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Offline aos  
#1 Posted : 19 May 2010 18:27:24(UTC)
aos

Scotland   
Joined: 03/08/2008(UTC)
Posts: 526
Location: Livingston, Scotland
I have an old M track 7186 Turntable. It has the 4 connections on the side. The colours are: Brown, Red, Black and Red respectively. I want to connect it to my new digital system which has a MS1 and 60052 60VA Transformer.

I have the old blue 32VA 6631 transformers and 40VA 6611 lighting transformer. These are rated at 220 volt,not the new 230 voltage. I have heard that these can be used to power accessories. Is this true?

Can somebody please post a sketch on here as to how I should connect the turntable.

Oh, and while I am here, a few other questions:

Can I use the old transformers (using the brown and yellow connections) to power my signals and points? How do I get the lights to work on the points. Again, can someone post a sketch for me to view.

Can I use the new C track screws mounting screws to lay M track?

Thanks in advance, Alan
Offline Ian555  
#2 Posted : 23 May 2010 20:13:46(UTC)
Ian555

Scotland   
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC)
Posts: 20,288
Location: Scotland
Hi Alan,

I wish I could help,but I'm not sure on any of your questions.

I reckon everyone's sitting outside in this glorious sunshine we're having.

It's getting near time for the Perth run,you up for it again.Laugh

Ian.
Offline H0  
#3 Posted : 23 May 2010 23:17:51(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,438
Location: DE-NW
Hi!
aos wrote:
I have the old blue 32VA 6631 transformers and 40VA 6611 lighting transformer. These are rated at 220 volt,not the new 230 voltage. I have heard that these can be used to power accessories. Is this true?

Yes, but the output voltage is typically 1 or 2 volts higher than that of current transformers. This can reduce the longevity of light bulbs.

aos wrote:
Can I use the old transformers (using the brown and yellow connections) to power my signals and points? How do I get the lights to work on the points. Again, can someone post a sketch for me to view.

To get light on your points, you need two wires: yellow (from secondary transformer to yellow wire of point) and brown (from secondary transformer to track). I have no sketch, but this should be no problem.

Never connect the transformer that feeds the MS to anything but the MS (to be on the safe side).
Never connect any other power source to the center rail.

But it's safe to connect the secondary transformer to the track bed (brown wire).
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
Offline aos  
#4 Posted : 06 June 2010 18:01:35(UTC)
aos

Scotland   
Joined: 03/08/2008(UTC)
Posts: 526
Location: Livingston, Scotland
In my starter set manual, it says the following:

"With other Marklin operating systems, you sometimes find the note that signals can be used as return conductors for lighting of the track. This, however is not possible with Marklin Systems. As such, use only supports without an electrical connection to the track for signals and separately connect the return conductor for lighting as shown in the respective terminal diagrams." I assume that this means that I must not use the metal base to mount the signal to the M track, is that correct?

My starter set manual also shows a diagram for connecting a 7286 turntable. It shows a track isolating point to the left of the turntable and a current feed between the isolator and the turntable. Does that mean that the 7186 turntable must have the same setup? Do all tracks from the turntable to the main layout need to be isolated, ie the turntable is completely insulated from the whole layout? Unsure

If this is the case, how does the digital signal operate when the loco is on the turntable? The Marklin Systems documentation seems to imply that the digital system and any other components must not have any common grounding, whatever the heck that might be. Again, can someone please explain what this means?

I know that I must sound a pain, but I really do not have a clue UnsureScared I have just spent money on converting a loco to digital and will be using this as my "guinea pig" for testing. I do not want to get this wrong.

I really need a total idiots guide. I have searched high and low on the internet for a suitable diagram, to no avail. I have even emailed Marklin Service and Marklin Customer Service and have not even had the courtesy of an acknowledgement.

If there is any member out there who has installed a 7186 on their Marklin systems digital layout, please draw me a simple diagram and email it to me. I would be eternally grateful.
Offline scraigen  
#5 Posted : 28 October 2010 23:43:02(UTC)
scraigen


Joined: 29/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 301
Location: Sheffield,
Hi Alan,

Did you get anywhere with this? I have exactly the same questions, I have an old 7186 Turntable that I want to use with a Digital set-up, but I want to power the turntable motors completely separately from the the track, the problem is that I believe that the motors in the TT share the same common return as the track.

Cheers

Stuart
Must build something
Offline H0  
#6 Posted : 29 October 2010 01:02:33(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,438
Location: DE-NW
Hi, Stuart!
scraigen wrote:
the problem is that I believe that the motors in the TT share the same common return as the track.

