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Offline kgsjoqvist  
#1 Posted : 24 November 2008 12:32:33(UTC)
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kgsjoqvist

Sweden   
Joined: 04/06/2002(UTC)
Posts: 754
Location: Täby
Checking out the news from Uhlenbrock I noticed that Intellibox Basic has a USB-interface, not a serial port (as IB IR). The USB is also presented on Intellibox II - so it seams to be a natural step away from serial ports that are not available on new computers anyway.

Considering the falling price of IB Basic I started considering if this could be an alternative to CS or other full-fetured fancy controllers.

Does anyone know if the most common software (Railroad & Co etc) support Intellibox by USB connection? It says in the brochures from Uhlenbrock that any software that supports LocoNet will be able to use the USB port.

I realize that IB Basic doesn't have any s88 connection, but are there alternative solutions that could be used through LocoNet? Of course I could use the LDT HSI-88 interface to get feedback to the computer, but that means a big investment as well. As far as I can see, the IB Basic doesn't need a separate computer interface, and it can programm all the other LocoNet devices as well...

An even cheaper way to connect a PC would be the LocoNet interface and then a LocoNet adapter to the Märklin 6021 that I already have, but there are still some features missing in that setup.
K-G / H0 and Z model train user
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Offline kgsjoqvist  
#2 Posted : 26 November 2008 15:01:16(UTC)
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kgsjoqvist

Sweden   
Joined: 04/06/2002(UTC)
Posts: 754
Location: Täby
To keep this topic alive I answer my own question:

It seems like the USB connection of the Intellibox Basic will include a computer interface - just like Intellibox II. This was not the original plan, where the Basic was presented without interface.

http://forum.rocrail.net/viewto...56dcd26d5650b5706ae2d2f

In some aspects it is a better interface than the full-featured IB, since serial ports are not common on laptops at least.

The feedback can be provided through LocoNet, which is a cheaper and more reliable way than s88. A 6021 system can also be connected through LocoNet, with the added benefit that it can be located in another place than the IB. The only question is if the software will support this setup...

I know there are other ways to hook up a computer directly to the layout, but I want to have manual control as well. Some days I don't feel like starting the computer. But other days it would be nice... The LocoNet offers a few more features, like adding a separate switchboard or the Intellilight system.
K-G / H0 and Z model train user
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Offline DasBert33  
#3 Posted : 26 November 2008 15:50:30(UTC)
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DasBert33

Belgium   
Joined: 21/01/2004(UTC)
Posts: 1,272
My initial tought would be that the USB port will pop up as a virtual COM port on your PC and that you can still use old PC programs the way you always have, only at a faster baudrate. This is just my best guess.

So yes, if you do not want manual control it IB basic could be an alternative. If you like to do things by hand, it is a different story.

Bert
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Offline kgsjoqvist  
#4 Posted : 26 November 2008 16:27:47(UTC)
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kgsjoqvist

Sweden   
Joined: 04/06/2002(UTC)
Posts: 754
Location: Täby
Quote:
[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by DasBert33
<br />My initial tought would be that the USB port will pop up as a virtual COM port on your PC and that you can still use old PC programs the way you always have, only at a faster baudrate. This is just my best guess.

So yes, if you do not want manual control it IB basic could be an alternative. If you like to do things by hand, it is a different story.

Bert



The IB has 2 control knobs, so manual control is there, as well as a keyboard with 8 addresses immediately available. I doubt very much that a USB connection would show up as a COM port in the computer, but that's a future problem anyway. I suppose the recent software has support for the USB LocoNet interface, and that it also works with an Intellibox connected by USB.
K-G / H0 and Z model train user
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Offline DasBert33  
#5 Posted : 26 November 2008 17:19:56(UTC)
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DasBert33

Belgium   
Joined: 21/01/2004(UTC)
Posts: 1,272
I would doubt Uhlenbrock spent a lot of time in developing the IB basic, it is supposed to be an IB with less features. Thats why I stated that I think they used an USB-RS232 conversion chip in their update. Those chips are easily available, dirt cheap and don't require a lot of work. But all the better for you, since it will be immediately compatible with almost all known programs.

