Märklin Digital, but no mfx. Will they support 27 and 28 speed steps for MM? They didn't say that yet.

We'll have to wait a few years to see if they deliver what they promise - and they give very little details yet, so not much promised.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline Goofy  
#3 Posted : 04 March 2012 18:46:53(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 8,024
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Already discussed here:
https://www.marklin-user...-neither.aspx#post322865

Märklin Digital, but no mfx. Will they support 27 and 28 speed steps for MM? They didn't say that yet.

We'll have to wait a few years to see if they deliver what they promise - and they give very little details yet, so not much promised.


Few years???
Nope!
Z21 arrives out this summer.
It support MM2 and has 27 step for it.
But i´m not sure about totally functions.
It will support RailCom too.
There is possible to upgrade via PC.
There is 10 difference to choise locomotiv cabinet and use function as prototyp via screen(PC,Ipad or mobilphone).
And so on...
But i myself are not interested in this central station because you will focus to much on the screen.
DCC means Digital Command Control.

Offline H0  
#4 Posted : 04 March 2012 19:19:10(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 13,497
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: Goofy Go to Quoted Post
Few years???
Intellibox developed over years, CS1 developed over years, CS2 developed over years.
CS2 has an output for headphones (in use since 2.0.1) and a connector marked "SX" (reserved for future extensions).

Z21 shall come this year - prepared for CAN bus, prepared for LocoNet. When will these work? They don't say on www.z21.eu
What will the CAN bus support? MS1? MS2? CS1? CS2? They don't say on www.z21.eu
They don't confirm 27 speed steps for MM protocol on www.z21.eu either.

Z21 will take years to ripen - just like the other controllers.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline H0  
#5 Posted : 30 July 2012 22:07:27(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 13,497
Location: DE-NW
Hi!

Tomorrow's the big day when Z21 will be shipped to the dealers:
"www.z21.eu" wrote:
The digital system Z21 will be available at a dense network of qualified specialist dealers as of July 2012. Don’t hesitate to contact your model train dealer about all questions you may have about the Z21! He will be glad to help you!

We will provide a current index of our trained dealers here for the market introduction in July 2012.
They initially announced July 23rd as the day when Z21 hits the dealer's shelves.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline Goofy  
#6 Posted : 02 August 2012 08:54:05(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 8,024
Yep...i was right!
Z21 will been devilery out under this summer.

Flapper
DCC means Digital Command Control.

Offline H0  
#7 Posted : 02 August 2012 10:58:30(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 13,497
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: Goofy Go to Quoted Post
Yep...i was right!
Z21 will been devilery out under this summer.
I had no doubt they would ship something this year. I'm looking forward to reviews about it.
I wrote "Z21 will take years to ripen - just like the other controllers." and I wasn't proofed wrong yet.

Many questions still unanswered. Will LocoNet be fully operational? Will CAN bus be fully operational and what devices can be connected? Will MM protocol work with 27 and 28 speed steps or do they support 14 only?
They use a proprietary, undocumented LAN protocol - no chance to write your own programs for Z21 yet.
And they do not support mfx.

Z21 is not aimed at three-rail users and has little value for the huge majority of three-rail users.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline Goofy  
#8 Posted : 02 August 2012 15:50:24(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 8,024
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Goofy Go to Quoted Post
Yep...i was right!
Z21 will been devilery out under this summer.
I had no doubt they would ship something this year. I'm looking forward to reviews about it.
I wrote "Z21 will take years to ripen - just like the other controllers." and I wasn't proofed wrong yet.

Many questions still unanswered. Will LocoNet be fully operational? Will CAN bus be fully operational and what devices can be connected? Will MM protocol work with 27 and 28 speed steps or do they support 14 only?
They use a proprietary, undocumented LAN protocol - no chance to write your own programs for Z21 yet.
And they do not support mfx.

Z21 is not aimed at three-rail users and has little value for the huge majority of three-rail users.


Z21 supports MM1 and MM2 with all steps (14 and 27).
LAN,3-mal X-Bus,feed-back,LocoNet,Can and booster-Bus,Sniffer-Bus etc...
Z21 is just like all other digital system that allows to upgrade so what if you write about years to ripen???
I don´t take care of mfx system since it don´t been necessary by use it.
Z21 is aimed for 3 rail too since they do presentation about MM.
Program can also been download later by upgrade for Z21...just same about CS2.

DCC means Digital Command Control.

