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Offline baggio  
#1 Posted : 16 February 2016 21:56:52(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,730
Location: Toronto
Hello, Everyone:

I realize that that K track can be used for the dual purpose of running Marklin and 2 rail trains. However, for reasons I discussed in another discussion, I don't like K track and in any event not all parts of it and certainly not all turnouts can be used for dual usage.

As a result, I ask:

Would it not be nice if Marklin made a series call "D track" where all the components could be used for running both Marklin and Trix/2 rail trains? BigGrin

I doubt there is any real impediment in having this type of dual track ballasted (if that is the technical word) so that it would look like C track. So WHY is Marklin not doing it?

Any feedback or thoughts on point would be welcome.
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Offline kiwiAlan  
#2 Posted : 16 February 2016 22:25:29(UTC)
kiwiAlan

United Kingdom   
Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC)
Posts: 8,463
Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post
Hello, Everyone:

I realize that that K track can be used for the dual purpose of running Marklin and 2 rail trains. However, for reasons I discussed in another discussion, I don't like K track and in any event not all parts of it and certainly not all turnouts can be used for dual usage.

As a result, I ask:

Would it not be nice if Marklin made a series call "D track" where all the components could be used for running both Marklin and Trix/2 rail trains? BigGrin

I doubt there is any real impediment in having this type of dual track ballasted (if that is the technical word) so that it would look like C track. So WHY is Marklin not doing it?

Any feedback or thoughts on point would be welcome.


You can run C track as a two rail track by cutting the straps underneath that connect the two rails together.

However I don't know how one would get on with the points. A study of a Trix point would probably be worth while to see what has been done there.

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Offline RayF  
#3 Posted : 16 February 2016 23:09:15(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,870
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
One of the big advantages of the 3 rail system is the increased electrical contact provided. This would be cancelled out by isolating the two running tracks from each other.

Another reason for not making the track common to both types is that once you put a 3 rail train on it the two running tracks would be shorted together through the train's wheels, thereby possibly overloading a two rail supply which may have been left connected across the two outer rails.

In my opinion it's best to choose one system and stick to it, or have two separate track layouts, one for 3 rail and the other for 2 rail.
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
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Offline kimballthurlow  
#4 Posted : 16 February 2016 23:35:46(UTC)
kimballthurlow

Australia   
Joined: 18/03/2007(UTC)
Posts: 6,763
Location: Brisbane, Australia
The idea of mixed 2 rail and 3 rail goes back a long way.

Trix Twin in the UK did it, and so did VB in France.
In each case one rail was common, the other two rails (or pukos) were separate circuits.

Turnouts were designed to accomodate this circuitry.

regards
Kimball
HO Scale - Märklin (ep II-III and VI, C Track, digital) - 2 rail HO (Queensland Australia, UK, USA) - 3 rail OO (English Hornby Dublo) - old clockwork O gauge - Live Steam 90mm (3.1/2 inch) gauge.
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Offline H0  
#5 Posted : 17 February 2016 00:02:58(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,441
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: RayF Go to Quoted Post
This would be cancelled out by isolating the two running tracks from each other.
No, you have to make the connection with the feeder track.

A three-rail train in a section wired for two-rail will set the controller to STOP. This shouldn't damage the controller.

I would be interested in C track for dual operation. This would require modified turnouts only - I can live with cutting the connections between the outer rails.

This would make transition to non-Märklin two-rail systems more easy - and I think this is why Märklin will not make such a track.
If it was a backdoor for Märklin to sell more products to two-rail fans who still have old Märklin locos from their childhood days, then it would be profitable for Märklin.

Just guessing - market research has to determine if it was profitable for Märklin in the long run.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
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Offline baggio  
#6 Posted : 17 February 2016 01:58:42(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,730
Location: Toronto
Originally Posted by: kimballthurlow Go to Quoted Post
The idea of mixed 2 rail and 3 rail goes back a long way.