A single shared connection is no problem.
In general it's safe to connect all brown wires (except for the brown wire of the transformer that feeds a new digital controller like CS or MS; no problem with CU 6021 and Delta Controls).
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
Offline scraigen  
#7 Posted : 29 October 2010 01:32:04(UTC)
scraigen


Joined: 29/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 301
Location: Sheffield,
H0 wrote:
A single shared connection is no problem.


Sorry I should have been clearer, I want to control the turntable using old style analog control, but I want the track to be digital, herein lies my concern that surely a digital and an analog cannot share the same return wire?

Stuart
Must build something
Offline Writhdar  
#8 Posted : 29 October 2010 03:23:09(UTC)
Writhdar


Joined: 19/12/2008(UTC)
Posts: 207
Location: Durango, Colorado
Here is a link to the 7186 manual ftp://ftp.marklin.com/pub/Old%20Manuals/

If that link won't work, go to http://www.marklin.com/tech/ and then click on Old Manuals

This is a direct link to the uploaded image but I'm not sure how good it will be UserPostedImage

Dan
Offline river6109  
#9 Posted : 29 October 2010 03:47:39(UTC)
river6109

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 14,874
Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
Can I ask you, why you don't want the turntable to be digitally controlled ?

John
https://www.youtube.com/river6109
https://www.youtube.com/6109river
5 years in Destruction mode
50 years in Repairing mode
Offline sudibarba  
#10 Posted : 29 October 2010 04:00:25(UTC)
sudibarba

United States   
Joined: 28/07/2006(UTC)
Posts: 880
Location: Augusta, GA USA
scraigen wrote:
Hi Alan,

Did you get anywhere with this? I have exactly the same questions, I have an old 7186 Turntable that I want to use with a Digital set-up, but I want to power the turntable motors completely separately from the the track, the problem is that I believe that the motors in the TT share the same common return as the track.

Cheers

Stuart


I run a CS2 to run my trains on M track. I have all the turnouts and my crane & 7186 powered by separate transformers. The 7186 is controlled by the original controller. All share the same ground. Tracks, turnouts, crane, 7186 and CS2.

For instance, the turnouts have a yellow wire that goes to a group of them that go to a yellow on a transformer. The two blues go to a toggle switch. the transformer brown goes to a common brown junction plate(s) that the CS2 is also connected to. The same applies to the 7186.

Eric
Offline sudibarba  
#11 Posted : 29 October 2010 04:05:32(UTC)
sudibarba

United States   
Joined: 28/07/2006(UTC)
Posts: 880
Location: Augusta, GA USA
river6109 wrote:
Can I ask you, why you don't want the turntable to be digitally controlled ?

John


Why do you want to control the turntable digitally? I can't see incorporating it into some kind of digitally controlled run. You can mount the controller next to the CS2 if you want. Not sure why I want to use the CS2 - would have to buy a decoder. Please help me understand the advantages.
Thanks,
Eric
Offline H0  
#12 Posted : 29 October 2010 09:45:43(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,438
Location: DE-NW
scraigen wrote:
H0 wrote:
A single shared connection is no problem.


Sorry I should have been clearer, I want to control the turntable using old style analog control, but I want the track to be digital, herein lies my concern that surely a digital and an analog cannot share the same return wire?

A single connection between two unrelated electric curcuits is no problem.

A common return wire is the only way to operate the Märklin railroad crossings - analog or digital, even with C and K track.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
Offline aos  
#13 Posted : 29 October 2010 12:45:14(UTC)
aos

Scotland   
Joined: 03/08/2008(UTC)
Posts: 526
Location: Livingston, Scotland
Stuart - I contacted Marklin Service at the factory. They were very helpful. They sent copies of the old diagrams, the originals of which I do still have. Basically, connect the track to the turntable. You do not need to install any isolation pieces into the centre track connectors. It makes no difference whether you are running the track as analogue or digital. Use the original diagrams to connect the wiring up. I use an old 6631 transformer to power the turntable and use the yellow and associated brown sockets (not the brown socket beside the red socket). I was a bit apprehensive at first power on, but everything works ok. Alan
Offline scraigen  
#14 Posted : 29 October 2010 13:02:01(UTC)
scraigen


Joined: 29/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 301
Location: Sheffield,
Thanks everyone. I DO want the TT tracks to be digital, but I just want to do the TT rotation old school with a separate blue trafo, from what you're all saying it works fine simply to connect the return paths of both the blue trafo and digital track return together and therefore it doesn't matter at all that the TT motors and track return are connected. Brill! Simple!

Cheers

Stuart
Must build something
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