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Offline Brakepad  
#1 Posted : 18 March 2009 22:45:47(UTC)
Brakepad

France, Metropolitan   
Joined: 25/08/2008(UTC)
Posts: 633
Location: Montlouis sur Loire, France
Hi,

Actually I own several steamers which have a smoke unit factory fitted (i.e BR44 3047, BR01 3048, and BR 85 don't know which number)

Most of the time, when I use them, I do not use smoke fluid (most of the times, I just "test run" them).

I wonder if the smoke unit can get damaged if I keep on using these locomotives without smoke fluid.

Any advices? Any thoughts? Any suggestions?

Many thanks!
check out http://maerklin-back-on-track.blogspot.com if you like to see how old Märklin locos are brought back into life! (in spanish by the moment)
Offline sudibarba  
#2 Posted : 19 March 2009 02:09:29(UTC)
sudibarba

United States   
Joined: 28/07/2006(UTC)
Posts: 876
Location: Augusta, GA USA
I don't have that many smoke units, but, when they are empty are they still consumming current? I assume so as I assume it is just a heated cup. Anyway, I have been planning to move mine to a function control when i get around to it.
Eric
Offline nevw  
#3 Posted : 19 March 2009 02:59:57(UTC)
nevw

Australia   
Joined: 27/08/2005(UTC)
Posts: 11,065
Location: Murrumba Downs QLD
All of my steamers bar one have smoke units. They are controlled by a function so can be turned on or Off.
I have one that has a 6090 decoder and the only function is the lights. I am considering replacing the decoder and then install a smoker

I believe that running them without oil and turned on could cause enough heat to damage the plastic .

Nev
wearing the Pink Pinny, which is hard to see and now have 2 new shiny tin Hips that is badly in Need of Repair matching tin shoulders
and a hose pipe on the aorta
Junior member of the Banana Club, a reformist and an old Goat with a Bad memory, loafing around
Offline river6109  
#4 Posted : 19 March 2009 12:14:41(UTC)
river6109

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 14,006
Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
It normally does'nt damage the smoke unti.
It may get blocked and there are tools to clean it and there is usually a spare tube in case the original one is getting worn.
For future references it would be advisable not to use the smoke unit when emty.
Analog locos = lift up smoke generator slightly.
Digital locos: tuurn off function

regards.,
John
https://www.youtube.com/river6109
https://www.youtube.com/6109river
5 years in Destruction mode
50 years in Repairing mode
Offline banco  
#5 Posted : 19 March 2009 12:34:44(UTC)
banco


Joined: 20/06/2005(UTC)
Posts: 121
Location: The Netherlands
I have the following observations and thoughts:

If smoke units are non function controlled ( eg delta etc ) then they will consume electricity constantly when the loco is on: The following ideas arise

If the unit functions without the fluid , then there will be energy put into the unit without some energy being removed due to the fluid being vapourised. Now assuming that the unit is not regulated to avoid this then this will cause the unit to heat up to a temperature higher than if it is losing energy to evaportate smoke. This means that it could be running above its recommended temperature. This could lead to problems with life expectancy or if there is any residue left it could cook it to prduce debris in the tube. Along woth this could come heating of the body work. ( Maybe not too much of a problem with a metal body) .

I'm open to comments .........

Maybe I should remind myself that it is our hobby and we do this for fun and it is not a Science exam but.........
C track,6021,large digital loft layout modelled in the legendary European land of "Moresnet"
Offline WelshMatt  
#6 Posted : 19 March 2009 13:46:31(UTC)
WelshMatt


Joined: 06/10/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,345
Location: ,
I think banco has a point - I have some G scale locos with smoke units and I can remember the general advice from the enthusiast fraternity was not to run them empty. Certainly when wiring a decoder I always put the smoke unit on a function output so it can be turned off when not needed. It stands to reason that unless there's some sort of thermal cut-out they will get hotter as there's no oil to vapourise and take some of the heat away.
Matt from Wales.

