Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC) Posts: 31,692 Location: United Kingdom
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Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy. |
 5 users liked this useful post by steventrain
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Joined: 01/06/2016(UTC) Posts: 2,465
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Originally Posted by: dickinsonj  That loco along with those coaches will make a very nice, if expensive train. I have to think a bit more before I vote in that poll I have never seen a cab control car for a steam hauled train before. Was that a common practice? I don't understand how you could drive a steam loco remotely from a cab control car but I bet that someone here on the forum can enlighten me.  Found this at Stummis: https://stummiforum.de/v...hp?t=153231&start=50 - post #57 ... "A brief outline of the model: The locomotives were built from 1951 and were actually intended to replace the 78 and 93.5 series. The great success did not materialize, however, and shortly after delivery there was a rework and it remained at just 18 copies, divided into two construction series differing in details. The second series and the last two of the first were retrofitted for reversing train control - the locomotives were always driven with the boiler to the train (otherwise the heater would have an all-round view). They were mainly used in NRW, later in Aschaffenburg for local traffic or light local freight trains. The locomotives were shut down until 1972, although the last one (65 018) is still operational today." Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator
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 2 users liked this useful post by TEEWolf
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Joined: 15/10/2006(UTC) Posts: 2,319 Location: Washington, Pacific Northwest
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Originally Posted by: RayF  It looks beautiful! However, over 400 euro is a lot of money for a tank engine! Does it have a lot of new features?
I'll wait to see if a cheaper version comes out next year, and maybe get one without sound if they do one. Well according to the PDF posted, its got 1) Seperately controlled cab and marker lighting 2) MFX+ sound decoder (so the world of operations stuff) 3) Factory Installed smoke generator (oil Seuthe type I presume) So I'm assuming the additional labor in putting all of that stuff together (labor steps, testing steps) is going to increase the price. I don't care for it as steam is out of my layout theme/era, but the Silberlinge 41275with pre-installed lighting, conducting couplers, and Preisers inside may be worth a purchase, especially given the plain rabbit hutch control cab at the back end. A quick back-of-the-envelope figuring of the cost of a Silberling car (60), conducting couplers (14), LED lights (14) and 8 preisers (8) comes to around €96 so for €100 and not having to put it all together and source it, thats a fair price and doesn't include the other specialties such as conductor in the cab, red rear lighting module, etc. |
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Joined: 01/06/2016(UTC) Posts: 2,465
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 5 users liked this useful post by TEEWolf
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Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,802 Location: Crozet, Virginia
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Originally Posted by: TEEWolf  Thanks - that is cool.  I don't believe that I have ever seen all of the Insider models listed before. |
Regards,
Jim
I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains!
So many trains and so little time. |
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Joined: 18/03/2007(UTC) Posts: 6,764 Location: Brisbane, Australia
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Originally Posted by: dickinsonj  ... I have never seen a cab control car for a steam hauled train before. Was that a common practice? I don't understand how you could drive a steam loco remotely from a cab control car but I bet that someone here on the forum can enlighten me.  Hi, From the early 1930s cab controlled trains with the steam engine pushing the rear of the train, were used in both UK and Germany, and possibly elswhere. In England they are called PUSH-PULL trains. The idea was to operate branch lines without the need to reverse or run the engine around the train. On the outward journey the engine operated normally, hauling at the front of the train, whereas on the return the driver occupied the control cab at the other end of the train with the engine pushing. In Germany such trains were called Wendezug. Here is how the operation with steam worked, relying on the fireman remaining in the loco, while the driver was in the control cab of the train. The control system used was called the Hagenuk-Befehlsgerätes (Hagenuk command unit). Essentially it worked much like the ship's telegraph used in the boiler rooms and on the bridge of ships, relying on through cables or electrical connections between engine and cab. The engineman would send a signal on the Gerät to, for example, close the throttle to 25%. The fireman in the locomotive would see an indicator light up in the cab repeating that message. The fireman would then have to move his indicator to match it, which in turn would be repeated in the control cab. He would then make the necessary adjustments to the controls to fulfill the command. The fireman only worked the throttle wheel and the cut-off control (reverser). The brakes were operated by the engineman in the control cab. Locomotives which had Wendezug capability could be identified mainly by having four brake hoses on the end facing the train, rather than the usual two. Perhaps that is what Maerklin has modelled in this engine. There was also a failsafe in the form of a mechanism which could automatically close the throttle if the message send by the engineman wasn't acknowledged properly. The engineman could then stop the train with the air brakes. The steam loco classes with these controls were BR78, BR38, BR65, BR66 and BR23. There may have been others. Kimball Edited by user 31 May 2018 22:21:08(UTC)
| Reason: added PUSH-PULL sentence |
HO Scale - Märklin (ep II-III and VI, C Track, digital) - 2 rail HO (Queensland Australia, UK, USA) - 3 rail OO (English Hornby Dublo) - old clockwork O gauge - Live Steam 90mm (3.1/2 inch) gauge. |
 3 users liked this useful post by kimballthurlow
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Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,802 Location: Crozet, Virginia
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Originally Posted by: kimballthurlow  Hi, From the early 1930s cab controlled trains with the steam engine pushing the rear of the train, were used in both UK and Germany, and possibly elswhere.
