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K Track Wide Radius Turnouts and Double Slip Switch Question
Joined: 17/08/2016(UTC)
Posts: 147
Location: Europe
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Hi All,
Last time I built a layout it was all M-Track.
For the next layout I have decided to go with K-Track.
So a while ago I ordered some wide radius turnouts and a double slip switch to see what they are like.
I noticed that the switch rails are silver painted plastic. With M-Track these were metal (with C-Track track turnouts they are made of metal as well??)
Does anyone know if there are older versions of these turnouts where they are made of metal or has this moving part always been made of (cheap) plastic? |
DRG/DB/SBB Epoche II/III/IV |
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 Joined: 10/02/2006(UTC) Posts: 3,997
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 Joined: 21/05/2004(UTC) Posts: 1,768 Location: Brisbane, Queensland
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I don't believe they are painted plastic?!? Rails are stainless steel and need to be for electrical conductivity.
I will check mine tonight, maybe I miss-understand what you are referring to. |
modelling era IIIa (1951-1955) Germany |
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 Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC) Posts: 1,730 Location: Toronto
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K track are a pain to assemble, but are made of metal.
What makes you think they are made of plastic?
While we are at it, do NOT discount the C track line; it is made of plastic, not cheap plastic however, and they work very well.
I used to dislike C track, in favour of M track, until I saw how easily C track comes together and they are smoother than M track. However, K track is smoother.
Bottom line: if you do not need to, stay away from K track.
I use K track in order to have both Marklin and 2 rail trains run on them. Otherwise, I would not.
(C track would need some cutting on the underside and M track does not work for 2 rail DC/DCC.) |
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Joined: 21/05/2004(UTC) Posts: 1,768 Location: Brisbane, Queensland
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The level of realism achievable with K track ballast and in particular with the flex track leaves the rest for dead though. |
modelling era IIIa (1951-1955) Germany |
 4 users liked this useful post by applor
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Joined: 17/08/2016(UTC)
Posts: 147
Location: Europe
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Originally Posted by: applor  I don't believe they are painted plastic?!? Rails are stainless steel and need to be for electrical conductivity.
I will check mine tonight, maybe I miss-understand what you are referring to. I am only referring to the parts that move, i.e. those rails that switch, not the rest of the track |
DRG/DB/SBB Epoche II/III/IV |
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Joined: 17/08/2016(UTC)
Posts: 147
Location: Europe
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Originally Posted by: baggio K track are a pain to assemble, but are made of metal.
What makes you think they are made of plastic?
While we are at it, do NOT discount the C track line; it is made of plastic, not cheap plastic however, and they work very well.
I used to dislike C track, in favour of M track, until I saw how easily C track comes together and they are smoother than M track. However, K track is smoother.
Bottom line: if you do not need to, stay away from K track.
I use K track in order to have both Marklin and 2 rail trains run on them. Otherwise, I would not.
(C track would need some cutting on the underside and M track does not work for 2 rail DC/DCC.) The part of the wide radius turnout that moves is PLASTIC at least in the CURRENT version of the turnout. I seriously dislike the look of C-track. Way too dark and not in the slightest bit realistic looking (although they look better than M-Track) |
DRG/DB/SBB Epoche II/III/IV |
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Joined: 21/05/2004(UTC) Posts: 1,768 Location: Brisbane, Queensland
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Originally Posted by: Collector Originally Posted by: applor I don't believe they are painted plastic?!? Rails are stainless steel and need to be for electrical conductivity.
I will check mine tonight, maybe I miss-understand what you are referring to. I am only referring to the parts that move, i.e. those rails that switch, not the rest of the track Oh, you are referring to the tongue? I think that would be to maintain electrical isolation between the two rails (since the rails on the wide radius turnouts are isolated) The wide radius turnouts were introduced in the 90's I believe? I imagine they would have always been that way. I do know that earlier wide radius turnouts had a moveable frog which was changed to being fixed later on due to problems. If it is a type of plastic I would think it is solid and not painted and that it isn't something to be concerned about? |
modelling era IIIa (1951-1955) Germany |
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Joined: 17/08/2016(UTC)
Posts: 147
Location: Europe
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Originally Posted by: applor Originally Posted by: Collector Originally Posted by: applor I don't believe they are painted plastic?!? Rails are stainless steel and need to be for electrical conductivity.
