 Joined: 09/07/2012(UTC) Posts: 66 Location: Leicestershire
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The coaches in these sets look very short to me, giving a toy train impression. Are they to scale, or have they been truncated for the model?
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 Joined: 14/01/2006(UTC) Views messages in topic : 1,802 Location: Wurttemberg
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Joined: 15/09/2014(UTC) Posts: 682 Location: London
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This is the prototype:  At a first glance, the coaches do seem to be much shorter than conventional, loco-hauled TEE coaches. I think you can find the measurements of the entire Br 601 unit on Wikipedia. Carim
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Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,442
Location: DE-NW
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Hi! Originally Posted by: ciderglider  Are they to scale, or have they been truncated for the model? The length of a seven-piece train is 130 m. For the model we have 347 mm + 246 mm. That pretty exactly 1:220. I think the cars of the Senator are even shorter. |
Regards Tom --- "In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS  |
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 Joined: 04/12/2013(UTC) Posts: 2,261 Location: Hobart, Australia
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Originally Posted by: ciderglider The coaches in these sets look very short to me, giving a toy train impression. Are they to scale, or have they been truncated for the model? see next post
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Joined: 04/12/2013(UTC) Posts: 2,261 Location: Hobart, Australia
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 9 users liked this useful post by PJMärklin
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Joined: 09/07/2012(UTC) Posts: 66 Location: Leicestershire
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Thank you all for your helpful replies. Were the coaches short to cope with the loading gauge on the routes where these units ran, or was there another reason?
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Joined: 04/12/2013(UTC) Posts: 2,261 Location: Hobart, Australia
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Originally Posted by: ciderglider Thank you all for your helpful replies. Were the coaches short to cope with the loading gauge on the routes where these units ran, or was there another reason? Hello again CG, see : " http://germanrail.fr.yuk...c/515#.VljgB8rfJOg" : (that's: " fr.yuku.com/topic/515# ") comment by Jurgen Kleylein : "The reason the prototype VT11.5 cars are so short is that the train was designed for the coaches to be as wide as possible to enhance comfort for the passengers, and the only way the coaches could be made that wide was to make them short so they would stay inside the clearance diagram on curves." Regards, PJ
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1 user liked this useful post by PJMärklin
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Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC) Posts: 8,464 Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
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2 users liked this useful post by kiwiAlan
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Joined: 09/07/2012(UTC) Posts: 66 Location: Leicestershire
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Originally Posted by: PJMärklin Originally Posted by: ciderglider Thank you all for your helpful replies. Were the coaches short to cope with the loading gauge on the routes where these units ran, or was there another reason? Hello again CG, see : " http://germanrail.fr.yuk...c/515#.VljgB8rfJOg" : (that's: " fr.yuku.com/topic/515# ") comment by Jurgen Kleylein : "The reason the prototype VT11.5 cars are so short is that the train was designed for the coaches to be as wide as possible to enhance comfort for the passengers, and the only way the coaches could be made that wide was to make them short so they would stay inside the clearance diagram on curves." Regards, PJ Apologies for the tardy reply, but many thanks for answering my question. And thanks for posting the excellent photos of the prototype and your layout. I'm jealous of the turquoise/cream Postwagen in one of your photos, which sadly is not available in Z scale.
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2 users liked this useful post by ciderglider
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 Joined: 15/05/2003(UTC) Posts: 173 Location: Cherry Hill, NJ
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Outstanding information on a wonderful train. Thank you PJMarklin!
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1 user liked this useful post by bgemski
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Joined: 02/10/2013(UTC) Posts: 842 Location: West Texas
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Hello. Hope all is well. Trainini did an article about the TEE back in Feb 2014, page three. I could not find an international version of this publication. I think they didn’t have the English versions until 2015. https://www.raildig.com/...014/trainini-2014-02.pdfIt has a few photos too. Great unit, I ran into one in Stuttgart in the 80s. Impressive for certain such a different shape!  Take good care.
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 Joined: 20/02/2017(UTC) Posts: 298 Location: Flanders!
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Originally Posted by: Zme Hello. Hope all is well. Trainini did an article about the TEE back in Feb 2014, page three. I could not find an international version of this publication. I think they didn’t have the English versions until 2015. https://www.raildig.com/...014/trainini-2014-02.pdfIt has a few photos too. Great unit, I ran into one in Stuttgart in the 80s. Impressive for certain such a different shape! Take good care. Isn't this the turbo version?
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Joined: 23/05/2021(UTC) Posts: 252 Location: England, Guildford
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Do you mean Gas Turbine?
ChrisG
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Joined: 02/10/2013(UTC) Posts: 842 Location: West Texas
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Hello, hope all is well.
I remember being surprised to discover this beauty, and likely only have this one photo. I will have to check. Had I known this was the only one I would ever see, I would have take more. If I had just caught the name, it would be easy to figure out what kind of model this is.
I recall watching it pulling out of the station. It was very quite, you hardly knew it was moving away. Could this be a turbine model, sorry I don't know.
Take good care, if I find another photo, I will post it.
Dwight
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Joined: 23/05/2021(UTC) Posts: 252 Location: England, Guildford
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 The gas turbine (class 602) had larger air intakes, I think your one was a 601 Diesel. ChrisG
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3 users liked this useful post by Mman
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Joined: 02/10/2013(UTC) Posts: 842 Location: West Texas
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Hello, hope all is well. I did find another photo, not the best, but you can get a sense of how high the engineer was when operating this locomotive. This is when it was pulling out. Red lights are on. Definitely not a turbine as you can see the intake is missing compared to what is shown above. A 601?  Nothing like the bygone days. Take good care. Dwight
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1 user liked this useful post by Zme
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Joined: 20/02/2017(UTC) Posts: 298 Location: Flanders!