Kimball
As the old saying goes - you learn something new every day! I certainly had never heard of this concept before, even though I now know that Märklin has modeled this before with the BR 23. I can see the utility of a system like that but it seems a bit complex and potentially error prone. Thanks for the info Kimball. That does make this Insider model more interesting to me and perhaps worth the cost, which still seems a bit on the high side. |
Regards,
Jim
I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains!
So many trains and so little time. |
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Joined: 18/01/2016(UTC) Posts: 33 Location: Centurion
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Hi,
My Apologies about the number, a friend had managed to get me confused.
Regards Carsten
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Joined: 01/03/2008(UTC) Posts: 2,883 Location: South Western France
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Originally Posted by: dickinsonj  Originally Posted by: kimballthurlow  Hi, From the early 1930s cab controlled trains with the steam engine pushing the rear of the train, were used in both UK and Germany, and possibly elswhere.
Kimball
As the old saying goes - you learn something new every day! I certainly had never heard of this concept before, even though I now know that Märklin has modeled this before with the BR 23. I can see the utility of a system like that but it seems a bit complex and potentially error prone. Thanks for the info Kimball. That does make this Insider model more interesting to me and perhaps worth the cost, which still seems a bit on the high side. Just FYI, the system was relatively simple. The fireman stayed in the cab at all time taking care of the fire/boiler The engineer , when in the pilot car had control over the brakes and an electro-pneumatic remote system gave him control of the throttle and the cut off /reverse gear. There was an interphone so that they could communicate at all time. This was not entirely new, as it had been used already on the Class 60 ministreamliner+double decker trains of the LBE (Lübeck Buchener Eisenbahn) in the 1930's https://eisenbahnstiftun.../bildergalerie/41587.jpghttps://eisenbahnstiftun.../bildergalerie/41585.jpgHope this helps Jacques |
Jacques Vuye aka Dr.Eisenbahn Once a vandal, learned to be better and had great success! |
 4 users liked this useful post by jvuye
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Joined: 01/03/2008(UTC) Posts: 2,883 Location: South Western France
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Originally Posted by: jvuye  Originally Posted by: dickinsonj  Originally Posted by: kimballthurlow  Hi, From the early 1930s cab controlled trains with the steam engine pushing the rear of the train, were used in both UK and Germany, and possibly elswhere.
Kimball
As the old saying goes - you learn something new every day! I certainly had never heard of this concept before, even though I now know that Märklin has modeled this before with the BR 23. I can see the utility of a system like that but it seems a bit complex and potentially error prone. Thanks for the info Kimball. That does make this Insider model more interesting to me and perhaps worth the cost, which still seems a bit on the high side. Just FYI, the system was relatively simple. The fireman stayed in the cab at all time taking care of the fire/boiler The engineer , when in the pilot car had control over the brakes and an electro-pneumatic remote system gave him control of the throttle and the cut off /reverse gear. There was an interphone so that they could communicate at all time. As Kimball said, this was not entirely new, as it had been used already on the Class 60 ministreamliner+double decker trains of the LBE (Lübeck Buchener Eisenbahn) in the 1930's https://eisenbahnstiftun.../bildergalerie/41587.jpghttps://eisenbahnstiftun.../bildergalerie/41585.jpgHope this helps Jacques |
Jacques Vuye aka Dr.Eisenbahn Once a vandal, learned to be better and had great success! |
 1 user liked this useful post by jvuye
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Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,802 Location: Crozet, Virginia
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Originally Posted by: jvuye  Just FYI, the system was relatively simple. The fireman stayed in the cab at all time taking care of the fire/boiler
The engineer , when in the pilot car had control over the brakes and an electro-pneumatic remote system gave him control of the throttle and the cut off /reverse gear.
There was an interphone so that they could communicate at all time.