I will check mine tonight, maybe I miss-understand what you are referring to. I am only referring to the parts that move, i.e. those rails that switch, not the rest of the track Oh, you are referring to the tongue? I think that would be to maintain electrical isolation between the two rails (since the rails on the wide radius turnouts are isolated) The wide radius turnouts were introduced in the 90's I believe? I imagine they would have always been that way. I do know that earlier wide radius turnouts had a moveable frog which was changed to being fixed later on due to problems. If it is a type of plastic I would think it is solid and not painted and that it isn't something to be concerned about? With M-Track the tongue was metal and I suspect it also is metal on C-Track turnouts, but I don't have any C-Tack turnouts to confirm this. I guess I just don't like the idea of a flimsy plastic moveable part. I can't see it last under heavy use. At least not nearly as long as a metal piece because it is pretty thin. Hence I was wondering if older versions might have been made of metal and the plastic current version was the result of some cost cutting.... |
DRG/DB/SBB Epoche II/III/IV |
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Joined: 04/12/2013(UTC) Posts: 2,261 Location: Hobart, Australia
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Originally Posted by: baggio K track are a pain to assemble, but are made of metal.
What makes you think they are made of plastic?
"K" = "Kunststoff", and they are.
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Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC) Posts: 1,730 Location: Toronto
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"K" = "Kunststoff", and they are.  |
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Joined: 09/11/2013(UTC) Posts: 335 Location: Toronto, Canada
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Originally Posted by: baggio K track are a pain to assemble, but are made of metal.
What makes you think they are made of plastic?
While we are at it, do NOT discount the C track line; it is made of plastic, not cheap plastic however, and they work very well.
I used to dislike C track, in favour of M track, until I saw how easily C track comes together and they are smoother than M track. However, K track is smoother.
Bottom line: if you do not need to, stay away from K track. I have to disagree with this statement, Baggio. Yes, they are a bit more complex to assemble, but as Applor pointed out, the aesthetic value is well worth it. If you need to frequently take your layout apart, then maybe M or C is better for you, but otherwise K track is definitely worth consideration. Originally Posted by: Collector I guess I just don't like the idea of a flimsy plastic moveable part. I can't see it last under heavy use. At least not nearly as long as a metal piece because it is pretty thin.
Hence I was wondering if older versions might have been made of metal and the plastic current version was the result of some cost cutting.... In the current versions (last 15 years or so) the frog is no longer a moving part. I haven't seen any issues with them likely because of the fact they are static.  Originally Posted by: baggio "K" = "Kunststoff", and they are. "Kunstoff" = "Plastic" in German. Just to clarify, the "sleeper" covers are plastic, but the rails and underside of the track are metal |
My Layout Build | Märklin CS3+ | K-track | Merkur | Viessmann | LDT | iTrain | Modeling primarily DB EpIV-VI
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1 user liked this useful post by Roland
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Joined: 17/08/2016(UTC)
Posts: 147
Location: Europe
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Sorry for the confusion. I have no problem with the fact the sleepers are plastic. See the arrows in the picture point to the plastic pieces of track I am talking about.  |
DRG/DB/SBB Epoche II/III/IV |
1 user liked this useful post by Collector
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Joined: 09/11/2013(UTC) Posts: 335 Location: Toronto, Canada
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Originally Posted by: Collector
Sorry for the confusion. I have no problem with the fact the sleepers are plastic.
See the arrows in the picture point to the plastic pieces of track I am talking about.
Ah my mistake! Those are definitely metal. Just tested to be certain. For anyone wondering, I was referring to the "frog" which was a moving part until approximately 15-16 years ago. You can see in the above images what it looks like today.  |
My Layout Build | Märklin CS3+ | K-track | Merkur | Viessmann | LDT | iTrain | Modeling primarily DB EpIV-VI
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 Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC) Posts: 8,475 Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
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Originally Posted by: Roland Originally Posted by: Collector
Sorry for the confusion. I have no problem with the fact the sleepers are plastic.
See the arrows in the picture point to the plastic pieces of track I am talking about.
Ah my mistake! Those are definitely metal. Just tested to be certain. For anyone wondering, I was referring to the "frog" which was a moving part until approximately 15-16 years ago. You can see in the above images what it looks like today. If the points have a four digit catalogue number then they have the moving frog. The problem with this is the plastic mechanism under the point to move it doesn't do a very good job and is easily jammed with dust or grit. So Marklin came out with the same geometry point without the moving frog. This item has a five digit catalogue number, and it would be more like 25 years ago it was introduced. I am very surprised if the moving track pieces are now plastic, that would create real problems even for Marklin locos traversing the point. It sounds to me more like there has been a disconnect between the moving blades and the fixed rails.
