 Joined: 21/02/2016(UTC) Posts: 219 Location: Just north of London
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In 1923 the line was shut and the trains were sold. Is there a list stating which person/company bought which engine? There were 8 engines that were sold (according to Wikipedia) as well as wagons. My great grand father and my grand father bought one engine and some wagons, I have a photo of all of them hanging on the engine but I can't identify which type it is. I would like to recreate the train (engine and wagons) and give it to my father, he remembers it being parked at their yard.
Any help will be appreciated.
Thanks
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 Joined: 18/03/2007(UTC) Posts: 6,764 Location: Brisbane, Australia
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Originally Posted by: HO Collector  In 1923 the line was shut and the trains were sold. Is there a list ......
Any help will be appreciated.
Thanks Hi Collector, As far as I can see there were a number of railways so labelled ... including: Bayerische Ludwigsbahn Hessische Ludwigsbahn Pfälzische Ludwigsbahn Do you know which one of these or is it another? Kimball |
HO Scale - Märklin (ep II-III and VI, C Track, digital) - 2 rail HO (Queensland Australia, UK, USA) - 3 rail OO (English Hornby Dublo) - old clockwork O gauge - Live Steam 90mm (3.1/2 inch) gauge. |
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Joined: 21/02/2016(UTC) Posts: 219 Location: Just north of London
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Hello Kimble
The railway in question is the Bayerische Ludwigsbahn i.e the line between Nurnberg and Furth.
Thank you
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Joined: 18/03/2007(UTC) Posts: 6,764 Location: Brisbane, Australia
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Hello Collector, Maybe the best approach to this would be to load to this topic, a copy of that photograph of the engine. Someone here might recognize the type, and it narrows the options for finding a model to suit. Records of sale would be held by the auctioneer on the sale day - I reckon you would be lucky to find that information but there is no harm in trying. On another tack, wasn't Der Adler (a model made by Trix originally and then by Maerklin) the first locomotive on this line in 1834? So I consider it very possible that Maerklin having an interest in historical railway items for commercial purposes, may well hold further information on this line. And perhaps records of the eventual disposal of the equipment. It is a long shot. A nicely written letter to Maerklin asking if their archival/documentation section have any records of this line at the time of 1923 may elicit a response. regards Kimball Edited by user 16 October 2018 22:52:24(UTC)
| Reason: date correction |
HO Scale - Märklin (ep II-III and VI, C Track, digital) - 2 rail HO (Queensland Australia, UK, USA) - 3 rail OO (English Hornby Dublo) - old clockwork O gauge - Live Steam 90mm (3.1/2 inch) gauge. |
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 Joined: 18/02/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,334
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(edited) I don't know if this site ( http://www.kbaystb.de/ ) or the book below (as shown in the site) may help: Lokomotiven der Bayerischen Eisenbahnen - Band 1 |
Best regards,
Miguel
Mostly Märklin H0.
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Joined: 21/02/2016(UTC) Posts: 219 Location: Just north of London
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Guys
I don't ignore you. I read your replies and want to shoot the photo on the wall, but every time life intervenes and I forget. Cant do it at the evening as the parrots are asleep so the room is out of boundaries. Will try to do it tomorrow.
Thanks again for your answers.
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Joined: 21/02/2016(UTC) Posts: 219 Location: Just north of London
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 Apologies for the poor quality, however, it is a photo of a photo. The person in the cab is my great grand father and the one standing on the engine by the chimney is my great father. I checked the link that was provided but as am not speaking German I found it a bit hard (given the time available to me). Next weekend might be free so I will try to see what I can make of it. Thanks again.
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Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC) Posts: 8,475 Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
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Originally Posted by: HO Collector
I checked the link that was provided but as am not speaking German I found it a bit hard (given the time available to me). Next weekend might be free so I will try to see what I can make of it.
Thanks again.
If you are using the Chrome browser then right click on the page and select "translate to English", and you will get a good Google translation. If you have another browser then go to Google and ask it to translate the link.