Hope this helps
Jacques
Thanks Jacques, I am beginning to see how that system works now. My first impression was based on my privilege of once getting to help drive a real steam loco. Both the fireman and the engineer were very busy manipulating many, many valves and controls for various pumps, compressors and lubricators. It seemed like more than just the fireman could handle on his own. Perhaps in this system the engineer was in the loco cab when things were getting set up and then transferred to the cab control car when the train was moving. At that point the reverse gear and throttle were indeed his main responsibilities. The system obviously worked since it was replicated on other trains in various countries, but until yesterday it was totally unknown to me.  |
Regards,
Jim
I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains!
So many trains and so little time. |
 1 user liked this useful post by dickinsonj
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Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC) Posts: 8,475 Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
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Originally Posted by: Minok  A quick back-of-the-envelope figuring of the cost of a Silberling car (60), conducting couplers (14), LED lights (14) and 8 preisers (8) comes to around €96 so for €100 and not having to put it all together and source it, thats a fair price and doesn't include the other specialties such as conductor in the cab, red rear lighting module, etc.
I'm wondering how many the "numerous Preiser figures" will be. I would hope it will be rather more than 8, even more than 8 per coach. I would be looking for each coach to be at least 1/3 full of figures, preferably nearer 1/2 full. Interstingly one can't get at the PDF brochures from the links Steven provided to the product pages. In the newsletter email it takes you to here for the Marklin one and here for the Trix one.I can't find anything for the coaches beyond the product page that Steven linked to. I am surprised at the dearth of info on these on the pages I linked to above.
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Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,802 Location: Crozet, Virginia
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Originally Posted by: kiwiAlan  I'm wondering how many the "numerous Preiser figures" will be. I would hope it will be rather more than 8, even more than 8 per coach. I would be looking for each coach to be at least 1/3 full of figures, preferably nearer 1/2 full.
I can't find anything for the coaches beyond the product page that Steven linked to. I am surprised at the dearth of info on these on the pages I linked to above.
I think that given a bit more time the Märklin website will have a better listings for these models as well as more detailed images. In the past their product details have improved after a week or so and luckily we have months yet before we make a final decision. I agree that there needs to be a decent number of figures in the coaches and judging by my glass train and Insider VT 95.9 they should be nicely populated. |
Regards,
Jim
I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains!
So many trains and so little time. |
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Joined: 15/10/2006(UTC) Posts: 2,319 Location: Washington, Pacific Northwest
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Originally Posted by: kiwiAlan  Originally Posted by: Minok  A quick back-of-the-envelope figuring of the cost of a Silberling car (60), conducting couplers (14), LED lights (14) and 8 preisers (8) comes to around €96 so for €100 and not having to put it all together and source it, thats a fair price and doesn't include the other specialties such as conductor in the cab, red rear lighting module, etc.
I'm wondering how many the "numerous Preiser figures" will be. I would hope it will be rather more than 8, even more than 8 per coach. I would be looking for each coach to be at least 1/3 full of figures, preferably nearer 1/2 full. Interstingly one can't get at the PDF brochures from the links Steven provided to the product pages. In the newsletter email it takes you to here for the Marklin one and here for the Trix one.I can't find anything for the coaches beyond the product page that Steven linked to. I am surprised at the dearth of info on these on the pages I linked to above. I'd gotten the Kramm newsletter that linked to their image, where it looks like there are around 8-10-ish in each coach just looking through the windows if this pre-production photo is representative, but it could be 15-18 just as easily if there are two figures sitting next to each other in a row because one would occlude the other in the image:  |
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 1 user liked this useful post by Minok
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Joined: 18/03/2007(UTC) Posts: 6,764 Location: Brisbane, Australia
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And these days Wendezug trains are even more prolific, using diesel and electric locomotives. I believe many of the double-decker trains currently in use in Germany and Holland are Wendezug (called push-pull in English). And Maerklin models them all, including in 2013 the rather nice 1950s set the 26577 with the V36 locomootive. I remember in the UK 20 years ago, being quite blown away by the fact that my train was being pushed by an electric loco at 100mph. Phew.... Kimball |
HO Scale - Märklin (ep II-III and VI, C Track, digital) - 2 rail HO (Queensland Australia, UK, USA) - 3 rail OO (English Hornby Dublo) - old clockwork O gauge - Live Steam 90mm (3.1/2 inch) gauge. |
 1 user liked this useful post by kimballthurlow
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Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,802 Location: Crozet, Virginia
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Originally Posted by: kimballthurlow  I remember in the UK 20 years ago, being quite blown away by the fact that my train was being pushed by an electric loco at 100mph. Phew....