Offline H0  
#9 Posted : 02 August 2012 16:10:20(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 13,497
Location: DE-NW
MM2 has 14 speed steps only (as implemented in the CU 6021). Do they confirm support for 27 and/or 28 speed steps anywhere?
They have a CAN bus - but they don't know yet whether you can connect MS1 or MS2 to it.
They don't know yet whether Z21 will work with ECoS.

I can read their product brochure. And I can read their FAQ list.

Still waiting for reviews of people who have actually tested a Z21.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline NZMarklinist  
#10 Posted : 02 August 2012 17:19:16(UTC)
NZMarklinist

New Zealand   
Joined: 15/03/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1,757
Location: Auckland NZ
For what it's worth, a CS1-R , a router and I Pod/Phone will do a nicer job for us Marklinists, and have a touch screen with track diagram, or speed tachos, plus two speed knobs, will support MFX, DCC, Railcom, MM BigGrin ThumpUp And we can connect MS1 and all ESU thingys Wink

Roco Z21ThumbDown
Glen
Auckland NZ

" Every Marklin layout needs a V200, a Railbus and a Banana car", not to mention a few Black and red Steamers, oh and the odd Elok !

CS1 Reloaded, Touch Cab, C Track Modules, K track layout all under construction. Currently Insider
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by NZMarklinist
H0
Offline Goofy  
#11 Posted : 02 August 2012 20:30:44(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 8,024
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
MM2 has 14 speed steps only (as implemented in the CU 6021). Do they confirm support for 27 and/or 28 speed steps anywhere?
They have a CAN bus - but they don't know yet whether you can connect MS1 or MS2 to it.
They don't know yet whether Z21 will work with ECoS.

I can read their product brochure. And I can read their FAQ list.

Still waiting for reviews of people who have actually tested a Z21.


ESU has 27 speedsteps in theirs MM decoder.
Or multidecoder whatever you are thinking on!
Why to supporting others digital system when Z21 is also an system by for self?

DCC means Digital Command Control.

Offline H0  
#12 Posted : 02 August 2012 20:58:59(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 13,497
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: Goofy Go to Quoted Post
ESU has 27 speedsteps in theirs MM decoder.
ESU has 28 speed steps in their MM decoders (27 speed steps use a completely different mechanism).
CS1 60212 is the only Märklin controller that supports 28 speed steps with MM protocol.

How many speed knobs does the Z21 have? Therefore it's very important to connect other controllers to the Z21.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
Offline Goofy  
#13 Posted : 03 August 2012 08:28:08(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 8,024
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Goofy Go to Quoted Post
ESU has 27 speedsteps in theirs MM decoder.
ESU has 28 speed steps in their MM decoders (27 speed steps use a completely different mechanism).
CS1 60212 is the only Märklin controller that supports 28 speed steps with MM protocol.

How many speed knobs does the Z21 have? Therefore it's very important to connect other controllers to the Z21.


Depends in the program...i think there is 128 speedsteps that supports decoder up to 128 speedsteps(DCC).
27 or 28 speedstep...who cares?
It´s only one speedstep in difference! Huh
It´s not truth important to connect other controllers since you can use Ipone,Ipad or PC too.
Remember H0...there is no reason if Roco shall producing Z21 by not accept others products.
If Marklin or ESU does with theirs system...so why not from Roco too?
There is upgrade too H0!
Relax H0!!!

DCC means Digital Command Control.

Offline H0  
#14 Posted : 03 August 2012 14:17:03(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 13,497
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: Goofy Go to Quoted Post
27 or 28 speedstep...who cares?
It´s only one speedstep in difference! Huh
Those who know the difference do care.
ESU decoders support 14 or 28 speed steps with MM protocol. If the controller supports 14 and 27 speed steps, only 14 speed steps can be used with ESU decoders. 100 % difference.
It's not yet known if Z21 support more than 14 speed steps with MM protocol anyway.

I'm completely relaxed. I don't have an iPhone. I do have some mfx locos. Two strong reasons against a Z21.
I'm a three-railer. Z21 does not target three-railers.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline H0  
#15 Posted : 14 September 2012 23:18:58(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 13,497
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Goofy Go to Quoted Post
Yep...i was right!
Z21 will been devilery out under this summer.
[...]
I wrote "Z21 will take years to ripen - just like the other controllers." and I wasn't proofed wrong yet.