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Joined: 18/03/2007(UTC) Posts: 6,764 Location: Brisbane, Australia
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Thanks for the photo Collector. The caption reads: "Last ride of the first railway in Germany 1925" What a great photo - and imagine being able to buy some of the carriages and engines - THAAT is a model railway!! Anyway that engine could possibly be repllicated by a Brawa model which I happen to own. Here is an image of the 3 rail Maerklin-compatible model. It is Brawa #40031, and you will be able to find it in 2 rail DC/DCC as well.  The first coach is very similar to an old Piko one which is widely available. The model # is likely 5-315-01-U but there are variations. Here is the picture:  Kimball |
HO Scale - Märklin (ep II-III and VI, C Track, digital) - 2 rail HO (Queensland Australia, UK, USA) - 3 rail OO (English Hornby Dublo) - old clockwork O gauge - Live Steam 90mm (3.1/2 inch) gauge. |
 2 users liked this useful post by kimballthurlow
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Joined: 21/02/2016(UTC) Posts: 219 Location: Just north of London
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Kimball
Thank you very much for the information and the photos, you made my life very easy, thanks again.
Yesterday I talked with my parents and told my father that you have identified the engine and the coach, I could hear the smile in his voice, he remembers the engine and wagons in the yard and ocesionly was allowed to play in the cab under the watcgfull eye of his father or one of the workers.
KiwiAllan
You are correct, I never remember the Google Translate (:-)), thanks for reminding me.
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1 user liked this useful post by HO Collector
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Joined: 15/10/2015(UTC) Posts: 237 Location: Brisbane, Queensland, Australia
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Hi,
Kimball's photo is close, but the Ludwigsbahn never owned an 0-6-0 tank engine. The Ludwigsbahn closed on the 31st October 1922, but it was only in 1925 that the remaining locomotives and rolling stock were sold to the Nuremberg ironmonger Hermann Hirschmann.
To remove them to his scrapyard, a train was put together with everything, and the 0-4-0 tank locomotive "Bavaria" was provisionally repaired, so that it could pull them all.
The other locomotives left at the time were:
Franconia Bn2t Maffei 1881/1248
Daniel Ley 1Bn2t Maffei 1886/1414
Johannes Scharrer II Bn2t Maffei 1887/1453
Nuremberg-Fürth II Bn2t Maffei 1889/1538
Germania 1Bn2t Maffei 1906/2511
It seems that H. Hirschmann only purchased four locomotives, so I would assume that two of the above had already been sold for scrap prior to him acquiring the rest.
Which one of them was in the picture I don't know - I suggest you contact the DB museum and ask them for further info.
Best regards
Peter |
Peter
Collecting vintage Märklin from 1935-1970, also Hornby O Gauge |
3 users liked this useful post by Pmare4
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Joined: 21/02/2016(UTC) Posts: 219 Location: Just north of London
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Peter
Thanks very much.
Hermann Hirschmann is my grand great father. Some years ago my parents, sister, brother in law, my wife and myself visited Germany and the old family house in Fürth where the business was based. In the photo, the writing on the engine's side provides the name, tel. number and the business address.
Where did you find this information? Did you use the link that Mbarreto provided?
I had one niggly thought about the engine type that Kimball suggested. It is a Wurttemberg produced engine and I just can't see the Bavarians using a non Bavarian made engine, but what do I know (:-))
If I am correct, years ago my father offered a copy of the picture to the Transport Museum in Nurnberg (I guess that this is the museum that you referred to) but they were not interested, can't see any harm checking if they know.
Thanks again to all for the interest and help.
