Well, we'll know for sure tomorrow. But I think you're right. Can't be in the Banks interest not to be present there.

Well as I've said in another thread I try not to pre-order anymore. And due to some heavy purchasing last night of C-track my budget for 2009 has also taken some beating.
But I'll find some money somehow (although it will put my marriage to test [B)]). There are many nice Era III stuff in the news for 2009 that I want. And I don't doubt anymore that we'll see them.

/Torbjörn

PS; I don't regret buying all that C-track. It was long overdue and finally I have all the track I need to be able to build a good sized layout. That's the problem with all new great locos. You want them all, and when it's time to buy track and accessories all the money are gone...

Well you're right John. Of course there are problems. And even if Märklin is able to start all over again, some of the fundamental problems which lead to this bankrupcy will of course remain. And I personally believe that the future of MRR will never be that bright. How many in this forum are below 25 years old?

But with the right MD and management (together with a sound long-term strategy) and with some less debts, I think the old lady can be able to "stagger on" for a couple of years more...

/Torbjörn

John, you being American should know that "bankrupt" is never that simple. Just think of "Chapter 11" vs "Chapter 7".
There's "administration", "receivership", and "liquidation", all of which cover a huge range of actions.

I'm not an accountant, and I don't read German, but if the Yoda-ese translation of Der Speigel article is even approximately correct, Märklin will continue to trade "for the time being"...
and discussions continue...

Of course, Damon and Ron - no one can know at the time being ...

But looking at the world's current state of economy I doubt there are many options
So at the end of the day creditors oughta be glad for getting 10 cents for one euro from China [xx(]

Lionel did better in its years of bankruptcy than it did before or after.

KINGSBRIDGE and GOLDMAN SACHS are grasshoppers, that simple. Talk about risk capital
Such capital investors buy weak companies, pep 'em up -> only to sell them later.
Big business, made billions in the past. In M's case they installed lousy managers -> BANG ... [}:)]

John, maybe not. Please check the "famous" bankrupt getting a second change, and not doing to bad afterwards. (the American dream)

Abraham Lincoln ,Thomas Jefferson, Ulysses S. Grant, Mark Twain, Burt Reynolds, Larry King, Mike Tyson, Charles Goodyear, Francis Ford Coppola, Henry Ford, H.J. Heinz, Conrad Hilton.

http://www.iowabankruptcyguide...._and_bankrupt/index.html

So the question is, is a second, third or what ever only valid for America or is it also true for elsewhere. I'm for one hope so.

Pieter - we all hope the best for MARKLIN - it's our brand, anyway

If Marklin stays together as a company, I feel that a few things will change. Perhaps they will stop making repair parts for models that have been out of production for years (I will be sad to see that, but it is certainly not profitable). They also should concentrate on their core business (loks and coaches) and let the electronics (decoders, controllers) go to companies that specialize in it. There is really no need for a Marklin brand on these. One other possibility is to outsource or completely sell off the track production.. I'm sure there are other sectors that will be on the chopping block.

Right, I received official info from my dealer. His export manager @M was in a lunch time meeting between banks and M upper management: business as usual for 1 or 2 weeks, under bank management and see how Nürnberg goes in terms of preorders. If it is up to a given level, the bank will let it go and extend credit. If it is not, the bank will move to ask for liquidation.

So.... those who can, given the recession (bad timing...), order and preorder some more. There's not much to loose, anyway. If M shuts down, orders are cancelled, otherwise we'll just pay for the models we'll receive.

Luis...that is certainly not good news. Depends on how high the bank's expectations are for preorders.

What Armando and I have been commmenting on is the fact that Maerklin should not have shut itself off from those modellers who have chosen to move to these high detail 1:87 modern coaches.

It never ceases to amaze me that people throw knives at others who propose change. It is called evolution and entities who refuse to evolve often become extinct. Yes, there is a nostalgia about the 24cm coaches and M Track. I think that M should have at least released radius 3 and 4 M Track.

Many modellers took the chance and switched to K or C Track and are now running their Maerklin loks with 1:87 coaches and loving it.
Maerklin cut itself out of this market.

We never said that Maerklin should completely abandon the basic models, but that it should have competed for the scale market as well.

I started out with 5100/5200 and 5130 radii, migrated to K Track (Radius 4 and 5) and more recently into C Track. I got my first 1:87 coach (Liliput SBB Bcm) in 1971. I used to love the way it clacked against the pantograph masts on my 5100 loop. I jumped into 1:87 when I saw the Roco SBB Eurofimas in the 1980s. My collection now includes over 150 1:87 coaches, including SBB EW I, EWII, EWIII, EWIV, EC, UIC as well as DB, FS, SNCF, SNCB, NS, OBB and CNL Coaches, representing about 30 consists of about 5 coaches each.
If Maerklin would have made such models, I would have likely have bought those. That is how Maerklin lost money that could have gone into their coffers and I am just one out of thousands of modellers worldwide. Look at the growth of Roco and how today, almost every Lok is also available for 3-Rail AC. A few year's back, risky management put Roco into bankruptcy. Today, it continues to grow, albeit on a safer course than before.

