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Digital Conversion of a Delta Ae 8/14 - PC Board Part #?
 Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC) Posts: 2,976 Location: CA, USA
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Hi everyone,
I was hoping someone had a shortcut for me. I have an old delta Ae 8/14 I would like to digitize. I have the motor components already, but I know there was a good shortcut where you could just buy the PC board from/for the Trix equivalent of the locomotive, which had an 8pin (may have been 21) NEM socket, thus allowing for a direct swap, lighting and all. Then pop a decoder in and go.
Does anyone happen to know that decoder board number, or where I can source one? The Trix database does not seem to go back far enough to give the part diagrams/numbers.
Any help is appreciated! |
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 Joined: 04/02/2011(UTC) Posts: 3,559 Location: Paris, France
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 1 user liked this useful post by JohnjeanB
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Joined: 10/02/2021(UTC) Posts: 3,887 Location: Michigan, Troy
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I have not seen the inards of one, but I doubt that the Delta version has a pin type board.I knew a guy who bought one new back in the early 90s, so first version. He had a 6021, so I think it was digital. He was having motor sync issues between the two motors.
That said, a shortcut may not be wise. I'm sure you'll get better input going forward.
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 Joined: 08/03/2006(UTC) Posts: 1,042 Location: Gold Coast, Australia.
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[img]  [/img] [img]  [/img] [img]  [/img] Converted using Luessi PCB boards & at the time Loksound V3.5 decoder. Plenty of space to work with. |
D.A.Banks |
2 users liked this useful post by Dave Banks
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Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,801 Location: Crozet, Virginia
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I have also used Luessi PCBs to upgrade locos and they work great.
That is what I would do in your situation. |
Regards,
Jim
I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains!
So many trains and so little time. |
1 user liked this useful post by dickinsonj
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Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC) Posts: 2,976 Location: CA, USA
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Thanks guys! Not sure why I had trix in mind, Luessi is what I needed! |
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 Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC) Posts: 3,298 Location: Patagonia
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they are great, i have used the PCB with a 21mtc interface and putted a loksoun on it.
Also bought the light platine, so i have the swiss light configuration and also a red tail light
regards |
 German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL |
3 users liked this useful post by franciscohg
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Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC) Posts: 2,976 Location: CA, USA
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Hi guys,
The Luessi board came, and I put it straight to work. I have a bit of an issue though, and was hoping for your thoughts before I start un-doing things:
The board went right in with a Lokpilot 4.0 MFX, and the motor(s) run and reverse as they should (after sorting the green and blue directional leads, which I always seem to get backwards!). The lights on both sides come on and off upon F0 command, but the problem is they seem stuck on the single white "tail light" mode on both sides.
The black wires between locomotives I have doublechecked. I believe they are indeed all in order, going to the parallel solder pad on the opposite opposite board. Which is where they originally were, unless I made a mistake.
Extra background information:
- This was originally a delta locomotive
- I did pull two black wires with suppressors/condensers, which did not seem to have a home in the Luessi wiring. Perhaps that relates to the issue? I was assuming they were AC motor coil accessories to be discarded
- I've traced the boards for continuity. Everything seems to line up end-to-end. I don't get that from the yellow and grey wires, but presumably that is due to the diodes and resistors. They do have continuity to the point of the resistors/diodes on either side, and I've traced the circuit between them
- I Have another Ae 8/14 with factory MFX and a newer PCB. I've traced continuity on that with the same results and patterns. (including nothing from the yellow/grey)
Does anyone have an idea what might be wrong here? I don't think it can be the decoder because the F0 on/off is functioning |
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Joined: 10/02/2021(UTC) Posts: 3,887 Location: Michigan, Troy
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So no double headlights at all, only a Swiss taillight?
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Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC) Posts: 2,976 Location: CA, USA
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Correct, 2 swiss taillights at all times (one on each side), regardless of direction |
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1 user liked this useful post by 5HorizonsRR
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Joined: 08/03/2006(UTC) Posts: 1,042 Location: Gold Coast, Australia.
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You may need to place this loco on a piece of track connected to a "lok programmer" & change the lighting box "ticks" to suit on /off & direction. Just a thought. |
D.A.Banks |
1 user liked this useful post by Dave Banks
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Joined: 30/01/2006(UTC) Posts: 1,893 Location: Keene, NH
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John-I converted one of these for a friend many years ago. Generally speaking, with his boards, he uses Aux1 for the Swiss lighting effect. I would check and see if somehow this is reversed. |
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1 user liked this useful post by mmervine
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Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC) Posts: 14,875 Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
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I'm still working on mine, with all the wires going from loco A to loco B sound decoder and self made adapter plate, I stopped half way through and now forgot which wire is which, I most probably start again this week and follow the wires, the model is a bit complicated as it is or was a DC model and I've converted it to AC., there have been many additions, like step lights and cab lights also interior machine room., Led's with Swiss light functions
John |
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Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC) Posts: 2,976 Location: CA, USA
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Thanks everyone!
I was under the impression this board was has the swiss lighting built-in. I hadn't thought that it still needs the programming.
I have disconnected the lighting from one side of the loco to the other as a test: same issue (tail light in both directions, and no changeover to headlight). This means the issue is not the connection between locomotives.
I also tested the diodes and the resistors on the board- all ok.
Lastly, I tried another decoder, despite doubting that to be the issue. That wasn't it either...
Dave/Pefu/Francisco - did you need to program the lighting on yours? |
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Joined: 08/03/2006(UTC) Posts: 1,042 Location: Gold Coast, Australia.