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Joined: 15/10/2015(UTC) Posts: 237 Location: Brisbane, Queensland, Australia
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Hi Collector, You are right in saying the Bavarians would never use an engine from Württemberg - all locos used on the Ludwigsbahn from 1879 onwards came from the Munich firm Maffei. I found all my information at this link : http://www.nuernberginfo...eisenbahn-nuernberg.htmlI am fairly sure that the DB museum in Nürnberg would be more than interested in your photo - you might also like to try contacting the Bavarian Local Railway Association here: http://www.localbahnverein.de/Best regards Peter |
Peter
Collecting vintage Märklin from 1935-1970, also Hornby O Gauge |
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Joined: 18/02/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,334
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In English language, wikipedia also have kind of a summary: https://en.wikipedia.org.../Bavarian_Ludwig_Railway(found it when looking for Bn2t) The perspective of the photo is a bit misleading as it seems the water tanks are longer than in a Maffei Bn2t. Relative to the wheel arrangement Bn2t, can you please explain how it is built? I guess the "t" is for Tank locomotive, and the "B" and "2" one is for the number of wheels and the other for the number of powered wheels. The "n" maybe is for "narrow", but that is in english, so I don't know. Regards, Miguel |
Best regards,
Miguel
Mostly Märklin H0.
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Joined: 15/10/2015(UTC) Posts: 237 Location: Brisbane, Queensland, Australia
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Hi Miguel,
I don't know what a Bn2t is either - I just copied the table off of Wikipedia - although the other website I found lists the locos as follows:
Bavaria bt Maffei
Pegnitz bt Maffei
Franconia bt Maffei
Daniel Ley 1bt Maffei
Johannes Scharrer (II) bt Maffei
Nuremberg-Fürth (II) bt Maffei
Germania 1bt Maffei
Ludwig 1bt Maffei
In these cases, a bt is an 0-4-0 tank, and a 1bt is a 2-4-0 tank.
I would assume that the loco in the photo is not the Bavaria, since for one thing it does not appear to be in steam. The longer tanks suggest it is one of the larger 2-4-0s, as both of the 0-4-0s shown in the photos on Wikipedia have short side tanks. Again I am not an expert so I think a nice email to the DB museum or Bavarian local railway association will be in order...
Best regards
Peter
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Peter
Collecting vintage Märklin from 1935-1970, also Hornby O Gauge |
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 Joined: 18/11/2008(UTC) Posts: 495 Location: Oakville, Ontario
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Originally Posted by: mbarreto
The perspective of the photo is a bit misleading as it seems the water tanks are longer than in a Maffei Bn2t.
Relative to the wheel arrangement Bn2t, can you please explain how it is built? I guess the "t" is for Tank locomotive, and the "B" and "2" one is for the number of wheels and the other for the number of powered wheels. The "n" maybe is for "narrow", but that is in english, so I don't know.
Regards,
Miguel
From the notation in "Taschenbuch Deutsche Dampflokomotiven" (Pocketbook of German Steam Locomotives): B = two driven axles (the letter is always capitalized) n = "Nassdampf", which translates as wet steam, i.e.: not superheated 2 = the number of cylinders, in this case one per side t = couldn't find a definitive definition, but likely means that it is a "Tenderlokomotive" (Tank Engine) Hope this helps, Harold.
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2 users liked this useful post by Crazy Harry
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Joined: 18/02/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,334
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Originally Posted by: Crazy Harry Originally Posted by: mbarreto
...
From the notation in "Taschenbuch Deutsche Dampflokomotiven" (Pocketbook of German Steam Locomotives): B = two driven axles (the letter is always capitalized) n = "Nassdampf", which translates as wet steam, i.e.: not superheated 2 = the number of cylinders, in this case one per side t = couldn't find a definitive definition, but likely means that it is a "Tenderlokomotive" (Tank Engine) Hope this helps, Harold. Thanks a lot! |
Best regards,
Miguel
Mostly Märklin H0.
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Joined: 21/02/2016(UTC) Posts: 219 Location: Just north of London
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Again, thank you very much I will make a contact as suggested and see where it takes me.
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Joined: 21/02/2016(UTC) Posts: 219 Location: Just north of London
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As you were very helpful I want to keep you in the picture.
Sent an email to the Bavarian Local Railway Association but yet no answer. If no reply by the end of the year I will contact the DB Museum.
Thanks again.
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