Many questions still unanswered. Will LocoNet be fully operational? Will CAN bus be fully operational and what devices can be connected? Will MM protocol work with 27 and 28 speed steps or do they support 14 only? [...]
Some questions have been answered:
  • The CAN bus doesn't do anything yet (they still have a survey on their site to decide whether they will implement "Märklin-CAN", "ESU-CAN", or "Zimo-CAN").
  • The LocoNet bus doesn't do anything useful yet (earlier this month they announced that they acquired a LocoNet licence and will now implement LocoNet step by step).
  • Android app only available as a beta version (that sometimes crashes the whole smartphone).


Neither Fleischmann Profi Boss nor Roco multiMaus pro can currently be used with the Z21.

Unanswered questions: how many speed steps and how many functions do they support for MM locos?
Will Mobile Station 1 and/or Mobile Station 2 (both use CAN bus) ever work with the Z21?

Z21 is out for more than a month and I haven't read a serious test review yet.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
Offline steventrain  
#16 Posted : 15 September 2012 12:17:31(UTC)
steventrain

United Kingdom   
Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC)
Posts: 32,729
Location: Northern Ireland
You can see Z21 on youtube.
Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy.
Offline kbvrod  
#17 Posted : 15 September 2012 12:28:51(UTC)
kbvrod

United States   
Joined: 23/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 2,597
Location: Beverly, MA
Offline Bigdaddynz  
#18 Posted : 15 September 2012 14:28:55(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 16,683
Location: New Zealand
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Z21 is out for more than a month and I haven't read a serious test review yet.


Maybe Goofy can buy one and be the first to review it!
Offline Goofy  
#19 Posted : 15 September 2012 17:20:36(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 8,024
Not bad!!!
I think i shall get this one soon.
I have laptop 17" by use it as screen stellwerk too.
Z21 cost just half of what CS2 does cost.
Seems promise product.
DCC means Digital Command Control.

Offline Goofy  
#20 Posted : 16 September 2012 11:09:52(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 8,024
Does any one who knows if there is an CD program follows in the Z21...?
I want to use this system Z21 connecting to my laptop too...but found out lack of information.
It should been work with PC too...
DCC means Digital Command Control.

Offline H0  
#21 Posted : 16 September 2012 11:32:48(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 13,497
Location: DE-NW
A PC program (Windows) is under development and will be sold separately. It should be available by end of September 2012. (source Z21 FAQ)
The LAN API is not documented, so Roco can control who writes PC programs that support the Z21.

I presume there is no CD included for the Z21 (the WLAN router comes with CD).

The user guide is available for download:
http://www.z21.eu/en/support/downloads/index.html

"You can see: We still have a lot to do." (User guide, page 33)
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
Offline Goofy  
#22 Posted : 16 September 2012 14:13:34(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 8,024
I wait until more further information arrives about Z21.
DCC means Digital Command Control.

thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Goofy
H0
Offline H0  
#23 Posted : 09 October 2012 09:03:34(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 13,497
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Some questions have been answered:
  • The CAN bus doesn't do anything yet (they still have a survey on their site to decide whether they will implement "Märklin-CAN", "ESU-CAN", or "Zimo-CAN").
  • The LocoNet bus doesn't do anything useful yet (earlier this month they announced that they acquired a LocoNet licence and will now implement LocoNet step by step).
  • ...
Further information: the Sniffer Port is still deactivated. They write it will be activated before the winter comes.

A user on Stummi's Forum tested the Z21. He wrote that it supports MM14 and MM28 (but not MM27 for the 60901 decoders and recent mfx decoders).
He has to use a loco supporting MM14 only with the MM28 setting of the Z21 app because the MM14 setting causes problems. Sliding with his finger over the app, he cannot tell whether the locos are really having 28 speed steps or only 14.
The app does not display the current speed step as a number, you only have the speed bar to estimate the current speed.

I prefer controllers that display the current speed step as a number.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
Offline Goofy  
#24 Posted : 14 October 2012 13:34:34(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 8,024
Still needs to upgrade before complete system.
By the way...speed limit per hour can also been done with upgrade later from Roco.
Old decoders from Marklin seems trouble.
It is better with electronic decoder...not old decoder with pot.
Still decides to waiting for further Z21.
DCC means Digital Command Control.

User is suspended until 23/03/4752 12:54:35(UTC) Mulldog Lemon  
#25 Posted : 08 January 2013 19:49:34(UTC)
Mulldog Lemon

Australia   
Joined: 27/11/2010(UTC)
Posts: 635
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Goofy Go to Quoted Post
Yep...i was right!
Z21 will been devilery out under this summer.
I had no doubt they would ship something this year. I'm looking forward to reviews about it.
I wrote "Z21 will take years to ripen - just like the other controllers." and I wasn't proofed wrong yet.