Kimball
Yep - the physics just seem wrong to me when pushing a train, although it mostly seems to work. I mostly avoid that with my trains on my layout as well, where it can occasionally cause issues at turnouts and junctions. I don't think that I would like it nearly as much if I were physically inside that train, although some US commuter trains I have ridden were so long that I had no idea where the loco was. |
Regards,
Jim
I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains!
So many trains and so little time. |
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Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,802 Location: Crozet, Virginia
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Originally Posted by:  I think that given a bit more time the Märklin website will have a better listings for these models as well as more detailed images. In the past their product details have improved after a week or so and luckily we have months yet before we make a final decision.
Alan, Märklin has updated their product listing for the loco and more and better detailed images of this very pretty loco are available here: https://www.maerklin.de/...ts/details/article/39650The listing for the coaches is now much better also and is located here: https://www.maerklin.de/...ts/details/article/41275Enjoy!  |
Regards,
Jim
I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains!
So many trains and so little time. |
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Joined: 04/05/2015(UTC) Posts: 777 Location: England, London
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Scuse me for being dumb - I am ready to get my coat. In most of the pictures you see the engine facing forward (pulling) when the train is facing forward and facing backwards (pushing) when the train is going backwards. So this means at the terminus the engine has been reversed. I thought the lack of need or faculties to reverse the engine was one of the main advantages of this system. Treat me gently now.
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Joined: 18/03/2007(UTC) Posts: 6,764 Location: Brisbane, Australia
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For the record, here is the Fleischmann catalogue #1324, which was produced from around 1965. Like the Maerklin model, it was a full die-cast housing and frame, with 8 wheel drive. I would very much like one of these.  Kimball |
HO Scale - Märklin (ep II-III and VI, C Track, digital) - 2 rail HO (Queensland Australia, UK, USA) - 3 rail OO (English Hornby Dublo) - old clockwork O gauge - Live Steam 90mm (3.1/2 inch) gauge. |
 2 users liked this useful post by kimballthurlow
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Joined: 29/11/2009(UTC) Posts: 957 Location: Mount Barker, South Australia
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And here is the Fleischmann BR 65 converted (by John - river6109) from DC analogue to Märklin digital. Running on the old modular layout back in 2013 Thanks John 39650 ordered from Meises ModellbahnCenter....woohoo As far as the price is concerned, have you seen the previous Brawa model's price  , if you can still get it!!! And now a video of three BR tank locos (65, 85 and 81) Enjoy |
Dusan V 'I find your lack of faith (in Märklin) disturbing' |
 3 users liked this useful post by DV
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Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,802 Location: Crozet, Virginia
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Originally Posted by: Rwill  Scuse me for being dumb - I thought the lack of need or faculties to reverse the engine was one of the main advantages of this system. Treat me gently now. Yep - I have exactly the same question after looking at the latest images. I assumed that when the engine was pushing it would be facing away from the coaches, just as it was when it was pulling them. The whole point of this system seems to be to avoid the need to turn the engine when running in the other direction. Is this really how it worked or did someone just screw up when staging the train for these photos? |
Regards,
Jim
I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains!
So many trains and so little time. |
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Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,802 Location: Crozet, Virginia
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Originally Posted by: kimballthurlow  For the record, here is the Fleischmann catalogue #1324, which was produced from around 1965.
Kimball Very pretty - I am a real sucker for the metal boiler bands! Put those on a loco or table lights in a coach and I hooked immediately. |
Regards,
Jim
I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains!
So many trains and so little time. |
 1 user liked this useful post by dickinsonj
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Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC) Posts: 8,475 Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
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Originally Posted by: dickinsonj  Originally Posted by:  I think that given a bit more time the Märklin website will have a better listings for these models as well as more detailed images. In the past their product details have improved after a week or so and luckily we have months yet before we make a final decision.
Alan, Märklin has updated their product listing for the loco and more and better detailed images of this very pretty loco are available here: https://www.maerklin.de/...ts/details/article/39650The listing for the coaches is now much better also and is located here: https://www.maerklin.de/...ts/details/article/41275Enjoy!  Yes, those are the links that Steven posted at the top, and I had already looked at those. I was adding the links to the PDFs of the brochures that were given in the Marklin email newsletter, which I expected to be linked to from at least the loco page. I'm guessing there won't be any change in available information until the next Insider newsletter comes out with its gushing descriptions ...