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Joined: 09/11/2013(UTC) Posts: 335 Location: Toronto, Canada
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Originally Posted by: kiwiAlan Originally Posted by: Roland Originally Posted by: Collector
Sorry for the confusion. I have no problem with the fact the sleepers are plastic.
See the arrows in the picture point to the plastic pieces of track I am talking about.
Ah my mistake! Those are definitely metal. Just tested to be certain. For anyone wondering, I was referring to the "frog" which was a moving part until approximately 15-16 years ago. You can see in the above images what it looks like today. If the points have a four digit catalogue number then they have the moving frog. The problem with this is the plastic mechanism under the point to move it doesn't do a very good job and is easily jammed with dust or grit. So Marklin came out with the same geometry point without the moving frog. This item has a five digit catalogue number, and it would be more like 25 years ago it was introduced. I am very surprised if the moving track pieces are now plastic, that would create real problems even for Marklin locos traversing the point. It sounds to me more like there has been a disconnect between the moving blades and the fixed rails. My 22715 and 22716 are less than a year old (ordered from my dealer via Märklin, Germany) and those pieces are metal (and connected to the outer rails). But even if they were plastic, axles will still be in contact with one of the outer rails so I'm curious problems you're concerned about? |
My Layout Build | Märklin CS3+ | K-track | Merkur | Viessmann | LDT | iTrain | Modeling primarily DB EpIV-VI
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Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC) Posts: 1,730 Location: Toronto
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My experience with K track turnouts has not been good - they do not offer a smooth movement of the locos/wagons; DC locos in particular, but also Marklin locos.
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Joined: 17/08/2016(UTC)
Posts: 147
Location: Europe
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Originally Posted by: Roland Originally Posted by: Collector
Sorry for the confusion. I have no problem with the fact the sleepers are plastic.
See the arrows in the picture point to the plastic pieces of track I am talking about.
Ah my mistake! Those are definitely metal. Just tested to be certain. For anyone wondering, I was referring to the "frog" which was a moving part until approximately 15-16 years ago. You can see in the above images what it looks like today. How did you test that? I could swear that the ones I looked at were plastic. The had bit of a metallic silver paint look. I am on a trip so I can't get my hands on them at the moment. |
DRG/DB/SBB Epoche II/III/IV |
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Joined: 09/11/2013(UTC) Posts: 335 Location: Toronto, Canada
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Originally Posted by: baggio My experience with K track turnouts has not been good - they do not offer a smooth movement of the locos/wagons; DC locos in particular, but also Marklin locos. I'm not sure we can expect non-Märklin locos and rolling stock to operate flawlessly on Märklin track... but I would be curious what Märklin items you had problems with. I assume it was only with specific items? Could you share details? Sorry if this is straying a bit off the original topic but this is useful information for anyone interested in these turnouts. Originally Posted by: Collector How did you test that? I could swear that the ones I looked at were plastic. The had bit of a metallic silver paint look.
I am on a trip so I can't get my hands on them at the moment. You're right - they do look a bit like painted plastic so I used an ohmmeter to be sure. Unless Märklin used a current conducting paint... |
My Layout Build | Märklin CS3+ | K-track | Merkur | Viessmann | LDT | iTrain | Modeling primarily DB EpIV-VI
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1 user liked this useful post by Roland
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Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC) Posts: 1,730 Location: Toronto
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Originally Posted by: Roland I'm not sure we can expect non-Märklin locos and rolling stock to operate flawlessly on Märklin track... but I would be curious what Märklin items you had problems with. I assume it was only with specific items? Could you share details? 1. We are comparing Marklin turnouts - specifically C track and K track. I have found little problems with C track turnouts when running Marklin locos or wagons, both Marklin and 2 rail. With K track, it's the opposite. In fact, if I can avoid using a K track turnout I will do so. 2. I can't remember exactly the Marklin locos that had a problem with them; I think it was the 3000 or maybe the 30000 (in analogue) or both. However, I am pretty sure there were others, otherwise I would not feel so disappointed with K track turnouts. 3. I don't think that there is any real difference between HO Marklin and HO Roco (DC or DCC) when it comes to being able to navigate turnouts. 4. K track - all of it- is hard to assemble but also not very good to re-use. I mean, the second or third time you have assembled and disassembled K track, the joints become too loose, the lines are no longer perfectly straight and are prone to come apart. This has been my experience with K track; I plan to use it only to run on them both DCC and Marklin locos. If I could avoid it, I would. If your experience has been better than mine, that's good for you.  |
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Joined: 04/05/2015(UTC) Posts: 777 Location: England, London
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My layout splits in the middle with a conversion track the newer C track section came about simply because I bought that MS2 starter kit that includes MS2/power pack/control box plus an oval of C track so I have used C track for the new side. I am equally happy and unhappy with both and would agree with many of the opinions raised above however nothing has ever really overcome the issue of turnout motors on both K and C track. If I were starting again from scratch I would somehow procure a large quantity of K track old style turnouts 2261/2260 with built in point motors and use K track throughout. The old dears are almost indestructible and any problem is solved with a squirt of contact cleaner. The wide radius double switch k track (2270 I recall) which needs two turnout motors and decoder slots I still find a bit of a handful. My befuddled brain still cant quite intuitively get the settings, little kofs etc have a habit of stalling unless the base is perfectly flat and of course the are two 7491's to go wrong and maintain.