When you pay Range Rover prices, don't accept Lada quality
Offline atilla  
#7 Posted : 19 March 2009 14:53:14(UTC)
atilla


Joined: 13/11/2008(UTC)
Posts: 381
Location: Richmond, Virginia
Just a thought; but, I would think they would be engineered to not harm the loco under any circumstances. It seems reasonable that machinery that is potentially operated by children would have to compensate for operation without smoke fluid. Marklin and smoke generators have been around for a long time and the only safety concerns that I've read involve using something other than their smoke generating fluid, operating sets outdoors in the rain, and to be mindful that electricity can be dangerous in general.

With that said, and mindful that engineers do not always do the right thing, is there a history of damage from smoke units?
Offline Writhdar  
#8 Posted : 19 March 2009 17:22:07(UTC)
Writhdar


Joined: 19/12/2008(UTC)
Posts: 207
Location: Durango, Colorado
From my very limited experience, John's advice seems the best course to follow.

I have an 7226 smoke unit from the '80's which I just put in a BR 50 (smoke generator is controlled digitally) - it works fine. I cleaned it with the needle before installing it. Now, I had used this same smoke unit in the '80's on a 3082, in an analog mode. Sometimes I added smoke fluid, other times I didn't. What I experienced then was that the smoke unit's performance started degrading over time. So my conclusion then was that the constant heating of the unit probably accelerated residue buildup.

Dan
Offline ac jacko  
#9 Posted : 23 May 2010 15:23:21(UTC)
ac jacko


Joined: 09/04/2010(UTC)
Posts: 897
Location: Gawler South Australia
Gents I have a query with smoke units for Model 3089 as servicing manual states " Suethe No 8 smoke generator" and I am unable to locate this anywhere. Is there a generic version available? Also my Model 3003 used to have a smoke unit from memory Confused and if so can anyone help on this query will be appreicated.

On a side note, went to marklin Club meeting on Friday and the 3003 ran no problems after 28 yrs in the box. The 3048 and 3084 ran fantasticly great and I meet Dusan and Snafu in there as well.

Offline rschaffr  
#10 Posted : 23 May 2010 17:40:12(UTC)
rschaffr

United States   
Joined: 03/01/2003(UTC)
Posts: 5,174
Location: Southern New Jersey, USA
ac jacko wrote:
Gents I have a query with smoke units for Model 3089 as servicing manual states " Suethe No 8 smoke generator" and I am unable to locate this anywhere. Is there a generic version available? Also my Model 3003 used to have a smoke unit from memory Confused and if so can anyone help on this query will be appreicated.

...




Here is the Seuthe 8 at the LokShop\:
http://ssl.lokshop.de/pr...67&products_id=68732

Also see my scan of the complete Seuthe range:

http://www.sem-co.com/~r...trains/images/seuthe.jpg
-Ron
Digital, Epoch IV-V(K-track/IB), Epoch III(C-track/6021/6036/6051)
http://www.sem-co.com/~rschaffr/trains/trains.html
Offline ac jacko  
#11 Posted : 24 May 2010 14:13:03(UTC)
ac jacko


Joined: 09/04/2010(UTC)
Posts: 897
Location: Gawler South Australia
rschaffr wrote:
ac jacko wrote:
Gents I have a query with smoke units for Model 3089 as servicing manual states " Suethe No 8 smoke generator" and I am unable to locate this anywhere. Is there a generic version available? Also my Model 3003 used to have a smoke unit from memory Confused and if so can anyone help on this query will be appreicated.

...




Here is the Seuthe 8 at the LokShop\:
http://ssl.lokshop.de/pr...67&products_id=68732

Also see my scan of the complete Seuthe range:

http://www.sem-co.com/~r...trains/images/seuthe.jpg


Thanks rschaffr, as i was reading the lokshop and is the unit for analog? Also is the seuthe 10 the replacement for the 7226 smoke genrators? Thanks again

cheers Dale
Offline H0  
#12 Posted : 24 May 2010 15:45:08(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 14,630
Location: DE-NW
ac jacko wrote:
Also is the seuthe 10 the replacement for the 7226 smoke genrators?

The other way around: Märklin sell Seuthe #10 as Märklin #7226.
Same smoke generator, but different accessories.

My tip: buy at least one from Seuthe directly, they include a syringe that makes filling the smoke fluid pretty easy.

Smoke generators marked for "10-16 V ~" are for analog operation (and for digital operation if smoke generator can be switched off).
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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