You wouldn't buy an iPhone if most of its features took 'years to ripen'...
"Years" in the mobile phone industry equates to a totally new version; not the eventual delivery of promised features and/or bug-fixes.

What the Z21 is offering in 2013 isn't worth anything near EUR400. More like 50.

Phail. ThumbDown







UserPostedImage
Offline jeehring  
#26 Posted : 10 January 2013 19:23:03(UTC)
jeehring


Joined: 25/09/2003(UTC)
Posts: 2,786
Location: ,
four months after the release it is still very poor ... The French version only arrived last week (with errors)
Z1 owners talk on the forums: programming decoders is problematic, not long addresses possible, it seems impossible to read the CV (at least on the decoders mentionned on those forums - but they are writable), no POM mode, no double consists nor multiple consists .. ..
3 X-bus connections only two are partially functional (both which are in front). X-Bus is the Roco bus to connect other Roco accessories...
LocoNet bus only understand the control of "throttle" (no other functions), the CAN bus is still not set ... so it is not functional, etc ...
However they have been publishing several cabins images: the image of the cabins of the Locks is one of their main sales argument.
Roco has promised an update before Nuremberg fair, I hope it will be a good step forward , there is still a lot of work...
The question is : how long it will take to reach an acceptable level (without too much bugs...)
It seems they could change their mind about window PC compatibility, recently, there was a kind of small maintenance programm (only few data like track voltage, inner temperature, electric consumption)...which gives a more serious appearance than cab images...Wink Such a programm could have been on the main user interface (like on the CS2 or Ecos) but they decided that it will be on a PC....(probably in the future to update decoders : it's easier than iOS/Androïd apps...)
Offline kbvrod  
#27 Posted : 10 January 2013 21:04:27(UTC)
kbvrod

United States   
Joined: 23/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 2,597
Location: Beverly, MA
Hi all,
Sounds like Microsoft!LOL


Dr D
Offline edwint  
#28 Posted : 10 January 2013 23:34:07(UTC)
edwint

Netherlands   
Joined: 10/01/2013(UTC)
Posts: 3
HI,

i originally bought it to run my lgb in the garden digital, which is most manual and it works fine.

Getting excited about railroading again, i started a marklin digital track, but here the Z21 is too much beta.

After lots of effort i as able to get my mfx trains running on the z21, with an extra adress for the additional functions.

I now would like to connect turnout decoders, but this wont work. I'm using the new 74461 decoders which should be compatible, but i just cant get them to work.

perhaps some knows a direction to look into?

cheers, edwin
Offline jeehring  
#29 Posted : 11 January 2013 02:41:19(UTC)
jeehring


Joined: 25/09/2003(UTC)
Posts: 2,786
Location: ,
Originally Posted by: edwint Go to Quoted Post
HI,


I now would like to connect turnout decoders, but this wont work. I'm using the new 74461 decoders which should be compatible, but i just cant get them to work.

cheers, edwin

Some people didn't succeed with switchpilots decoders....another one shows how to handle turnouts icons, but didn't check the programming....
Actually there is no route control. (should come later)
In place of the layout diagram there is a strange gimmick based on the pictures of your layout (you have to take the photo with your ipad camera), on which you can superimpose turnout icons.....(as I said : all is the iPad... and is in the iPAD). I wonder how useful it must be for hidden parts Confused

BTW : if you want to download some image of the Cabs you have to pay 9.99 Eur for one picture (9.99 Eur each).
Only the first one is for free.



Offline edwint  
#30 Posted : 12 January 2013 00:00:05(UTC)
edwint

Netherlands   
Joined: 10/01/2013(UTC)
Posts: 3
Originally Posted by: jeehring Go to Quoted Post

Some people didn't succeed with switchpilots decoders....another one shows how to handle turnouts icons, but didn't check the programming....
Actually there is no route control. (should come later)
In place of the layout diagram there is a strange gimmick based on the pictures of your layout (you have to take the photo with your ipad camera), on which you can superimpose turnout icons.....(as I said : all is the iPad... and is in the iPAD). I wonder how useful it must be for hidden parts Confused

BTW : if you want to download some image of the Cabs you have to pay 9.99 Eur for one picture (9.99 Eur each).
Only the first one is for free.



Hi, i have had mail contact with the z21 guys. The 74460 decoders are MM only. The new 74461 are MM and DCC compliant. I'll try to figure out why it doenst work.
The z21 team would release a new version at the end of january which should be able to support the marklin motorola protocol too.