And yes it has controlknobs, but the switch/keyboard control is not very userfriendly, it has only Mot14 support, just 4+1 functions, a crappy display...

Bert
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Offline kgsjoqvist  
#6 Posted : 27 November 2008 12:05:41(UTC)
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kgsjoqvist

Sweden   
Joined: 04/06/2002(UTC)
Posts: 754
Location: Täby
Quote:
[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by DasBert33
<br />I would doubt Uhlenbrock spent a lot of time in developing the IB basic, it is supposed to be an IB with less features. Thats why I stated that I think they used an USB-RS232 conversion chip in their update. Those chips are easily available, dirt cheap and don't require a lot of work. But all the better for you, since it will be immediately compatible with almost all known programs.

And yes it has controlknobs, but the switch/keyboard control is not very userfriendly, it has only Mot14 support, just 4+1 functions, a crappy display...

Bert


Since the IB Basic is not available yet, I will just have to wait and see. But in the Uhlenbrock 2009 it says that it is a good choice if you don't use automated functions (routes) or do it through the computer. So the connectivity is a reason to look in this direction.

I agree the user interface is 1990's compared to CS2, but the price is 1/3. Also the LocoNet feedback modules are cheaper than s88, so the economy is a good reason for me. I don't have locos with many functions and for future upgrades I will use LokPilot decoders anyway. The modular approach makes it a bit easier to justify each purchase as well.

One nice upgrade in IB lately is that each Intellibox (Basic, IR or IB II) can also be used as a slave throttle and a booster. This eliminates the need for IB-Control (which is now discontinued). It also means if you buy an IB Basic it can be used as a throttle if you choose to upgrade later on.

The display is simple, but serves it's purpose. If you use it with a computer, the computer screen is bigger and more useful anyway. For a graphic switchboard, I think I can make a better one on the computer, and with LocoNet I can even connect a "real" switchboard...

But of course a CS2 can do things without the need of a computer that the IB can't...
K-G / H0 and Z model train user
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Offline Lars Westerlind  
#7 Posted : 06 December 2008 18:45:56(UTC)
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Lars Westerlind


Joined: 19/10/2001(UTC)
Posts: 2,379
Location: Lindome, Sweden
I still can't see why I should spend the 2/3 for a screen which still is far less attractive from the one I have on my laptop. From a technical view I think IB Basic is a good component giving LocoNet life. IMHO it's a pity that so much effort on the market has been spent on builing fancy monolites; reminds me on IBM 360 and such... And the worst thing is that when the major wendors focus on such things, the market tends to do that as well. But Uhlenbrock does have a part in that: The Intellibox I was extremely competetent at that time and included at least 3-4 Märkling boxes in it's functionality...
/Lars
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Offline kgsjoqvist  
#8 Posted : 07 December 2008 12:41:35(UTC)
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kgsjoqvist

Sweden   
Joined: 04/06/2002(UTC)
Posts: 754
Location: Täby
Quote:
[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by Lars Westerlind
<br />I still can't see why I should spend the 2/3 for a screen which still is far less attractive from the one I have on my laptop. From a technical view I think IB Basic is a good component giving LocoNet life. IMHO it's a pity that so much effort on the market has been spent on builing fancy monolites; reminds me on IBM 360 and such... And the worst thing is that when the major wendors focus on such things, the market tends to do that as well. But Uhlenbrock does have a part in that: The Intellibox I was extremely competetent at that time and included at least 3-4 Märkling boxes in it's functionality...
/Lars


Another thing is that when you have a small/mediumsized layout at home, the Intellibox has a smaller "footprint" - you may attach it to the corner of the baseboard. A Central Station attached to the layout is a very eye-catching piece. And carrying it around is not an attractive option.

For typical use on my layout there will be a need for 2 control knobs at the time. While it may be convenient to have a larger keyboard as well, it is not my prime concern. Automated control of signals is probably the first thing I'll try to implement through LocoNet.
K-G / H0 and Z model train user
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