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Joined: 09/11/2013(UTC) Posts: 335 Location: Toronto, Canada
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Originally Posted by: baggio Originally Posted by: Roland I'm not sure we can expect non-Märklin locos and rolling stock to operate flawlessly on Märklin track... but I would be curious what Märklin items you had problems with. I assume it was only with specific items? Could you share details? 1. We are comparing Marklin turnouts - specifically C track and K track. I have found little problems with C track turnouts when running Marklin locos or wagons, both Marklin and 2 rail. With K track, it's the opposite. In fact, if I can avoid using a K track turnout I will do so. 2. I can't remember exactly the Marklin locos that had a problem with them; I think it was the 3000 or maybe the 30000 (in analogue) or both. However, I am pretty sure there were others, otherwise I would not feel so disappointed with K track turnouts. 3. I don't think that there is any real difference between HO Marklin and HO Roco (DC or DCC) when it comes to being able to navigate turnouts. 4. K track - all of it- is hard to assemble but also not very good to re-use. I mean, the second or third time you have assembled and disassembled K track, the joints become too loose, the lines are no longer perfectly straight and are prone to come apart. This has been my experience with K track; I plan to use it only to run on them both DCC and Marklin locos. If I could avoid it, I would. If your experience has been better than mine, that's good for you. 2. Interesting. 3000 is a fairly common loco so I would expect to have come across more complaints here on the forum if it had issues on these turnouts. Was your issue relating to power? Or possibly derailment? I'll do some testing when I get a chance to see if I experience any issues with a 3000. 4. As mentioned I agree - you have to be very careful when assembling and disassembling K-track. From an assembly perspective, M and C are much easier to work with for temporary layouts. |
My Layout Build | Märklin CS3+ | K-track | Merkur | Viessmann | LDT | iTrain | Modeling primarily DB EpIV-VI
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Joined: 17/08/2016(UTC)
Posts: 147
Location: Europe
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Originally Posted by: Roland Originally Posted by: baggio My experience with K track turnouts has not been good - they do not offer a smooth movement of the locos/wagons; DC locos in particular, but also Marklin locos. I'm not sure we can expect non-Märklin locos and rolling stock to operate flawlessly on Märklin track... but I would be curious what Märklin items you had problems with. I assume it was only with specific items? Could you share details? Sorry if this is straying a bit off the original topic but this is useful information for anyone interested in these turnouts. Originally Posted by: Collector How did you test that? I could swear that the ones I looked at were plastic. The had bit of a metallic silver paint look.
I am on a trip so I can't get my hands on them at the moment. You're right - they do look a bit like painted plastic so I used an ohmmeter to be sure. Unless Märklin used a current conducting paint... Thanks for the comments. When I am back I will try and scratch it a bit to make sure. I would not be surprised if they indeed did use current conducting paint. |
DRG/DB/SBB Epoche II/III/IV |
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Joined: 21/05/2004(UTC) Posts: 1,768 Location: Brisbane, Queensland
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Just checked mine with an ohmmeter as well, definitely metal. They might be aluminium? |
modelling era IIIa (1951-1955) Germany |
1 user liked this useful post by applor
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K Track Wide Radius Turnouts and Double Slip Switch Question
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