So, if you are going to tell me that I am one of a minority, it is possible that there are more modellers who still have their classic layouts and can't run the longer coaches, but a proper campaign to market the new scale would have helped increase the sales of the new product. Some people were resistant to the idea of change.

Now it's too late and I hope that whatever emerges out of the ashes of this situation will be more open to evolution. Maerklin cannot survive based only on sales to existing clientele. It needs to compete in the overall model train market.

Regards

Mike C

M* chairman Jeltes from M* NL was just live on Dutch radio from NüRNBERG Messe and said M* D chairman wil visit the Messe tomorrow to tell about the future. Jeltes expects business to continue somehow.
Let's hope so.
regards, Henk

Lutz:

Sir, thank you for being a voice of reason amidst these troubling times.

With all of this doom and gloom regarding Maerklin it doesn`t help when others try to speculate over what is going on. My own thoughts regarding this whole affair is that the company will survive... somehow.

James

Thanks for the link, Hans.

I see Bigboy still production.

I cannot believe that you are under the impression that M has these problems because it does fix these trivial issues.

Read carefully M's press release - and learn how grasshoppers do business

Bankruptcy includes Märklin Holding Gmbh Göppingen, Gebr. Märklin & Cie Gmbh and
Trix Modelleisenbahn Gmbh & Co. KG. Period. All German companies of low til zero value.
Now it comes clear why K installed monkey managers - Germany was always on the "list".
To make a point - they got rid of all their "problems" with the stroke of a pen ...

Marklin Hungaria isn't involved at all in the disaster. Are M's valuables there
Brand rights, name rights, moulds, machines, and most of the actual products
M Germany is dead - long live M Hungary. Darn clever beasts, those little hoppers [}:)][}:)][}:)]

http://produktadmin.maer...emitteilung_Maerklin.pdf

What you to say John is that they have a not so important company there, with not so much value so as to absorb that toxicity?

What I do say, Nikos - KINGSBRIDGE CAPITAL and GOLDMAN SACHS have done their homework well.
Now they got rid of expensive Germany they can produce for low money in Hungary and China [}:)]

Let's say it won't matter at all what countries you or me do like, Nikos.
Since this is where all marklins will come - from now on ... [}:)]

Exactly the same for me!

Last year I bought 2 new trains: 2 Roco's. Over the last 4 years I bought an entire Uhlenbrock Intellibox system + Lissy, with Viessman decoders, catenary and signals because M* failed to deliver her CS1 and ignored my emails with request for information. In fact the only thing I have bougth from M* recently is K-Track!!

And to be honnest, I have never been happier with my MRR hobby ever since I decided to buy other brands as well. Instead of one M* loco a year, I can afford two Roco's now, which are often better looking, just as reliable and offer a much wider level of detail. It really gives me the idea that I own a model instead of a toy, forgive my words.

Doesn't this make me sad hearing of their bankrupcy? Of course I it does. I have good memories of Marklin. But I think Marklin should have done a lot more tham exploit her heritage and our memories. Do we really need a tool-line with a Marklin logo? Do we really need viessmann catanary and lamp posts in a Marklin box? Did we really needed military modells from Marklin? Did they really thought people would buy everything when it has a Marklin logo on it? I dont think so.

They souldn't have been so arrogant to ignore their quality problems, with the typical: "We know nothing of such things". I don't give two cents for the "made in germany" image if my €300 + brand new train burns its sound decoder at the first ride and suffers from alzheimer and has to be returned for 3 months to be repaired.

Lets hope they make a fresh new start, with a owner who is truely interested in MMR, like Roco did.

I forgot a not after the "these".

In Hungary they produce tracks, as i have heard. If that is correct that means that track production will not be affected?

Lutz' last posting informing us about the appointment of Mr Pluta as manager for the insolvency adjudication is appreciated. This information was not included in the latest information that I could obtain from internet TV.

If Pluta can manage to exempt the Hungarian operations from the bankruptcy of Maerklin Holdings, this will help the owners (Kingsbridge) to retain the name and the identity of the company.
When Roco went bankrupt, the rescue firm had to use the name Modelleisenbahn GmBH and could not use the logo as developed by the former administration.
As I stated, we will have to see what will happen in the next few weeks. From what I read, Mr. Pluta's Statement included no mention of whether production will continue or whether it has been halted for the duration of this process. I am sure that Maerklin's presence at the Messe will be more a PR exercise rather than business as usual.

Regards

Mike C