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Turbine, had those scopes, indeed!
very special MU!
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1 user liked this useful post by parakiet
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Joined: 23/05/2021(UTC) Posts: 252 Location: England, Guildford
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I believe they ran some consists with a Diesel 601 one end for slow running and a 602 Gas Turbine the other which would kick in for high speed running.
ChrisG
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1 user liked this useful post by Mman
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Joined: 20/02/2017(UTC) Posts: 298 Location: Flanders!
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1 user liked this useful post by parakiet
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Joined: 02/10/2013(UTC) Posts: 842 Location: West Texas
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Thank you everyone,
I have a growing admiration for this locomotive, it does look fantastic.
I looked it up on EBay and discovered in z scale the one being offered sells for $450.00. Must be popular among collectors. Maybe I will keep an eye on this.
Does anyone know the minimum radius this one can handle?
Take good care.
Dwight
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Joined: 20/02/2017(UTC) Posts: 298 Location: Flanders!
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It has boogies, so I would say 195mm. 220mm for sure
I have a non-working eBay one.. needs some work..
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1 user liked this useful post by parakiet
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Joined: 09/07/2012(UTC) Posts: 66 Location: Leicestershire
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I have finally managed to get hold of an 8873 set. Unfortunately it didn't come with the instruction sheet. So I am not sure how the couplings work, and am worried about damaging them. Do they just push together and pull apart?
Also, it seems that both power cars have a motor.Why did Marklin do this? I guess there must be a good reason for them as it would have made the set more expensive.
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Joined: 26/07/2021(UTC) Posts: 635 Location: Sydney
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The TEE I think is similar to the original ICE, I have 3 sets. The TEE has a shorter coupling than the ICE. The ICE always picks up power from the leading loco. If you reverse the train, the other end picks up power. The problem is with the fickle electrical connections along the train set, 8 contacts per carriage x however many carriages plus another 4 connections for each of the 2 locos. So on a full length ICE with 14 carriages & 2 locos that is 120 electrical connections. It's a recipe for disaster. Basically no power to the trailing loco. To overcome this problematic resistance of supplying power to the trailing loco, is to solder a bit of wire to bypass the diodes in both locos. Works really well. The only potential issue is if you are running block sections or dead sections in platforms or yards, you have to make sure the dead section is long enough for the entire train length. ICE example both locos powering themselves independently:  ICE.mov (2,462kb) downloaded 171 time(s).
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2 users liked this useful post by Toosmall
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Joined: 19/06/2023(UTC) Posts: 3 Location: Louisiana, Natchitoches
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I own an 8873 TEE set and supplemental cars that was in storage for years. I recently got it out and sent the two locomotives out for servicing and they now run great. Until, of course, I connect everything all together (5 cars, plus the locomotives). I then run into the "recipe for disaster" electrical connection issues. I have at least two bad couplers and cannot locate replacements.
I have a question regarding the soldering wires fix for this problem. As a person with pretty limited soldering skills, how likely is it I will render a locomotive non-operational? I did manage to solder a lead onto a 8839 signal light without issue. And if I do this successfully, will the lights still reverse with direction?
Any guidance here would be welcome. Very nice layout in that ICE video, too, BTW
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Joined: 02/10/2013(UTC) Posts: 842 Location: West Texas
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Hello, hope all is well, welcome to this forum. The TEE is an impressive set for certain, but is prone to connective issues. I am sorry, but I do not have this train but I have experience with my ICE 3. There has been numerous accounts of the TEE set not working, and most of the time, it because of the connectors between the wagons. Since yours has been in storage for a time, it is possible your connectors are dirty or damaged. They really are fragile and should be examined and cleaned or replaced. Just a slight bend in the copper will cause issues. I had the same problem with my ICE and once replaced the set worked well. I am certain you will be satisfied to replace the connectors before trying this wiring task. I know, your skills with the soldering iron are much better than mine. For me, this would be far too risky, especially if the correct part is in fact available. If this does not work, then soldering the wires may be your last resort. Here is a link to the connectors which I believe will work. Check with the seller, Frank, to confirm this is the correct item before purchasing. These are fragile items and it is common for them to be damaged. Note the discussion on this site. https://zscalehobo.com/marklin/213702.htmlI am certain I have seen this type of item listed on eBay. Use the search Marklin TEE. Best wishes with your TEE it is a great set. I know there are discussions on the problems with this set, but could not find them right now. Z Train Weekly had this: http://ztrainsweekly.com...marklin-z-repair-notes/. Scroll down, it has the ICE photo images, but the principle is basically the same. If you search on YouTube you might also find something. Take good care. Dwight Edited by user 03 October 2023 00:21:22(UTC)
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Joined: 02/10/2013(UTC) Posts: 842 Location: West Texas
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Joined: 20/02/2017(UTC) Posts: 298 Location: Flanders!
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I "scored" a TEE set with extension on fleabay. Contemplating to shortcut the diodes and run a wire to distribute the electricity.
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Joined: 19/06/2023(UTC) Posts: 3 Location: Louisiana, Natchitoches
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My TEE set is old enough that it uses the couplers that are no longer available.... Mȁrklin part # 452540/e452540. The ones in the image below are bad. If anyone has experience with that bypass the diodes fix, I'd love to hear about it. There's some good directions available on Do It Yourself in Z Scale
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Joined: 09/07/2012(UTC) Posts: 66 Location: Leicestershire
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Are the couplings on the 8873 unit compatible with those on the later 87932 units?
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