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Offline cancan  
#1 Posted : 03 May 2020 13:30:10(UTC)
cancan

Turkey   
Joined: 19/06/2012(UTC)
Posts: 4
Location: Istanbul
Hi everbody , I m glad to come back to my hobby after 2 years.

So How to soldering with cable for current between C track and K Track ?

Many Thanks for your tips and help.
Offline JohnjeanB  
#2 Posted : 03 May 2020 14:33:08(UTC)
JohnjeanB

France   
Joined: 04/02/2011(UTC)
Posts: 894
Location: Paris, France
Hi Cancan (Funny fist nameBigGrin )

Welcome to the forum.
Soldering on C track, on the spade connectors (under the rail) is easy
K track soldering: on the joiner or on the center stud after having removed the black treatment.
Soldering on the rails (both C and K) since they are stainless steel you need "soldering water" (Lötwasser /eau à souder)) or phosphoric acid, then it becomes easy.
Cheers
Jean
My lay-out videos
latest vid
humping yard
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by JohnjeanB
Offline DaleSchultz  
#3 Posted : 03 May 2020 14:53:57(UTC)
DaleSchultz

United States   
Joined: 10/02/2006(UTC)
Posts: 3,358
for the rails, solder on the track joiners.
Dale
Intellibox + own software, K-Track
My current layout: https://cabin-layout.mixmox.com
Arrival and Departure signs: https://remotesign.mixmox.com
Offline cancan  
#4 Posted : 03 May 2020 17:19:17(UTC)
cancan

Turkey   
Joined: 19/06/2012(UTC)
Posts: 4
Location: Istanbul
Thank you for your answers but I mean current connection with cable
Offline JohnjeanB  
#5 Posted : 03 May 2020 17:41:35(UTC)
JohnjeanB

France   
Joined: 04/02/2011(UTC)
Posts: 894
Location: Paris, France
Sorry but I don't understand what is your question:
- connection between C and K tracks? You have transition tracks.
- connection to power?
- connection to M S88?
Jean
My lay-out videos
latest vid
humping yard
Offline cancan  
#6 Posted : 03 May 2020 18:20:12(UTC)
cancan

Turkey   
Joined: 19/06/2012(UTC)
Posts: 4
Location: Istanbul
Sorry , soldering cable can be made under C n K track , because distance is not suitable for adaptor track (24922 )
Offline JohnjeanB  
#7 Posted : 03 May 2020 18:40:55(UTC)
JohnjeanB

France   
Joined: 04/02/2011(UTC)
Posts: 894
Location: Paris, France
So you need
- a red cable soldered on the K track center stud plate and on the C track to the B spade connector
- a brown cable soldered on the K track joiner(s) and on the C track to the O spade connector
See below a C track and its spade connectors
C Track.jpg
Cheers
Jean
My lay-out videos
latest vid
humping yard
thanks 2 users liked this useful post by JohnjeanB
Offline cancan  
#8 Posted : 03 May 2020 22:29:52(UTC)
cancan

Turkey   
Joined: 19/06/2012(UTC)
Posts: 4
Location: Istanbul
Very Thank You for answer and tips I will try this method
Offline Bigdaddynz  
#9 Posted : 04 May 2020 02:04:47(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 17,249
Location: New Zealand
Originally Posted by: JohnjeanB Go to Quoted Post
Soldering on the rails (both C and K) since they are stainless steel you need "soldering water" (Lötwasser /eau à souder)) or phosphoric acid, then it becomes easy.


i.e. You need to use soldering flux. I have some soldering flux in a nearly full bottle that my dad had, and my dad passed away 42 years ago! That particular flux is quite corrosive, I've had it turn K track rails into a pile of rust so I don't use it.

I got some silver based solder from a local electronics store which included a small bottle of flux which works well but isn't corrosive. I've also heard that using solder with a higher silver content works better on stainless steel, which is why I got the solder in the first place.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Bigdaddynz
Offline JohnjeanB  
#10 Posted : 04 May 2020 13:44:28(UTC)
JohnjeanB

France   
Joined: 04/02/2011(UTC)
Posts: 894
Location: Paris, France
Originally Posted by: Bigdaddynz Go to Quoted Post

i.e. You need to use soldering flux. I have some soldering flux in a nearly full bottle that my dad had, and my dad passed away 42 years ago! That particular flux is quite corrosive, I've had it turn K track rails into a pile of rust so I don't use it.

