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Offline DamonKelly  
#1 Posted : 21 July 2009 17:19:46(UTC)
DamonKelly

Australia   
Joined: 26/03/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,422
Location: Brisbane, QLD
I've done a quick search of the forum and found nothing of use...[:(]

Are there any alternatives (i.e. non-Märklin) for:
1. turnout motors
2. decoders

Actually, I know Viessmann have decoders, but what about motors?

The Märklin 74445 kit is attractive (Lokshop have a 5-pack for €108.40 export price), and it includes the lamp.

What other alternatives are there?

I have a CS2, BTW...
Cheers,
Damon
Offline davemr  
#2 Posted : 21 July 2009 18:48:05(UTC)
davemr


Joined: 09/02/2009(UTC)
Posts: 983
Location: ,
Viessmann have a new combined decoder and motor which they say will be available in August. I expect it is on their website.
davemr
Offline Caplin  
#3 Posted : 21 July 2009 18:59:40(UTC)
Caplin


Joined: 23/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 2,497
Location: Denmark
One thing to consider is that Märklin parts cannot be supplied from independent power sources, they take track current, whereas the Viesmann decoders have the possibillity of both ways.
I bought M* at first until I realized this and since then I have been buying V*.
Regards,
Benny - Outsider and MFDWPL

UserPostedImage
Offline dalym001  
#4 Posted : 21 July 2009 19:28:38(UTC)
dalym001


Joined: 22/05/2008(UTC)
Posts: 67
Location: London,
I don't know of any alternative point motors (solenoids / mechanisms) myself that are specifically for C-track but I'd bet someone on the forum does.

Compared to other point motors for other brands of track I don't think the Marklin ones for C-track are really significantly more expensive but I do think they are worth the money. At least that is since the revisions made to them around 2002 I have found them to be very reliable. The older motors weren't as good and all of mine had failed and been replaced within 10 years (many of them failed within the first 2 years or so).

If you are looking at point motors that are not specifically for C-track and you are prepared to do some fitting work then you could open up a whole range of possibilities but I couldn't advise on that as I am a fan of the 74490 motors.

When it comes to decoders then it is worth considering your options in my opinion. The biggest advantage with the k83 decoders is that you can wire things up after the track is laid and change addresses at will if needed. You could also control your points from a different digital controller if you'd like. Or if you perhaps didn't have enough money for decoders initially then you can add k83s later. Then there is the overall cost advantage - one k83 can control 4 point motors and costs only a few euros more than a single 74460 which of course controls only 1.

I personally preferred to use the built in decoders to save my time on wiring and most of my decoders are Marklin 74460, but I have also used a fair number of the Viessmann equivalent which are half the price of the M* ones and just as good. The difference (and possibly an advantage) is that the Viessmann ones are multi-protocol, but be aware that they need to be programmed (with your CS2 or equivalent) before use as opposed to simply setting the dip switches of the M* decoders.

Viessmann also makes a clone of the k83 which again is just as good as the M* one but I don't think it is multi-protocol - I have a number of these in use but I have never checked for support of any protocol other than MM.

The last feature of the Viessmann decoders (both the single point version for under the track and the k83 version) that sets them apart is the ability for them to get driving power from an external source. Use of this facility requires planning ahead for the under track decoders though as they can only get their power from one source - either the track OR the external power supply - you need to decide up front. The under-track version though still always gets its digital control signal from the track.

My favourite approach is the M* motors with the Viessmann under-track decoders as they are quick to program and I power them from the track to save myself all the wiring. If you aren't lazy like me and you don't mind wiring then I would really recommend the k83 decoders (either M* or Viessmann) instead.
Offline davemr  
#5 Posted : 21 July 2009 19:40:49(UTC)
davemr


Joined: 09/02/2009(UTC)
Posts: 983
Location: ,
Viessmann point motors are made for C track and fit under the road bed. The new combined motor and decoder will also be made for C track. Their catalogue gives details and item numbers etc.
davemr
Offline Bookfwe  
#6 Posted : 21 July 2009 20:21:40(UTC)
Bookfwe


Joined: 29/06/2002(UTC)
Posts: 38
Location: Wynnewood, Pennsylvania
I am still old school and have the 6021. How do I program the decoder and motor number if I do not have a CS2?
Offline dalym001  
#7 Posted : 24 July 2009 20:19:51(UTC)
dalym001


Joined: 22/05/2008(UTC)
Posts: 67
Location: London,
The V* under-track decoder (5231) almost programs itself. You can program it with any digital controller, including the 6021, but with the 6021 you must (obviously) also have a keyboard (M* 6040) connected.

First, fit the motor to the underside of the C-track turnout.

Then connect the decoder wires to the motor and to the track spade connectors but *don't* fix the decoder to the underside of the turnout yet.

Next, the decoder has a micro push button on it so you connect the turnout to your 6021 (or other) digital controller, either directly or temporarily at some point on your layout, while leaving the decoder accessible so that you can press the micro button.

Then, with the 6021 switched on and powering the turnout, you press the micro button once and the decoder will indicate that it is functioning and waiting for a programming signal by flicking the turnout a few times.

You then press the button on the keyboard corresponding to the point number that you want to program the decoder to and when the decoder detects that signal it will flick the turnout a few times again to indicate that it has programmed itself to that address.

Finally, you fix the decoder firmly to the underside of the turnout and you're done.
Offline Bookfwe  
#8 Posted : 25 July 2009 03:25:00(UTC)
Bookfwe


Joined: 29/06/2002(UTC)
Posts: 38
Location: Wynnewood, Pennsylvania
Thanks dalym001, that was a big help. Hopefully I will by a CS2 soon. Now all I have to do is wait for Viessmann to send the decoders to dealers. That may take some time.
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