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Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC) Posts: 15,870 Location: Gibraltar, Europe
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Originally Posted by: dickinsonj  Originally Posted by: Rwill  Scuse me for being dumb - I thought the lack of need or faculties to reverse the engine was one of the main advantages of this system. Treat me gently now. Yep - I have exactly the same question after looking at the latest images. I assumed that when the engine was pushing it would be facing away from the coaches, just as it was when it was pulling them. The whole point of this system seems to be to avoid the need to turn the engine when running in the other direction. Is this really how it worked or did someone just screw up when staging the train for these photos? The photos show the loco pulling the train only. In some it is chimney first and in others it is bunker first. In true push-pull operation the loco might be facing either way depending on when it was last turned, but it would not run round to the other end of the train when it changes direction. |
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
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 1 user liked this useful post by RayF
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Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,802 Location: Crozet, Virginia
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Originally Posted by: kiwiAlan  Yes, those are the links that Steven posted at the top, and I had already looked at those.
Correct - those are Steven's links (Thanks Steven BTW) but when I first followed them there was only one image of the loco and now there are many more, better depicting the details. I never actually see any of their products until I open the box, so when they post better images it is helpful to me. Someone has already posted a link to the brochure, which has just a little more info than the web site, if you haven't looked at that yet. Originally Posted by: kiwiAlan  I'm guessing there won't be any change in available information until the next Insider newsletter comes out with its gushing descriptions ...
I agree. I believe that we now know everything that we will know about this train until some of us see it on our layouts. |
Regards,
Jim
I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains!
So many trains and so little time. |
 1 user liked this useful post by dickinsonj
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Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,802 Location: Crozet, Virginia
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Originally Posted by: RayF  The photos show the loco pulling the train only. In some it is chimney first and in others it is bunker first. In true push-pull operation the loco might be facing either way depending on when it was last turned, but it would not run round to the other end of the train when it changes direction.
Thanks Ray - that makes sense. I like the added flexibility that yields, providing more configurations for this train. The more ways that you can configure and run a train the better I like it. I assume that the coach lights work all of the time, perhaps powered from a slider on the rabbit hutch car. I am also guessing that the drag switch they mention determines the color and configuration of the lights on that coach. People who are already familiar with the other iterations of these coaches no doubt already know those answers. |
Regards,
Jim
I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains!
So many trains and so little time. |
 2 users liked this useful post by dickinsonj
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Joined: 01/03/2008(UTC) Posts: 2,883 Location: South Western France
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Originally Posted by: dickinsonj  Originally Posted by: RayF  The photos show the loco pulling the train only. In some it is chimney first and in others it is bunker first. In true push-pull operation the loco might be facing either way depending on when it was last turned, but it would not run round to the other end of the train when it changes direction.
Thanks Ray - that makes sense. I like the added flexibility that yields, providing more configurations for this train. The more ways that you can configure and run a train the better I like it. I assume that the coach lights work all of the time, perhaps powered from a slider on the rabbit hutch car. I am also guessing that the drag switch they mention determines the color and configuration of the lights on that coach. People who are already familiar with the other iterations of these coaches no doubt already know those answers. Yes the "drag switch" changes the headlights configuration from "heads" to "tails" depending on direction of travel. But it's just that also, a **drag**! On most of my pilot coaches now, I have replaced the drag switch with a function decoder, and even more recently with the ESU digital light system that provides the same function with the light bar as an almost free bonus. I just then "consist" the pilot car decoder adress with the corresponding lok adress. And I would do the same with this BR 65 and its set of Silberlinge. Done! |
Jacques Vuye aka Dr.Eisenbahn Once a vandal, learned to be better and had great success! |
 2 users liked this useful post by jvuye
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Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC) Posts: 15,870 Location: Gibraltar, Europe
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I have several sets of coaches with drag switches for the head and tail light configuration, and find it an adequate solution that does not involve spending more money on function decoders and more time on making the modifications.
Besides, creating a consist is not trivial when controlling with a MS2, and the only way to make it work that I can think of is to disable mfx on the loco and set the same DCC or MM address for both the loco and the function decoder. |
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
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Joined: 04/05/2015(UTC) Posts: 777 Location: England, London
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OK - sorry - dumb question number two.
In the photos Engineer Preiser is sitting in the control car "driving". On the return journey he is still there - shouldn't he have gone back to the engine?
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 1 user liked this useful post by Rwill
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Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC) Posts: 8,475 Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
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Originally Posted by: Rwill  OK - sorry - dumb question number two.
In the photos Engineer Preiser is sitting in the control car "driving". On the return journey he is still there - shouldn't he have gone back to the engine? Err, yes, but they haven't incorporated the disappearing driver technology of the recent br103 ...