Hi
In the old days (1965 or so) soldering was using strange and very dangerous products. I had an alcali bloc posed on the ground (used to clean soldering irons) that would bite/corrode all nearby aluminum parts. It would certainly be forbidden now.
The product I mention is recent and complies with European laws and I have observed no corrosion with regular solder for electronics
Phosphoric acid is used in car body repairs to clean steel and protect it from corrosion
Cheers
Jean
My lay-out videos
latest vid
humping yard
Offline DaleSchultz  
#11 Posted : 04 May 2020 14:04:43(UTC)
DaleSchultz

United States   
Joined: 10/02/2006(UTC)
Posts: 3,358
I don't understand all this talk of soldering onto St St. rail using flux and special compounds. Every end of every track has a rail joiner that can be soldered without any problems. Why make life so difficult?
Dale
Intellibox + own software, K-Track
My current layout: https://cabin-layout.mixmox.com
Arrival and Departure signs: https://remotesign.mixmox.com
Offline JohnjeanB  
#12 Posted : 04 May 2020 14:36:10(UTC)
JohnjeanB

France   
Joined: 04/02/2011(UTC)
Posts: 894
Location: Paris, France
Hi Dale
I real life, when dealing with K track (flex) you have to cut it and to solder.
You may solder on rail joiners, on brass plates slipped between the rail and the sleepers (not very reliable) and of course solder on the center stud plate
My point is to insist on the ease of soldering directly on the rails (rapid and very reliable) when using soldering flux. It is a matter of past expérience and opinion.
Jean
My lay-out videos
latest vid
humping yard
Offline PMPeter  
#13 Posted : 04 May 2020 15:14:19(UTC)
PMPeter

Canada   
Joined: 04/04/2013(UTC)
Posts: 1,062
Location: Port Moody, BC
Originally Posted by: DaleSchultz Go to Quoted Post
I don't understand all this talk of soldering onto St St. rail using flux and special compounds. Every end of every track has a rail joiner that can be soldered without any problems. Why make life so difficult?


I agree with you when it comes to supplying power feeds to K track. The rail joiners and the centre stud plate are excellent for this. However, there are situations such as making contact track sections where in most cases you do have to solder on to the rails and that requires the flux as mentioned.
Offline DaleSchultz  
#14 Posted : 04 May 2020 15:21:14(UTC)
DaleSchultz

United States   
Joined: 10/02/2006(UTC)
Posts: 3,358
Originally Posted by: JohnjeanB Go to Quoted Post

I real life,


I have been using K-track since 1989 and have laid about about 372m of K tracks, so you don't have to tell me about real life as if I don't know what I am talking about. In addition, I currently have about 256 isolated sections for sensors, all soldered to rail joiners, plus addition ground feeds to the running rail between isolated sections. That is a lot of running rail connections.

Originally Posted by: JohnjeanB Go to Quoted Post

when dealing with K track (flex) you have to cut it and to solder.


I can't work out what you are trying to say here. You can cut K-track but you don't have to. And whether one cuts or or not is irrelevant to how one solders to it. I also cut non-flex K-track pieces if I need to.

Originally Posted by: JohnjeanB Go to Quoted Post

You may solder on rail joiners, on brass plates slipped between the rail and the sleepers (not very reliable) and of course solder on the center stud plate
My point is to insist on the ease of soldering directly on the rails (rapid and very reliable)


My point is your 'rapid' solution requires special flux compounds, when soldering onto the rail joiners is even faster. In addition different flux compounds can be corrosive, I don't want that stuff corroding the wires so someone has to start again after some years if they picked the wrong type.

I would never try to slip a plate under the rail to make a reliable connection.

Originally Posted by: JohnjeanB Go to Quoted Post
It is a matter of past expérience and opinion.
Jean


Clearly.



Dale
Intellibox + own software, K-Track
My current layout: https://cabin-layout.mixmox.com
Arrival and Departure signs: https://remotesign.mixmox.com
Offline DaleSchultz  
#15 Posted : 04 May 2020 15:31:38(UTC)
DaleSchultz

United States   
Joined: 10/02/2006(UTC)
Posts: 3,358
Originally Posted by: PMPeter Go to Quoted Post
However, there are situations such as making contact track sections where in most cases you do have to solder on to the rails and that requires the flux as mentioned.


Not true.

First, one can often cut on either side of a rail joiner, so the rail joiner becomes the contact solder point.

Secondlly, if one does need to make a contact point in the middle of a rail, I make one cut, slide the rail out, make the second cut, place a rail joiner where needed, slide the contact section in, through the joiner, slide the second piece back in.

In fact, if you look at flex track closely, I suspect that the original design was to do exactly this, as there are sections along the track where the 'rail clamps' have been omitted, leaving room for an additional rail joiner to be used without having to cut any of the clamps.

Years ago, I tried the direct soldering using a flux. I have also bought second hand flex tracks that had been soldered directly, and I was able to pop off the joints way too easily. Never had a soldered joint on a rail joiner fail.
Dale
Intellibox + own software, K-Track
My current layout: https://cabin-layout.mixmox.com
Arrival and Departure signs: https://remotesign.mixmox.com
Offline PMPeter  
#16 Posted : 04 May 2020 17:53:41(UTC)
PMPeter

Canada   
Joined: 04/04/2013(UTC)
Posts: 1,062
Location: Port Moody, BC
As I said "in most cases" you have to solder. I use the Fohrmann soldering oil for this and after several years I have no corrosion on any of my contact tracks where I used it.

There are obviously different ways of doing things and you have found one way and I use another.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by PMPeter
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