I don't have any interest in the cab function. I like the simple interface which my son of 4 years old can use.

cheers,
Offline Goofy  
#31 Posted : 12 January 2013 08:46:05(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 8,024
I have seen that store are trying to sell out Z21 for lesser prices.
It seems some trouble too via app.
I decides to give up about Z21 since it don´t respons good in all terms inside of digital system.
DCC means Digital Command Control.

Offline H0  
#32 Posted : 12 January 2013 08:57:59(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 13,497
Location: DE-NW
Hi!
Originally Posted by: edwint Go to Quoted Post
The z21 team would release a new version at the end of january which should be able to support the marklin motorola protocol too.
Cool. I would have expected that MM protocol was implemented right from the start. Now we know it works for locos only.
The Z21 has an impressive "not yet implemented" list.

Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
Offline jeehring  
#33 Posted : 12 January 2013 10:15:24(UTC)
jeehring


Joined: 25/09/2003(UTC)
Posts: 2,786
Location: ,
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Hi!
Originally Posted by: edwint Go to Quoted Post
The z21 team would release a new version at the end of january which should be able to support the marklin motorola protocol too.

...(...)...The Z21 has an impressive "not yet implemented" list.


some "basics" are not yet implemented...but there are several Cab interior images ...
According a French Modelrailway Magazine, the Z1 is not designed by Zimo. Contrary to initial rumors, there was no partnership between Zimo & Roco for this central. Zimo is not the subcontractor, and is not the designer....
Offline Jay  
#34 Posted : 12 January 2013 15:56:34(UTC)
Jay

South Africa   
Joined: 01/05/2010(UTC)
Posts: 232
Location: Johannesburg, South Africa
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Goofy Go to Quoted Post
ESU has 27 speedsteps in theirs MM decoder.
ESU has 28 speed steps in their MM decoders (27 speed steps use a completely different mechanism).
CS1 60212 is the only Märklin controller that supports 28 speed steps with MM protocol.

How many speed knobs does the Z21 have? Therefore it's very important to connect other controllers to the Z21.


Offline db ice3  
#35 Posted : 12 January 2013 18:12:27(UTC)
db ice3


Joined: 24/12/2009(UTC)
Posts: 171
Location: uk
Originally Posted by: Mulldog Lemon Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Goofy Go to Quoted Post
Yep...i was right!
Z21 will been devilery out under this summer.
I had no doubt they would ship something this year. I'm looking forward to reviews about it.
I wrote "Z21 will take years to ripen - just like the other controllers." and I wasn't proofed wrong yet.

You wouldn't buy an iPhone if most of its features took 'years to ripen'...
"Years" in the mobile phone industry equates to a totally new version; not the eventual delivery of promised features and/or bug-fixes.

What the Z21 is offering in 2013 isn't worth anything near EUR400. More like 50.

Phail. ThumbDown









Perhaps only worth eu€50 to you personally, but it will suit some people and to those people it will be worth eu€400. Everyone has their own personal likes and dislikes, so just because its not worth much to you, doesn't mean that someone like me won't buy it at eu€400 and some others too.

I would reword your post to :-

What the Z21 is offering in 2013 isn't worth anything near EUR400 - but More like 50 to me personally, others may feel differently however.
Offline edwint  
#36 Posted : 13 January 2013 00:39:25(UTC)
edwint

Netherlands   
Joined: 10/01/2013(UTC)
Posts: 3
Allthough not quite "there" yet, i dont regret buying it.

I was able to buy it for 400, incl à digital LGB train and 2 cars with an oval track.

i found out later, that i can use it for my marklin too.

When compatible with marklin Motorola at the end of the month and interfacing with Traincontroller in the coming months, im happy with it.
One device, multiple controllers ( ipads, iphones) integrated 3 amp trans, interface with pc, several bus. Enough potential.

Had enough fun with it already and now looking forward to use it for more than i bought it for.

Cheers
Offline jeehring  
#37 Posted : 13 January 2013 18:55:14(UTC)
jeehring


Joined: 25/09/2003(UTC)
Posts: 2,786
Location: ,
....There are many mistakes into the French translation, it looks like they did it with the automatic Google translation, it's just a shame, they couldn't afford for some professionnal ???
However there is one thing I like : it's so easy to have a photo of your own Lok, thanks to the i-pad with camera .

Edited by user 13 January 2013 22:35:55(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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