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 2 users liked this useful post by kiwiAlan
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Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC) Posts: 15,870 Location: Gibraltar, Europe
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In the UK I've sometimes seen the guard sitting in the rear (unused) cab while he's not out inspecting tickets. You could pretend this is the case in this set! |
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
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 2 users liked this useful post by RayF
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Joined: 04/05/2015(UTC) Posts: 777 Location: England, London
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Originally Posted by: RayF  In the UK I've sometimes seen the guard sitting in the rear (unused) cab while he's not out inspecting tickets. You could pretend this is the case in this set! I guess your right - no need to inspect the tickets - its the same people sitting in the same seats as on the outward journey - in fact on every journey ever!
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 1 user liked this useful post by Rwill
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Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC) Posts: 31,692 Location: United Kingdom
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Originally Posted by: steventrain  Marklin Eurotrain 39273 BR218 Diesel loco 'Betty Boom' RRP 299 EUR due June/July 2018. Real one was seen at outside Goppingen Station Marklin days last September. >IMAGE OF 39273< Now Available. |
Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy. |
 1 user liked this useful post by steventrain
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Joined: 15/10/2006(UTC) Posts: 2,319 Location: Washington, Pacific Northwest
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Originally Posted by: Rwill  OK - sorry - dumb question number two.
In the photos Engineer Preiser is sitting in the control car "driving". On the return journey he is still there - shouldn't he have gone back to the engine? Yes, that is most likely the ideal scenario. Märklin just introduced driver/engineer swapping in last years BR 103 insider model, where the direction change drives motors that raise/hide the respective engineer to be visible on the new front end, and hidden on the new back end based on direction of travel. To do that in this coach would require they implement a similar solution, which is possible but would require some space compromises (need to have a place to hide the torso, or pop up a photo of the empty cab over the window inside. To do that they could: 1) Install a decoder to drive a motor similar to the BR 103 - but then users have to consist the cab to the locomotive (there isn't any auto-consisting technology that I know of yet, though decoders communicating over a common current conducting coupler with locos could auto-pair I suppose). 2) Make the mechanical direction change mechanism also drive the motor (a mechanical wipe determines the motor direction via an optical sensor, that then drives the motor to the other position) Those both add cost and complexity. But would be cool as hell if coupled with the cab lighting on/off capability. Maybe an enterprising modeler could build such a solution. |
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Joined: 27/01/2005(UTC) Posts: 353 Location: Taipei,
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Quote:Quote:Yes, that is most likely the ideal scenario. Märklin just introduced driver/engineer swapping in last years BR 103 insider model, where the direction change drives motors that raise/hide the respective engineer to be visible on the new front end, and hidden on the new back end based on direction of travel.
To do that in this coach would require they implement a similar solution, which is possible but would require some space compromises (need to have a place to hide the torso, or pop up a photo of the empty cab over the window inside. To do that they could: 1) Install a decoder to drive a motor similar to the BR 103 - but then users have to consist the cab to the locomotive (there isn't any auto-consisting technology that I know of yet, though decoders communicating over a common current conducting coupler with locos could auto-pair I suppose). 2) Make the mechanical direction change mechanism also drive the motor (a mechanical wipe determines the motor direction via an optical sensor, that then drives the motor to the other position)
Those both add cost and complexity. But would be cool as hell if coupled with the cab lighting on/off capability. Maybe an enterprising modeler could build such a solution. Toys of tin and wood rule! Your solution is absolutely available but I prefer to seeing more steamer features like movable inner cylinder or smoking from chimney and cylinder synchrized with sound effect. ROCO has made it on BR85. I recognised Marklin tried to make innovation on MRR but some developments were strange and difficultly understood. For example Lint led screen door showed a movie of door opening to replace real mechanical function. 39170 BR103 drivers appearance and disappearance in 90 angle spinning was another.
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Joined: 01/06/2016(UTC) Posts: 2,465
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Originally Posted by: shannon  Your solution is absolutely available but I prefer to seeing more steamer features like movable inner cylinder or smoking from chimney and cylinder synchrized with sound effect. ROCO has made it on BR85.
I recognised Marklin tried to make innovation on MRR but some developments were strange and difficultly understood. For example Lint led screen door showed a movie of door opening to replace real mechanical function. 39170 BR103 drivers appearance and disappearance in 90 angle spinning was another.