Trix Twin in the UK did it, and so did VB in France.
In each case one rail was common, the other two rails (or pukos) were separate circuits.
Kimball


Can you give us some particulars as to whether these tracks are still being made? Thanks.
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Offline witzlerh  
#7 Posted : 17 February 2016 02:03:33(UTC)
witzlerh

Canada   
Joined: 25/09/2010(UTC)
Posts: 417
Location: Sherwood Park, AB, Canada
I also am considering running 2 and 3 rail on the same track. Currently I have two separate loops but I have on Lok and another one coming that will switch between 2 and 3 rail. (ESU Engineering edition)

I know that I cannot run 3 rail cars and loks on 2 rail but I can run 2 rail cars on 3 rail. ( I have a bunch of Trix cars)

Yes you can lay a bunch of Marklin C track down and isolate one rail and have a master switch to either send power to the center or side rail.

The issue is the C track turn outs. The Trix C-track has better frog and point rail isolators and that is the key. If we want, we can cut isolators in the rails and power feeder bars in the ballast.

In Marklin's defense, they rather have a rugged track system rather than one can can be accidentally lose connection to make the 1-3% of us that want both 2 AND 3 rail happy.

I looked at it a few years ago but after watching some guys in my club go through the work of hand laying track...I think I can modify the switches to dual power....but on a permanent layout! The wiring will be extensive....

There will also be logistical challenges...making sure no Marklin 3 rail goes onto 2 rail. Trix cars can easily go on both 2 and 3 rail. But that is the fun.
Harald
CS2 DB & Canadian Era 3-6
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Offline baggio  
#8 Posted : 17 February 2016 02:09:43(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,730
Location: Toronto
Originally Posted by: witzlerh Go to Quoted Post
I know that I cannot run 3 rail cars and loks on 2 rail but I can run 2 rail cars on 3 rail. ( I have a bunch of Trix cars)


I do just that with K track. It's just I don't like K tracks - see my posts in another discussion on point. If you like I can give you a complete run down on how to do it. Just send me a PM. BigGrin
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Offline Bigdaddynz  
#9 Posted : 17 February 2016 03:00:28(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,769
Location: New Zealand
Personally, I think this would over complicate what is an easy to understand system. Better to stick with dedicated 3 and 2 rail systems.
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Offline kimballthurlow  
#10 Posted : 17 February 2016 04:06:02(UTC)
kimballthurlow

Australia   
Joined: 18/03/2007(UTC)
Posts: 6,763
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: kimballthurlow Go to Quoted Post
The idea of mixed 2 rail and 3 rail goes back a long way.

Trix Twin in the UK did it, and so did VB in France.
In each case one rail was common, the other two rails (or pukos) were separate circuits.
Kimball


Can you give us some particulars as to whether these tracks are still being made? Thanks.


Hi Baggio,

They are both available on eBay.
They were both made as late as the 1950s.

Trix Twin tracks were VERY course, rails approx 1/5" high.

VB are only available generally on eBay France, they are really well made, similar to Marklin M track.
In my opinion, they were a better quality (realism, components, materials), and probably more expensive at the time.
Not cheap even now.

I use the VB tracks for running old Hornby Duble (UK) model trains.
In modern digital models, I have both 2 and 3 rail, but I buy separate Trix C and Marklin C tracks for the purpose.

regards
Kimball
HO Scale - Märklin (ep II-III and VI, C Track, digital) - 2 rail HO (Queensland Australia, UK, USA) - 3 rail OO (English Hornby Dublo) - old clockwork O gauge - Live Steam 90mm (3.1/2 inch) gauge.
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Offline NZMarklinist  
#11 Posted : 17 February 2016 05:06:03(UTC)
NZMarklinist

New Zealand   
Joined: 15/03/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1,757
Location: Auckland NZ
Sorry if I sound too matter of fact but I think the answer is no.

For those that must have a dual system, it can be done with K Track as evidenced by ETE SF who have a Marklin day and a DCC day on their modular layout, alternately at some shows, Euro West at least Wink

As for C Track, it's not impossible to modify but for the general public let's keep it simple, there's Marklin tracks for three rail and Trix for two rail ! That's it ThumpUp
Glen
Auckland NZ

" Every Marklin layout needs a V200, a Railbus and a Banana car", not to mention a few Black and red Steamers, oh and the odd Elok !

CS1 Reloaded, Touch Cab, C Track Modules, K track layout all under construction. Currently Insider
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