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I had the board at the time that did not offer all the new features that are available with your latest one but to answer your question the board will not be at fault I think. I rather think it will be the ESU decoder that just needs tweaking. Is yours with sound? As I have a Lok programmer I am sure I would have tinkered with the settings to suit & put the correct sound profile on it. The beauty of having one is you can save the program of that loco & send it off to someone who might have a similar loco & he can adjust all setting to match his & once you receive it back you can program your decoder to that tweaked profile. Its a lot of fun. |
D.A.Banks |
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Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC) Posts: 2,976 Location: CA, USA
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Thanks Dave! I do indeed have a programmer, but I think the issue is within my wiring, or less likely, the board.
For fun, I swapped the headlight and taillight wires (yellow and grey) at both ends of the locomotive. (specifically, where they attach to the PC boards) I then had directional taillights. Knowing this, it means the lights were indeed working properly: it was the bulb which is always on in either direction I was experiencing.
Which leads me to the next learning: the other LEDs may be blown out? They aren't working on a 2v direct DC test. So they are likely toast. A voltmeter test measured 16.5v DC to the lead: which surely must have blown them. OR, were they already blown, and 16.5v is the voltage reading on the circuit itself since the LED/diode is broken? The 16.5v is working directionally, so "control" is ok, but the voltage is obviously not correct
I just need to sort whether a new light board will solve it, or whether the Luessi board is the culprit...
I did not test the original delta lighting before conversion, as it is the last thing I'd have thought to do. |
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Joined: 08/03/2006(UTC) Posts: 1,042 Location: Gold Coast, Australia.
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Ok I see a problem. ESU wiring is as follows: Orange = Motor terminal right Yellow = Rear light "electronic negative" Green = F1 Black = Ground Grey = Motor terminal Left Blue = Electronic positive Red = Pickup shoe Violet = F2 White = Front light "electronic negative" The two brown wires = Speakers As in all Swiss Locos that I have of that ERA there is only one tail light operating & that is Right rear. Please see Video Clip towards the end. [img]  [/img] [img]  [/img] [img]  [/img] [img]  [/img] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VR7yezuFv2Ihttps://luessi.ch/pdf/8088_en.pdf |
D.A.Banks |
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Joined: 30/01/2006(UTC) Posts: 1,893 Location: Keene, NH
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Slight correction to the above, but only a technical point. The blue wire is the electronic positive and the white and yellow for the lights are actually electronic negative. |
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1 user liked this useful post by mmervine
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Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC) Posts: 2,976 Location: CA, USA
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Thanks gents. Studying Dave's images, this thing should be working. (the yellow and grey I was referring to were the Marklin color, not the ESU/NEM colors) A few images are below. In brief, R1 and R3 are taking ~16v down to ~2v. R2 and R4 do not seem to be taking the voltage down at all from 16.5v. That being said, when I measure the resistance on R2 and R4 they each come in at their marked 1200ohms. So I'm not sure if R2 and R4 are bad, or if the voltage reading is 16.5v due to a broken circuit/broken LEDs, and the board is fine. Or if it is supposed to be that reading (clearly I am not an electronics expert) I tried another decoder just to eliminate a variable, and results are the same Testing the LEDs on their own, they are indeed blown out on the grey (Marklin) wire color LEDs. So I need the parts regardless, the question is whether the Luessi board (or its resistors) are no good.    |
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2 users liked this useful post by 5HorizonsRR
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Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC) Posts: 2,976 Location: CA, USA
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Hi all,
I took out my other AE 8/14, a Marklin 37596, and compared lighting circuits tonight. The results give some hints:
Both Locomotives:
Tail light circuit measuring ~1.8v to the LED.
Headlights:
- working Marklin 37596 measured 3.8v to the two additional headlight LEDS, which is also in line with the ~1.8 per LED
- Broken 33591 with Luessi board measured ~16.5v to the two (blown out) headlight LEDS
- Both locomotives are reversing and turning off the headlight circuit accordingly.
So I am near-positive the Luessi board has a problem/is no good, and therefore blew the headlight LEDs. The question is where/how so I can somehow try and rectify this. The diode shouldn't impact that, so I look to the resistors or the decoder output. I already tried a decoder swap, so that shouldnt be it.
So the question: how can I test the resistors to confirm they aren't working. (or they are working and it is something else) |
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Joined: 08/03/2006(UTC) Posts: 1,042 Location: Gold Coast, Australia.
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I suggest you ask Luessi directly quoting what board version you have. He will have the solution for you. I have never heard of one of his boards failing but there is always a first time. https://luessi.ch/index.php?language=en#servicesCheers Dave... Enquiries For enquiries please contact Rainer Lussi in confidence Telephone: +41 79 426 93 09 Lüssi GmbH Obere Espilibuck 4 8226 Schleitheim Switzerland |
D.A.Banks |
1 user liked this useful post by Dave Banks
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Joined: 20/03/2024(UTC) Posts: 1 Location: Utah, SLC/Provo
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Wow, talk about finding exactly what I was looking for!
I had a Trix AE 8/14 - 22580 - that I bought new like 24/25 years ago. I sold it, but have now acquired a NOS Trix 22580. I am contemplating doing this very same upgrade. These boards make this look a lot easier. I intend to use a single LokSound V5 decoder and a speaker in each end.
I know this being a Trix model it is somewhat different than a Marklin model. I hope someone can tell me if I need these little lighting boards. Also, which kit would I use to upgrade to 5 pole motors?
Thanks much! This will be a fun project to upgrade my favorite Swiss locomotive model.
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1 user liked this useful post by HenrikN
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Digital Conversion of a Delta Ae 8/14 - PC Board Part #?
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