Well that's life. I agree with Märklin. First of all they are offering a loco and not funny gimmicks. In my opinion these are all unnecessary. Important is the design, finish and running of a loco for a reasonable price. The price for a BR 65 is not reasonable. But if you read the interview of Mr. Sieber jr. in the Insider News you know why. They keep the club fees low although costs are increasing. Well, just get 20 € more for an new Insider loco and you cover all Insider cost increases. Even the sound I do not see only positiv. I always shut it off after a short time. I do not need this noise all the time at home. Running three or four locos at the same time with a noisy sound is driving me crazy. By the way, why don't you buy the Roco loco, if they offer your prefernces and Märklin not? Also you get the ability writing in a Roco and not in a Märklin community, if someone for Roco does exist?
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 3 users liked this useful post by TEEWolf
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Joined: 10/08/2009(UTC) Posts: 3,443
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Originally Posted by: kimballthurlow  For the record, here is the Fleischmann catalogue #1324, which was produced from around 1965. Like the Maerklin model, it was a full die-cast housing and frame, with 8 wheel drive. I would very much like one of these.  Kimball Dear Kimball, Note Fleischmann 1165 is the AC version with Marklin couplings and cabin number 64 018 in DB colors. The 65 018 is still in operation by the SSN in Rotterdam,no longer wearing the DB logo's. https://www.reynaulds.co...ts/Consignment/1165.aspxCheers, Paul. Edited by user 09 June 2018 14:35:19(UTC)
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Have more than you show,speak less than you know (Shakespeare). |
 3 users liked this useful post by NS1200
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Joined: 27/01/2005(UTC) Posts: 353 Location: Taipei,
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Originally Posted by: TEEWolf  Originally Posted by: shannon  Your solution is absolutely available but I prefer to seeing more steamer features like movable inner cylinder or smoking from chimney and cylinder synchrized with sound effect. ROCO has made it on BR85.
I recognised Marklin tried to make innovation on MRR but some developments were strange and difficultly understood. For example Lint led screen door showed a movie of door opening to replace real mechanical function. 39170 BR103 drivers appearance and disappearance in 90 angle spinning was another.
Quote: if you read the interview of Mr. Sieber jr. in the Insider News you know why. They keep the club fees low although costs are increasing. Well, just get 20 € more for an new Insider loco and you cover all Insider cost increases. Marklin keep the club fees low but raise the price of locos gradually. M also release the insider locomotive with different item number or different era or painting scheme in turn for outsider. Eventually, Marklin will earn the costs back and make revenue. Quote:By the way, why don't you buy the Roco loco, if they offer your prefernces and Märklin not? Also you get the ability writing in a Roco and not in a Märklin community, if someone for Roco does exist? ROCO, Marklin or any other manufacturers have their exclusive advantages. I buy marklin and play with it as i appreciate metal bodyshell and boiler drive which marklin insists on. Also i appreciate Roco's advantages like delicate details and innovations. Comparing to advantages of other brands and improving oneself's shortage would be more progressive and competitive. Isn't it ?
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Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,802 Location: Crozet, Virginia
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Originally Posted by: shannon  Your solution is absolutely available but I prefer to seeing more steamer features like movable inner cylinder or smoking from chimney and cylinder synchrized with sound effect. ROCO has made it on BR85.
I recognised Marklin tried to make innovation on MRR but some developments were strange and difficultly understood. For example Lint led screen door showed a movie of door opening to replace real mechanical function. 39170 BR103 drivers appearance and disappearance in 90 angle spinning was another.
I have the 39170 and although that driver change feature is interesting IMO it is definitely not one of its must have attributes. I feel the same way about the powered pantographs. They are interesting but I don't really care if my electric locos have that feature or not. I think the challenge for Märklin is to show innovations such as these but not try to put everything that they can imagine into one model, because then it would cost so much that none of us would want one. I agree that the money is better spent on features such as the ones for steamers which you suggest Shannon. My Big Boy has its operating sounds synchronized with cylinder movement and it is 17 years old!  However it is not a must have feature either for me, even though it is nice. I think the money is well spent on the new BR 85 to provide the nicely detailed open boiler cradle at the front, the lanterns on the cylinder housings, a clear view through the cab and the cab lighting. |
Regards,
Jim
I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains!
So many trains and so little time. |
 1 user liked this useful post by dickinsonj
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Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,802 Location: Crozet, Virginia
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There is an interesting development related to my access to the second Insider model, although I don't know what it means.
The two large North American online dealers where I normally buy my Insider models do not list either the 39650 or 41275. One dealer has never listed any of the second 2018 Insider models. The other dealer first listed them without prices, later added prices for the Märklin and TRIX versions but then removed all four items from their website. I had been under the impression that all MHI dealers had to sell the Insider models but maybe I am misinformed. Perhaps they will be listed again in the future, closer to the order deadline. While the one dealer listed them, their price was pretty high, being just 5% below full Märklin retail, which is more than I have paid in the past.
It will be weeks yet until I will have the order form, which both dealers require, so I could not order them at this point anyway, but it seems odd that they are not yet listed at either dealer. |
Regards,
Jim
I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains!
So many trains and so little time. |
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Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC) Posts: 8,475 Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
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Originally Posted by: dickinsonj  There is an interesting development related to my access to the second Insider model, although I don't know what it means.
The two large North American online dealers where I normally buy my Insider models do not list either the 39650 or 41275. One dealer has never listed any of the second 2018 Insider models. The other dealer first listed them without prices, later added prices for the Märklin and TRIX versions but then removed all four items from their website. I had been under the impression that all MHI dealers had to sell the Insider models but maybe I am misinformed. Perhaps they will be listed again in the future, closer to the order deadline. While the one dealer listed them, their price was pretty high, being just 5% below full Märklin retail, which is more than I have paid in the past.
It will be weeks yet until I will have the order form, which both dealers require, so I could not order them at this point anyway, but it seems odd that they are not yet listed at either dealer. They don't need the order form, they only need your membership number and the three digit 'security' code on your membership card, and they can go online at Marklin and order it for you. It's time to educate your dealer.
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Joined: 05/12/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,802 Location: Crozet, Virginia
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Originally Posted by: kiwiAlan  They don't need the order form, they only need your membership number and the three digit 'security' code on your membership card, and they can go online at Marklin and order it for you.
It's time to educate your dealer.
No way - I spend all my time sucking up to them, hoping to just get some Märklin stuff actually delivered. For about the last year everything I want is either already sold out or can be ordered and who has any clue when it will actually be built. And the Insider form doesn't really matter at this point because neither site lists them for sale now, which is odd. I just scan and attach an image of the form and there is a nice paper trail on the order that we can all follow. Oh well - I think it is just Märklin trying to help a long time customer reduce his MRR costs by making things very hard to buy. My asset manager thanks them. |
Regards,
Jim
I have almost all Märklin and mostly HO, although I do have a small number of Z gauge trains!
So many trains and so little time. |
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Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC) Posts: 31,692 Location: United Kingdom
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I have complete watch DVD bonus - Insider Tour Dresden from Insider package 3/2018.
Marklin HO production mamager Karl-Heinz Gräßle was included the tour was just looking at the Prototype Turntable but he walk away while filming point at him.
It could be Marklin production own new HO turntable in the future? |
Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy. |
 2 users liked this useful post by steventrain
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Joined: 25/12/2010(UTC) Posts: 274
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I can't remember one thing, why some DB locomotive has white lettering for the numbers and some other (like the insider model) golden? |
Ep. III (My layout is set in 1962).
I collect mainly DSB, DB and SBB but I'm quite... Open minded.
I'm quite a big collector of NOHAB lok :) |
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Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC) Posts: 31,692 Location: United Kingdom
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Prototype image of 37797 and 39046 in 2018 new items brochure. Now Marklin database update new image of models. >37797< >39046< |
Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy. |
 4 users liked this useful post by steventrain
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Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC) Posts: 31,692 Location: United Kingdom
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Marklin for Eurotrain. 47544 OnRail Bogie tank wagon. price and Date unknown.  |
Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy. |
 4 users liked this useful post by steventrain
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Joined: 18/10/2012(UTC) Posts: 1,404
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Originally Posted by: steventrain  Marklin for Eurotrain. 47544 OnRail Bogie tank wagon. price and Date unknown.  Hi, when are the fall items for 2018 get announced? |
Marklin and Piko era 4 SNCB , Marklin wagons Wiking model car Fan Faller fan including car system Instagram: marklin1978 Wiking fan
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 1 user liked this useful post by danmarklinman
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Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC) Posts: 31,692 Location: United Kingdom
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Originally Posted by: danmarklinman  Originally Posted by: steventrain  Marklin for Eurotrain. 47544 OnRail Bogie tank wagon. price and Date unknown.  Hi, when are the fall items for 2018 get announced? End of August or early September. |
Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy. |
 2 users liked this useful post by steventrain
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Joined: 01/06/2016(UTC) Posts: 2,465
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 5 users liked this useful post by TEEWolf
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Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC) Posts: 31,692 Location: United Kingdom
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Starter Set.
29013 BR74 with Two 4-wheels coaches (base on 4314), Oval of C- tracks and MS2 - RRP EUR 269 Delivery Due October 2018. |
Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy. |
 1 user liked this useful post by steventrain
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